18th Asian Games - Indonesia (August 18- September 2, 2018)

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  • eycharboieycharboi Smile lang lagi :) PEx Expert ⭐⭐⭐⭐
    Juico should have lobbied those 5 before the deadline. Simple. Unless there's some extension from Jakarta which is unlikely I guess.

    @pinoyathletics, you have any idea when is the draw lots for team sports?
  • pinoyathleticspinoyathletics ATFS Statistician PEx Veteran ⭐⭐
    edited July 2018
    eycharboi said:
    Juico should have lobbied those 5 before the deadline. Simple. Unless there's some extension from Jakarta which is unlikely I guess.

    @pinoyathletics, you have any idea when is the draw lots for team sports?
    Initially June 15 was the deadline, but Juico had it extended to June 30. As 3 Filams did not yet have passports. Only 1 of the 3 filams was able to secure a passport with the extended time. So i think t he other 4 athletes were locals. At a guess Bautista, Ubas, Medina and Lopena and 1 Fil-Heritage athlete. I am quite sure Juico lobbied before the deadline.

    The qualifying criteria for Asian Games was initially supposed to be Gold/Silver SEA Games or beat 4th place of the last Asian Games. I believe the Filam met those criteria but was not accredited on time as she only recently secured her passport. 

    The other athletes above did not meet that criteria. This is probably why the PATAFA only initially endorsed 8. The fact Volleyball which didnt make the above criteria probably had a lot of sports leaders wondering what was going on? Because they adhered to the guidelines in place.

    I am a big critic of the PATAFA. But we have to look at numbers and be realistic here. 

    That's why I say letting the Volleyball team in vs Francis Medina perhaps who is ranked 10th in the 400 Hurdles in Asia. This might be seen as kind of a bit harsh on individual sports.

    And if Medina runs all out in the heats could scrape through last into the final. Medina looked good for bronze last SEA Games as he had the fastest time in the heats but he pulled his hamstring in the finals.


  • gotta lick itgotta lick it Member PEx Influencer ⭐⭐⭐
    eycharboi said:
    Juico should have lobbied those 5 before the deadline. Simple. Unless there's some extension from Jakarta which is unlikely I guess.

    @pinoyathletics, you have any idea when is the draw lots for team sports?
    typical noypi, last minute rush or .....



    they were to distracted by the volleyball brouhaha.
  • eycharboieycharboi Smile lang lagi :) PEx Expert ⭐⭐⭐⭐
    THIS IS EXCITING: Draw lots of team sports to be held today!

    The draw for seven team sports at the 18th Asian Games will take place on Thursday, July 5 in the latest milestone on the road to the opening ceremony on August 18.

    The draws for rugby sevens, handball, sepak takraw, volleyball, water polo, basketball and football will be held at the JS Luwansa Hotel and Convention Centre in Jakarta under the supervision of the Olympic Council of Asia.

    http://aroundtherings.com/site/A__63921/Title__All-eyes-on-COR-in-womens-basketball-draw-for-Asian-Games/292/Articles
  • pinoyathleticspinoyathletics ATFS Statistician PEx Veteran ⭐⭐
    eyecharboi

    This is the final list i was CC. by the Taskforce. I also graphed. With Womens Volleyball and Softball (asian champions) their is now 54% men and 46% women comprising the total number of athletes. Maybe we can argue Volleyball Women's was included to establish gender equality in the team?

    These officials which are 1 for every 4.3 athlete are just the coaches. These officials are officials from NSAs and do not include POC and PSC Officials, Medical staff, Masseurs, etc.

    https://pinoyathletics.info/2018-asian-games-final-team-list-for-the-philippines/
  • pinoyathleticspinoyathletics ATFS Statistician PEx Veteran ⭐⭐
     As you know im probably PATAFA biggest critic. But in all fairness. When the PATAFA sticks to the selection methodology and hence only submits 8 names. Only to find out Volleyball is lobbying for a team that did not even win a medal at SEA Games. I mean in fairness to all sports if Volleyball is being sent to the sea games and its 4th at the SEA Games. All teams and individual athletes who finished with bronze medals should have been allowed a slot first dont you think.

    Volleyball 4th at SEA Games included, about 6-10 athletes from Athletics who got bronze at SEA Games not included.

    This is what im getting at consistency in the selection process.

    This is the original Selection guidelines as of December 4, 2017




  • goodpersongoodperson Member Volleyball Vanguard
    Anyway my balita ka ba sa mga nagbronze na yun? Baka naman injured? Or they did not performed well in their off season tourneys?

    Pero dapat kasama talaga sila.

    But if poc/psc will shoulder the expenses baka dun sila nadali? Since ang wvb e hindi sakop ng poc/psc ang budget nila.

    Kung may insider ka, siguro you should ask kung bakit hindi nagrereklamo ang patafa and other NSAs. Baka may criteria na hindi innaanounce sa media. Like kung may sponsor at hindi naman malala ang standing e kayang bigyan ng reconsideration?
  • gotta lick itgotta lick it Member PEx Influencer ⭐⭐⭐
    hindi ba ma-blacklisted ang Gilas sa Asiad dahil sa brawl sa FIBA Asian World Cup Qualifiers?


    eycharboi said:
    THIS IS EXCITING: Draw lots of team sports to be held today! 

    The draw for seven team sports at the 18th Asian Games will take place on Thursday, July 5 in the latest milestone on the road to the opening ceremony on August 18.

    The draws for rugby sevens, handball, sepak takraw, volleyball, water polo, basketball and football will be held at the JS Luwansa Hotel and Convention Centre in Jakarta under the supervision of the Olympic Council of Asia.

    http://aroundtherings.com/site/A__63921/Title__All-eyes-on-COR-in-womens-basketball-draw-for-Asian-Games/292/Articles 
    hindi kasama ang W Softball? bakit???
  • eycharboieycharboi Smile lang lagi :) PEx Expert ⭐⭐⭐⭐
    Looks like Gilas' Asiad chances will largely depend on the decision of FIBA.

    For women's softball, we have a team going there. But I believe there are less than 8 teams competing so no need for drawing of lots.
  • eycharboieycharboi Smile lang lagi :) PEx Expert ⭐⭐⭐⭐
    edited July 2018
    RESULT OF DRAWING OF LOTS FOR 7 TEAM SPORTS

    I'll only include the ones where Team PH is competing

    BASKETBALL MEN

    Group A: South Korea, Mongolia, Indonesia, Thailand.
    Group B: Iran, Philippines, Syria, United Arab Emirates.
    Group C: Japan, Qatar, Chinese Taipei, Hong Kong.
    Group D : Kazakhstan, China, Palestine.

    VOLLEYBALL WOMEN

    Group A: Indonesia, Thailand, Japan, Hong Kong, Philippines.
    Group B: South Korea, China, Chinese Taipei, Kazakhstan, Vietnam, India.

    SEPAK TAKRAW MEN'S REGU

    Group A: Indonesia, Singapore, Philippines, Pakistan. 
    Group B: South Korea, China, India, Nepal.

    SEPAK TAKRAW MEN'S TEAM DOUBLE

    Group A: Indonesia, Vietnam, Japan, Philippines.
    Group B: Thailand, Laos, Malaysia, Myanmar.

    http://aroundtherings.com/site/A__63931/Title__COR-makes-debut-in-Asian-Games-draw/292/Articles

  • pinoyathleticspinoyathletics ATFS Statistician PEx Veteran ⭐⭐
    Please note that Weightlifting under its President Monico Puentevella and PATAFA under its President Philip Ella Juico appealed and wrote to the POC several times about inclusion of more athletes. While i am a big critic of PATAFA, i kind of feel the athletes were hard done by. I was talking to Anfernee Lopena last night who was a bronze medalist in the Mens 4x100 and the team broke the record. The appeal on July 4 was denied.

    From Juicos perspective about appealing for 5 extra athletes i can see where he is coming from on this. Because originally the taskforce under CDM Julian Camacho said only sea games gold and silver, and 4th place in asian games or pass 4th place in asian games will be approved (how ej and mariz got in) thats why Juico only gave in 8 names, cause he was following the guidelines.

    Then all of a sudden when Peping Cojuanco is voted out, there is a new CDM Richard Gomez Gomez decides to allow the womens VB Team to join Asian games despite only finishing 4th in the sea games (they were 8th in the asian champs last year also but they hosted so it gave them a bit of an advantage, on the world rankings they are about 13th in asia).

    So Juico, pushed first for 11, then 7 then 5 athletes with all appeals turned down. the point i'm seeing is that the problems arises when CDM Richard Gomez allowed Volleyball to join asian games without meeting the guidelines and then enforcing the guidelines on all other sports. if a 4th placer at sea games is allowed to join asian games.

    The problem with allowing a 4th place SEA Games team to join even with self-funding.

    Is why do the Guidelines apply for some sports and not others such as Volleyball. I mean if its a self-funding issue. Im quite sure as PATAFA is now tied up with Ayala Corp. They can if needed self fund its Bronze medalists from SEA Games to Asian Games.

    If we are consistent in selection. Then all the bronze medalists from every other sport should have been ahead in the queue to join Asian Games than the Women's Volleyball team.
  • goodpersongoodperson Member Volleyball Vanguard
    Well i guess they should lodge a protest or inquiry why there are inconsistencies.

    Maybe nobodys questioning gomez kaya may inconsistencies. Somebody should voice out.

    At this point ba pwede pa ba magdagdag ang ibanh NSAs? I mean in shape pa ba yung mga idadagdag nila. Baka kasi hindi na sobrang intense ng training nila since naleft out sila sa ipapadala?
  • gotta lick itgotta lick it Member PEx Influencer ⭐⭐⭐
    ^ ikaw nah ang mag-protest.

    so agree ka nah? they prioritized a mediocre and hype volleyball team rather than the qualified national and not commercial players?
  • pinoyathleticspinoyathletics ATFS Statistician PEx Veteran ⭐⭐
    I will spell this out simply. Bronze medalists at SEA Games in all sports should be ahead of inclusion than 4th placers.
  • goodpersongoodperson Member Volleyball Vanguard
    Im sorry hindi talaga ko bilib sa patafa. Naungusan na sila ng vietnam. Baka sa sa susunod cambodia at timor leste na. Mind you waal namn 10 year no foreign exposure ang athletics di gaya ng vb pero pababa pa rin ang medals na nabibigay. May ayala pala silang sponsor bat ganun ng improvement? di ba naaabutan yung ibang athletes? Coaches at training facilited dapat kasi dapat yung pinapaimprove hindi players. Walang ripple effect pag sa isang palyer lang ginagamit ang fund. Saklap pa e andaming filforeign recruits na hindi naman dito sa pinas nakatira. E pano mapapasa yang natutunan nila sa ibang bansa.

    ----
    If youve seen inconsistencies. Then voice it out. As far as im concern single athlete lahat yan hindi team sports. They can lobby for them.

    Hindi na problema ng vb kung makupad ang patafa magreklamo.


    Baka naman kasi yung bronze medalist na yun kapag asian records na e from number 3 sa seag e pagdating sa asian records e nasa 50+ na? Jk.
    ------

    If people here are just bitter with vb players getting slots in asian games. Di ko na problema yun. Ive raised my points here. Nothings gonna happen if you will just whine it out in the net. Hindi naman net savy yung mga hukluban sa psc at poc at mabasa nila hinaing niyo.

    At bat naman ako magrereklamo kay goma apra sa patafa? E yubg vb nga e ayos lang kung di masali.

    Jusko ilang taon ng sinusuportahan ng psc ang athletics. Pababa pa rin ang gold medal production nila. Ibigay na sa ibang sports ang pera kung walang dulot naman yung federasyon na yan. Mismanaged yang  sports na yan. 

     Nabibitteran na ko sa ibang forumers dito sa thread. Bye.


  • pinoyathleticspinoyathletics ATFS Statistician PEx Veteran ⭐⭐
    edited July 2018
    Im not talking about Fil-Foreign recruits. FYI there were 2 fil-foreign recruits in the PATAFA who got Gold in the SEA Games Beram and Cray. Apart from that no other individual bronze medalists. All the excluded bronze medalists were local athletes in Athletics. But if we make a list of bronze medalists at SEA Games across all sports we are probably talking 60-70 athletes. And its not just talking in the net. Alot of people did alot of lobbying and appealing but it fell on deaf ears.
  • survivorleosurvivorleo High Flyer Clay Court Specialist
    i get that there are inconsistencies in the criteria that was placed for qualification, but it just leaves a really bitter taste that you are directing your ire at the Volleyball team, when it is obviously POC who is at fault here. i mean, members of that team are also just athletes who want the opportunity to compete, to get international exposure, and represent the country, just as any other athlete from any other sport. i wouldn't blame them if they tried to lobby as hard as they could to compete at the Asian Games, even if they weren't initially qualified based on the criteria that was set.

    kapag team sports kasi it's either you're in or wala kang representation at all eh. so i think dapat iba ang sinet na qualifications for team and individual sports. 

    now, i do not know why the POC decided to refuse any more athletes from Athletics. personally, i wish there were more players competing. pati sa Swimming, kasi 'yan ang "centerpiece" sports sa mga ganyang meet and it would be nice if we were well-represented. also, disappointing that there aren't more Weightlifting athletes. dapat after the Olympic silver ginawa nang priority sport 'yan. but it's just hard to get behind the anger towards the Volleyball team and pitting NSAs against each other.
  • bolickylickybolickylicky Member PEx Expert ⭐⭐⭐⭐
    so the SEA Age Group swimming championship just ended yesterday held in los banos laguna...grabe na inimprove ng Vietnam sa swimming when 6-10 yrs ago eh hirap sila maka-medal sa Sea games swimming events...now they've produced a world class swimmer in Nguyen Thi Anh Vien, and they still got talented young swimmers in their pipeline...ano na ginagawa ng local swimming NSA natin??? kung hindi sa mga Fil-Foreign recruits natin waley...nakakahiya.


  • mightymaroon108mightymaroon108 Member 🦅 Eagle Squad🏅
    vietnam's sports program is miles ahead than us...sad to say hanggang politics ang umiiral dyan sa atin e waley talaga..
  • pinoyathleticspinoyathletics ATFS Statistician PEx Veteran ⭐⭐
    I'm not directing my ire to the athletes directly. Its more towards the selectors for not approving candidates.  Theoretically Volleyball finished 8th at the Asian Champs when we hosted in 2017, which is its strongest selection point. So does that mean any other athlete that got Top 8 at an asian championship meet should also be included by selectors?

    Some facts about SEA Age Grade champs in swimming

    • Vietnam had more Golds than all other teams put together 58 vs 47 for all other teams
    • Vietnam had more Total Medals 119 than the next best two teams put together Thailand and Indonesia that had 107
    • Philippines had 4 of 105 medals being the host that is 3.8% of all the golds
    • Philippines had 30 of 316 of total medals or 9.4% of all total medals

    In 2017 the Philippines had 4 Gold, 9 Silver, 8 Bronze = 21 total medals.

    Vietnams improvement
    2016 39 gold, 39 silver, 27 Bronze = 105 Medals Total
    2017 51 Gold, 27 silver, 13 Bronze = 91 Medals Total
    2018 58 Gold, 39 silver, 22 Bronze = 119 Medals Total

    While the Philippines got more total medals at host, and equaled its Gold count from last year. Vietnam every year is increasing it number of golds.




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