If I were not a Catholic

sophion

"If I Were Not A Catholic ..."

by Archbishop Fulton J. Sheen

"If I were not a Catholic, and were looking for the true Church in the world today, I would look for the one Church which did not get along well with the world; in other words, I would look for the Church which the world hated. My reason for doing this would be, that if Christ is in any one of the churches of the world today, He must still be hated as He was when He was on earth in the flesh. If you would find Christ today, then find the Church that does not get along with the world. Look for the Church that is hated by the world as Christ was hated by the world. Look for the Church that is accused of being behind the times, as our Lord was accused of being ignorant and never having learned. Look for the Church which men sneer at as socially inferior, as they sneered at Our Lord because He came from Nazareth. Look for the Church which is accused of having a devil, as Our Lord was accused of being possessed by Beelzebub, the Prince of Devils. Look for the Church which, in seasons of bigotry, men say must be destroyed in the name of God as men crucified Christ and thought they had done a service to God. Look for the Church which the world rejects because it claims it is infallible, as Pilate rejected Christ because He called Himself the Truth. Look for the Church which is rejected by the world as Our Lord was rejected by men. Look for the Church which amid the confusions of conflicting opinions, its members love as they love Christ, and respect its Voice as the very voice of its Founder, and the suspicion will grow, that if the Church is unpopular with the spirit of the world, then it is unworldly, and if it is unworldly it is other worldly. since it is other-worldly, it is infinitely loved and infinitely hated as was Christ Himself. But only that which is Divine can be infinitely hated and infinitely loved. Therefore the Church is Divine."

So anung church iyun? INC?


ah teka baka Westboro Baptist Church. Even I hate that church.

alaskador10

Ano ang hate sa INC? Si Soriano binabatikos ang mga Ministro ng INC.

Ang talagang nakaranas ng Hate ay ang Catholic Church. Mula pa kina Emperor Nero, kina Napoleon, kina Adolf Hitler at sa Komyunista, ilang ulit silang pinatay, sinaktan pero nanatiling nakatayo pa rin ang Simbahan. Lahat ng evil ang unang pinapatahimik ay ang free speech at ang Catholic Church. Kaya nga ang LGBT gangs ganyan din, ayaw nilang naririnig ang panig ng Simbahan gusto nila sila lang at kung ano anong kabastusan ang ginagawa nila to attack the Church.

Sinabi ni Jesus Christ:

Remember the word that I said to you, ‘A slave is not greater than his master.’ If they persecuted Me, they will also persecute you; if they kept My word, they will keep yours also

Wala pong pinatay na Born Again. 1970's lang nagstart ang Born Again. Kung tao yun wala pang puting buhok yun. Lalo na sa INC, walang pinatay na INC dahil sa pananampalataya niya since 1914. Ang maraming martir ay sa Catholic Church.

Halimbawa dito ay ang

Catholic Romanian Martyrs ←

Simula noong early days of Christianity pinapatay na at dinadakip ang mga Christians binabawal silang sumampalataya. Kahit ang pagan Rome na tolerant sa lahat ng religion, pag dating sa mga Bishops, mga Priests ng Catholic Church wala silang awa. Ang iba sa kanila binabaon sa lupa tapos sinusunog. May Kristyanong babae ang pwersadong pinaupo sa nagbabagang upuan habang pinapanood ng mga tao. Ganito ka-cruel ang pagan Rome, kaya mabuti na-convert ito sa Kristyanismo ng mga sinaunang Kristyano. Hindi po INC ang gumawa nito. Bago ang Kristyanismo may mga Gladiator fights, binago ito ng Kristyano, nagkaroon ng Hope for peace. Kaya lang naman may mga giyera pa rin dahil sa mga hindi sumusunod sa tamang lifestyle ng kristyano, hindi pina-practice ang faith at dumami pa ang protestante sa Europe lalo na sa Germany at England.

Nagiging Kristyano na ang Japan, kaso biglang pinagpapatay sila. Hindi sana nagkaroon ng World War II kung naging Kristyanong bansa sila. Instead naging brutal sila sa mga kapitbahay na mga bansa. Gaya ng mga Kristyano sa North America na pinapako sa Krus noong panahon ng colonialism, mga Kristyano sa Middle East ngayon na pinapako sa Krus, mga Kristyano sa panahon ni Emperor Nero na pinapako sa Krus, sa Japan ganun din ang ginawa nila, pinako nila sa Krus ang mga Kristyano. Isa sa mga Martyr ng Japan ay si St. Lorenzo Ruiz ang unang Pilipinong Saint.

Martyrs of Japan ←

Hindi INC ang gumawa nyan.

Ateo

Tired, old, persecution complex, Alaskador. You have been the most dominant religion for more than 1,500 years and you still feel persecuted? For centuries, you have been the persecutor - and a very violent and cruel one.

alaskador10

Wala akong control dun. Wala kang control dun. Lahat tayo walang control sa katotohanan, nandyan lang talaga yun. Totoo naman sa kasaysayan ang mga na-persecute ay mga Katoliko. Pinapasinungalingan ko lang ang sabi sa itaas na INC daw yun na 1914 lang lumitaw, may fighter planes na nung inimbento ni manalo ang kulto nila.



Sa History napakarami talaga ng naranasan ng Catholic Church na persecution. Sa Mindanao na lang hindi mabilang ang pinugutan ng ulo na pari ng mga retards. Ako ang sinisisi mo? Kahit ayaw o gusto ko ganun ang katotohanan. Hanggang ngayon ang daming pinapatay sa Middle East na mga Christians.

Mga Christians pinatay ng ISIS←

alaskador10

Kahit saan makakakita ka ng ganitong eksena, mga homofascists bullies na bigots inaatake ang Church binabawal ng free speech at freedom of practicing religion. [VID]

Moriadne

alaskador10 wrote: »

Pinapasinungalingan ko lang ang sabi sa itaas na INC daw yun na 1914 lang lumitaw, may fighter planes na nung inimbento ni manalo ang kulto nila.

Give me one major war prior to World War 1 where a plane shot down another plane. It shouldn't be too hard to say, right?

Because I seem to recall that during the war, Pyotr Nesterov did the first plane-on-plane kill, also a kamikaze attack. Sergeant Joseph Frantz and Corporal Louis Qu?nault, on the other hand, got the first non-kamikaze plane-on-plane kill.

So please, do enlighten us about this never before discovered first splash which happened prior to World War 1, because all evidence I know of points otherwise.

alaskador10 wrote: »

Kahit saan makakakita ka ng ganitong eksena, mga homofascists bullies na bigots inaatake ang Church binabawal ng free speech at freedom of practicing religion.

To be fair, ever since the Catholic church became the STATE RELIGION of the Roman Empire, sila ang nagstart na magsikil sa freedom of speech at religious practice ng ibang grupo. Ang karamihan ng mga Roman pinaconvert, lahat ng mga mystery cult either pinwersang magconvert o napiliting mag underground, ang mga Hudyo inusig, at yung mga "barbarian" na sinakop ng Rome sapilitang pinaconvert, ie. case in point the story of King Arthur which is an allegory for the destruction of old pagan beliefs and the conquest of the Catholic faith.

Noong dumating ang mga Muslim, inusig rin sila. In Iberia, countless Muslims and Jews were persecuted by the Inquisition and were typically treated as second class citizens, if not worse. The war in the Holy Land gave rise to even more cases of Catholics persecuting conquered Muslims and Jews.

Really, the only period in time when the church could be considered not a persecutor was before it decided to become a state religion. But even before that, it still had major doctrinal flaws stemming from the Apostle's successors wanting to inject their own teachings.

Betlogins

Church today nga daw eh bakit ibabalik niyo pa yung nakaraan. he he he

Moriadne

Betlogins wrote: »

Church today nga daw eh bakit ibabalik niyo pa yung nakaraan. he he he

Well,

if you really want to,

like, talk about the present...

ElCid

Moriadne wrote: »

Well,

if you really want to,

like, talk about the present...

Things like this would lead to things like this:











Let's stick to the issues puede ba? O batuhan na naman ng putik? Di ba kayo nagsawa?

Yung aral na lang pag-usapan?

Milliardo

sophion wrote: »

"If I Were Not A Catholic ..."

by Archbishop Fulton J. Sheen

"If I were not a Catholic, and were looking for the true Church in the world today, I would look for the one Church which did not get along well with the world; in other words, I would look for the Church which the world hated. My reason for doing this would be, that if Christ is in any one of the churches of the world today, He must still be hated as He was when He was on earth in the flesh. If you would find Christ today, then find the Church that does not get along with the world. Look for the Church that is hated by the world as Christ was hated by the world. Look for the Church that is accused of being behind the times, as our Lord was accused of being ignorant and never having learned. Look for the Church which men sneer at as socially inferior, as they sneered at Our Lord because He came from Nazareth. Look for the Church which is accused of having a devil, as Our Lord was accused of being possessed by Beelzebub, the Prince of Devils. Look for the Church which, in seasons of bigotry, men say must be destroyed in the name of God as men crucified Christ and thought they had done a service to God. Look for the Church which the world rejects because it claims it is infallible, as Pilate rejected Christ because He called Himself the Truth. Look for the Church which is rejected by the world as Our Lord was rejected by men. Look for the Church which amid the confusions of conflicting opinions, its members love as they love Christ, and respect its Voice as the very voice of its Founder, and the suspicion will grow, that if the Church is unpopular with the spirit of the world, then it is unworldly, and if it is unworldly it is other worldly. since it is other-worldly, it is infinitely loved and infinitely hated as was Christ Himself. But only that which is Divine can be infinitely hated and infinitely loved. Therefore the Church is Divine."

So anung church iyun? INC?

Fulton Sheen might have been describing the Orthodox Church all along. Especially now, many Orthodox in the Middle East are suffering martyrdom in the hands of Muslims.

Moriadne

ElCid wrote: »

Things like this would lead to things like this:

Out of all of those, which ones were proven? Which ones were not punished after being proven?

None. Zilch. Nada.


Contrast to the RCC, which cannot ever deny the Inquisition, the Treaties of Tordesillas and Zaragoza, Galileo, etc.

ElCid wrote: »

Let's stick to the issues puede ba?

It is the issue. Archbishop Fulton J. Sheen is looking for a good church, and I'm just showing alaskador that the RCC's persecution complex is uncalled for considering the RCC's long history of persecuting others.

I mean, really. Iberian Jews/Muslims being in constant threat of torture and confiscation of property for the crime of being a Jew/Muslim sounds pretty unchristian to me. What's worse is that this wasn't just an isolated case of a couple rogue inquisitors, this thing was an institutional issue that never went away for ages.

ElCid wrote: »

O batuhan na naman ng putik? Di ba kayo nagsawa?

I'm merely telling the truth.

Ang dapat magsawa ay ang nagclaim na may dogfight na naganap bago pa ang World War 1.

ElCid wrote: »

Yung aral na lang pag-usapan?

The thing is, if aral ng RCC ay talagang aral ni Kristo, bakit nila ginawa ang mga bagay na ito?

Gawin na lang nating example ang Treaty of Tordesillas. Bakit nangailam ang RCC dito, samantalang ang papel na ito ay essentially about world domination. Christ never said anything about meddling in plans to carve up the world between two empires.

edzze1716

anu naman kinalaman ng fighter plane sa inc

TLG

I became born again once, i have no problem with them, but seeing how they multiply here like mushrooms...am starting to think its all about the money....

Hmmnn...If I weren't a catholic, I'll try millardo's orthodox, or maybe an agnostic.

alaskador10

Sabi ko nga ang mga modern day bullies ngayon, pumalit sa mga Nazi, Communist Russia, Emperor Nero ay yung mga rainbow flags na mga Gaytards.

alaskador10

Moriadne yung plane mismo meron na since 1901 at may mga unang eroplano na. Dun pa lang naisip na nilang gamitin agad sa giyera ito. November 1, 1911 isang italyano na si Second Lieutenant Giulio Gavotti ang unang gumamit ng eroplano pang atake sa ground troops noong kalaban ng Italy ang mga Turkish. Ang desenyo ng fighterplanes nandyan na bago ang unang gamit nito noong World War I. Hindi mo naman pwedeng sabihing hindi ka naniniwala na nag-eexist ang kotse unless makita mong nabunggo. Ang HMS Furious (47) 1915 na-testing. Before that naglalagay na sila ng baril sa eroplano. Pero tama pa rin ako, may eroplano na nagsisimula pa lang ang INC. Pano magliligtas ang samahan na late na dumating? In the first place, self proclaimed Sugo lang naman ang pinaghuhugutan nila ng paniniwala hahaha walang back up ng history puro laway at dakdak lang niya ang pinanindigan ng mga ka-anib sa INC manalista.

ABC_Company

Milliardo wrote: »

Fulton Sheen might have been describing the Orthodox Church all along. Especially now, many Orthodox in the Middle East are suffering martyrdom in the hands of Muslims.

Syempre feeling mo yung religion mo..

Inaapi kayo sa Middle East?? Eh ang sabi ni Sheen "Church that does not get along with the world" with the world brad, hindi with Middle East. Ungas ka.

Yung mga catholics hindi maka-epal kasi " If I were not a Catholic" nga.


Tingin ko Rizalista.

Theatheist

^Love your own I guess.

Anyway, I don't think any church of today exist to fit that description. But, in the future, you will see them. They are the church which comprises of Christians from different churches and denominations who have refused to take the mark of the beast and thus suffer great prosecution throughout the world. Not all Christians will follow suit and thus the falling away in the Christian world begins.

Mark 13:12 "Brother will betray brother to death, and a father his child. Children will rebel against their parents and have them put to death.

Mark 13:13 Everyone will hate you because of me, but the one who stands firm to the end will be saved.

Christians will face a difficult choice in this. Either, you're for God or you're for the Devil. There's no middle ground. Once you take that mark, you'll forfeit your eternal life for good. You're a goner. But, if you do not take that mark, you'll be persecuted, prosecuted, killed, beheaded, and hunted and gathered like an animal -- Hitler Holocaust the sequel.

John 12:25 Anyone who loves their life will lose it, while anyone who hates their life in this world will keep it for eternal life.

ycel_i_am

I'd probably be agnostic.

ElCid

Moriadne wrote: »

Out of all of those, which ones were proven? Which ones were not punished after being proven?

None. Zilch. Nada.


Contrast to the RCC, which cannot ever deny the Inquisition, the Treaties of Tordesillas and Zaragoza, Galileo, etc.




It is the issue. Archbishop Fulton J. Sheen is looking for a good church, and I'm just showing alaskador that the RCC's persecution complex is uncalled for considering the RCC's long history of persecuting others.

I mean, really. Iberian Jews/Muslims being in constant threat of torture and confiscation of property for the crime of being a Jew/Muslim sounds pretty unchristian to me. What's worse is that this wasn't just an isolated case of a couple rogue inquisitors, this thing was an institutional issue that never went away for ages.




I'm merely telling the truth.

Ang dapat magsawa ay ang nagclaim na may dogfight na naganap bago pa ang World War 1.




The thing is, if aral ng RCC ay talagang aral ni Kristo, bakit nila ginawa ang mga bagay na ito?

Gawin na lang nating example ang Treaty of Tordesillas. Bakit nangailam ang RCC dito, samantalang ang papel na ito ay essentially about world domination. Christ never said anything about meddling in plans to carve up the world between two empires.

Ok. Treaty of Tordesillas. Mahabang discusyon ito. Let me say at this time lang since the fall of rome - the administrative function of the empire which later became known as the Holy Roman Empire, fell on the hands of the church since there isn't any capable leadership available especially during the middle ages. And there is no separation of church and state at that time so that is just the natural state of affairs during that era. Is that against the teachings of Christ? Not necessarily since it paved the way for the Christianization of many lands including the Philippines.

If Spain didn't colonize the Philippines as a direct result of this treaty - there wouldn't be an IGLESIA NI CRISTO since the Philippines would be part of an ISLAMIC EMPIRE:

Some parts of the Philippines were under Muslim rule, mostly the southern parts where Islam first entered the country when Karim al-Makhdum established Islam in Tawi-Tawi and in the general Sulu region (Southern Philippines), and there were also sultanates established in the Visayas (Central Philippines) and then there was also the sultanates of Rajah Sulayman and Rajah Matanda which were based in Luzon (Northern Philippines) and actually did cover what is today the city of Manila.

During the reign of Sultan Bolkiah from 1485 to 1521, the Sultanate of Brunei invaded, wanting to take advantage of Tondo's China trade by attacking its environs and establishing "كوتا سلودوڠ Kota Saludong" (Now Manila). They ruled under and gave yearly tribute to the Sultanate of Brunei as its satellite state.[11] They established a new dynasty under the local leader who accepted Islam and became Rajah Salalila or Tariq Sulayman I. He also established a trading challenge to the already rich House of Lakan Dula in Tondo. Islam was further strengthened by the arrival of Muslim traders from the Arab-Indian area and Southeast Asia.[17] Manila was temporarily besieged by the invasion of Chinese pirate-warlord Limahong (1574) before it became the seat of the colonial government of Spain.

Reference

ElCid

^ Sige isa-isahin natin ang mga issues.

TLG

sophion wrote: »

.....I would look for the Church which the world hated..........Look for the Church that is hated by the world as Christ was hated by the world....

It's no secret that every protestant, reformist, muslims, atheists, hated the catholic church. Sino ba ang church na laging tinuturo na wh0re of babylon daw?