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Did it ever occur to Atheists that God/Religion is illogical but REAL and TRUE?

razzer_risingrazzer_rising Please do not use prohibited words in your user title to avoid sanctions. PEx Influencer ⭐⭐⭐
you know thats the basic idea I get from most atheists I know both in the real world and those that post in internet like here in ROT Forum. God/Religion is illogical and that there are lots of inconsistencies to make Him/it believable. but then again, what if it is really meant that way? illogical and inconsistent? but the bottom line is what if God/Organized Religion is still REAL and the only way to salvation in our afterlife is to believe and follow God?

OMG sana may ROT pin na ako. this is my second thread within 2 days. yay mooch where is my ROT pin. di ba relgular lurker and poster na naman ako dito since a year or two yata. wala pa rin akong pin. :bop:
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Comments

  • AteoAteo Non est Deus. Fac cum eo. PEx Influencer ⭐⭐⭐
    Christ said that he is the Truth and the Light. But if what we are getting from his book are just falsehood, confusion and a gooey gray mass of arguments -- full of assertiveness but short of logic -- then his credibility does not hold.
  • kuroihikarikuroihikari Moderator PExer
    I'm not a full atheist. I'm open to the idea that in the end of it all, there's a Creator out there. However, as Ateo said, it's the inconsistencies of the religions within themselves that seals the deal.

    There may be a real and true religion, but it's not any of the religions we have right now.
  • razzer_risingrazzer_rising Please do not use prohibited words in your user title to avoid sanctions. PEx Influencer ⭐⭐⭐
    Ateo wrote: »
    Christ said that he is the Truth and the Light. But if what we are getting from his book are just falsehood, confusion and a gooey gary mass of arguments -- full of assertiveness but short of logic -- then his credibility does not hold.

    what if even if lost credibility, He still is the TRUTH and the LIGHT? gosh no credibility does not disprove his divinity , IMHO. I remember one thread here before sort of asking what if God is not kind and sensible, would you still believe his existence?
  • tiburcioSaistiburcioSais mElaNChoLic PEx Influencer ⭐⭐⭐
  • joma_sjoma_s HellBoundHeretic® PExer
    you know thats the basic idea I get from most atheists I know both in the real world and those that post in internet like here in ROT Forum. God/Religion is illogical or somehow and that there are lots of inconsistencies to make Him/it believable. but then again, what if it is really meant that way? illogical and inconsistent? but the bottom line is what if God/Organized Religion is still REAL and the only way to salvation in our afterlife is to believe and follow God?

    Against a better judgement that is too much to expect. Granted true, which one is true religion? And were back to one.

    In my opinon, the bottom line of it all is; does god exist? Once its determined that there is a God, then asking your question to an (ex)atheist becomes a piece of cake.
  • mani94mani94 ex-Catholic PExer
    you know thats the basic idea I get from most atheists I know both in the real world and those that post in internet like here in ROT Forum. God/Religion is illogical or somehow and that there are lots of inconsistencies to make Him/it believable. but then again, what if it is really meant that way? illogical and inconsistent? but the bottom line is what if God/Organized Religion is still REAL and the only way to salvation in our afterlife is to believe and follow God?

    OMG sana may ROT pin na ako. this is my second thread within 2 days. yay mooch where is my ROT pin. di ba relgular lurker and poster na naman ako dito since a year or two yata. wala pa rin akong pin. :bop:

    No vision can grasp Him, but His Grasp is over all vision.

    We are not able to see God - our eyes don't have the capacity to. But God is able to "see" all things - everything. Further, He controls what people "see", or, perceive. Finally, God is so vast and incredible that He is beyond what we are able to understand.

    Don't think that humans are so hot. When you look at a tiny insect - who can not understand that he is in a room of a house which is in a city, a country, a continent, on a planet, etc. . . . well we humans are not so far from that insect. Very little is it that we are able to comprehend - we just THINK we're cool.
  • AteoAteo Non est Deus. Fac cum eo. PEx Influencer ⭐⭐⭐
    what if even if lost credibility, He still is the TRUTH and the LIGHT? gosh no credibility does not disprove his divinity , IMHO. I remember one thread here before sort of asking what if God is not kind and sensible, would you still believe his existence?


    Credibility leads to belief, does it not? And belief is the key ingredient for any religion and the key demand of any god.

    Christianity has to be more logical, more credible if it has to rise above the morass of illogical religions out there that number in thousands. For why would we choose that story of a virgin who gave birth to a water-walking faith healer vs. those of equally preposterous stories from other religions. You can't choose Christianity just because you were into it when there are thousands of other equally illogical competitions, can you?
  • skye_phoenixskye_phoenix 荒れ狂う稲光のシェルミー PEx Influencer ⭐⭐⭐
    [1]
    Then the angel that had been sent to me, whose name was Uriel, answered


    [2] and said to me, "Your understanding has utterly failed regarding this world, and do you think you can comprehend the way of the Most High?"
    [3] Then I said, "Yes, my lord." And he replied to me, "I have been sent to show you three ways, and to put before you three problems.
    [4] If you can solve one of them for me, I also will show you the way you desire to see, and will teach you why the heart is evil."
    [5]
    I said, "Speak on, my lord."

    And he said to me, "Go, weigh for me the weight of fire, or measure for me a measure of wind, or call back for me the day that is past."


    [6]
    I answered and said, "Who of those that have been born can do this, that you ask me concerning these things?"


    [7]
    And he said to me, "If I had asked you, `How many dwellings are in the heart of the sea, or how many streams are at the source of the deep, or how many streams are above the firmament, or which are the exits of hell, or which are the entrances of paradise?'


    [8] Perhaps you would have said to me, `I never went down into the deep, nor as yet into hell, neither did I ever ascend into heaven.'
    [9] But now I have asked you only about fire and wind and the day, things through which you have passed and without which you cannot exist, and you have given me no answer about them!"
    [10] And he said to me, "You cannot understand the things with which you have grown up;
    [11] how then can your mind comprehend the way of the Most High? And how can one who is already worn out by the corrupt world understand incorruption?"
    When I heard this, I fell on my face
    [12] and said to him, "It would be better for us not to be here than to come here and live in ungodliness, and to suffer and not understand why."
    [13]
    He answered me and said, "I went into a forest of trees of the plain, and they made a plan


    [14] and said, `Come, let us go and make war against the sea, that it may recede before us, and that we may make for ourselves more forests.'
    [15] And in like manner the waves of the sea also made a plan and said, `Come, let us go up and subdue the forest of the plain so that there also we may gain more territory for ourselves.'
    [16] But the plan of the forest was in vain, for the fire came and consumed it;
    [17] likewise also the plan of the waves of the sea, for the sand stood firm and stopped them.
    [18] If now you were a judge between them, which would you undertake to justify, and which to condemn?"
    [19]
    I answered and said, "Each has made a foolish plan, for the land is assigned to the forest, and to the sea is assigned a place to carry its waves."


    [20]
    He answered me and said, "You have judged rightly, but why have you not judged so in your own case?


    [21] For as the land is assigned to the forest and the sea to its waves, so also those who dwell upon earth can understand only what is on the earth, and he who is above the heavens can understand what is above the height of the heavens."

    2 Esdras 4:1-21
  • kuroihikarikuroihikari Moderator PExer
    I find it funny whenever people use some form of scripture to preach to atheists.

    It's like using a pillow to drive a nail.
  • joma_sjoma_s HellBoundHeretic® PExer
    well to some people, alice in wonderland is a real thing
  • SmartDessaSmartDessa Things divide;Christ unites PExer
    to the TS.

    yes. verily yes
  • skye_phoenixskye_phoenix 荒れ狂う稲光のシェルミー PEx Influencer ⭐⭐⭐
    I find it funny whenever people use some form of scripture to preach to atheists.

    It's like using a pillow to drive a nail.

    I consider the words of God harder than hammer and can drive more than just nails. And believe it or not I feel sorry for those who can't seem to hear his voice or worse ignore it.
  • kuroihikarikuroihikari Moderator PExer
    I consider the words of God harder than hammer and can drive more than just nails. And believe it or not I feel sorry for those who can't seem to hear his voice or worse ignore it.

    The keyword is "I".

    Preaching is communication, and you see communication, to be effective, must be two-way. If it isn't two-way... Like say what you're doing by preaching scripture to an atheist, it's nothing but background noise.

    So I understand that you want to show that you're trying to be sympathetic and "sorry" but really, all you're doing is putting yourself on a high horse. If you really want to save people, tell them in a way that'll make them care.

    And if you really just want to look down on people who don't believe the same thing as you, well, shame on you.
  • razzer_risingrazzer_rising Please do not use prohibited words in your user title to avoid sanctions. PEx Influencer ⭐⭐⭐
    I consider the words of God harder than hammer and can drive more than just nails. And believe it or not I feel sorry for those who can't seem to hear his voice or worse ignore it.

    You did not understand what kuroihikari said. He is an atheist, I thinkso. naturally he does not believe in the Bible or Quran. so posting verses from these books to change his atheistic belief is as useless as using a pillow to drive a nail. I think the better analogy is using Darwin's research or statement to those who do not adhere to the theory of evolution.

    For me, I have yet to find a satisfactory post by an atheist regarding my topic. gosh not that the posts here are illogical but they are lacking something I want to hear, sadly, I dont know what I want to hear from them, the atheist. :lol:
  • ping2xping2x Member PExer
    The keyword is "I".

    Preaching is communication, and you see communication, to be effective, must be two-way. If it isn't two-way... Like say what you're doing by preaching scripture to an atheist, it's nothing but background noise.

    So I understand that you want to show that you're trying to be sympathetic and "sorry" but really, all you're doing is putting yourself on a high horse. If you really want to save people, tell them in a way that'll make them care.

    And if you really just want to look down on people who don't believe the same thing as you, well, shame on you.

    sorry...hindi ko gets?
  • skye_phoenixskye_phoenix 荒れ狂う稲光のシェルミー PEx Influencer ⭐⭐⭐
    I find it funny whenever people use some form of scripture to preach to atheists.

    It's like using a pillow to drive a nail.
    The keyword is "I".

    Preaching is communication, and you see communication, to be effective, must be two-way. If it isn't two-way... Like say what you're doing by preaching scripture to an atheist, it's nothing but background noise.

    So I understand that you want to show that you're trying to be sympathetic and "sorry" but really, all you're doing is putting yourself on a high horse. If you really want to save people, tell them in a way that'll make them care.

    And if you really just want to look down on people who don't believe the same thing as you, well, shame on you.

    I'm sorry did my post look like I was preaching?

    preach (prch)
    v. preached, preach·ing, preach·es
    v.tr.
    1. To proclaim or put forth in a sermon: preached the gospel.
    2. To advocate, especially to urge acceptance of or compliance with: preached tolerance and peaceful coexistence.
    3. To deliver (a sermon).
    v.intr.
    1. To deliver a sermon.
    2. To give religious or moral instruction, especially in a tedious manner.

    As far as I'm concerned I did not "preach", I only posted a chapter/verse that I thought answers some queeries about God's existence. If you did not understand the post or my purpose in posting it, then I'm sorry, for you.

    And, excuse me! who are you say that I look down on people!? You don't know me personally, I'm not for you to judge and neither is anyone for me.

    I believe this is a democratic forum isn't it? Therefore, I can post whatever I feel like posting as long as I know it has substance, now whether people will read and absorb it, it's not my problem anymore and neither it is yours. Unless, you want to bother yourself, be my guest.

    This will be my last response to you, as don't want to stoop down to your level of understanding.
  • rachel_05rachel_05 Member PExer
    It never occured to me that god is real and true.

    I'm an atheist. Of Islam, that is. :glee:

    The god I was talking about is Allah.
  • joma_sjoma_s HellBoundHeretic® PExer
    rachel_05 wrote: »
    It never occured to me that god is real and true.

    I'm an atheist. Of Islam, that is. :glee:

    The god I was talking about is Allah.
    of course you are an atheist. you just go one more god after disbelieving the rest
  • rachel_05rachel_05 Member PExer
    joma_s wrote: »
    of course you are an atheist. you just go one more god after disbelieving the rest
    You mean, disbelief in the Judeo-Christian God?

    Won't happen. :nope:
  • joma_sjoma_s HellBoundHeretic® PExer
    rachel_05 wrote: »
    You mean, disbelief in the Judeo-Christian God?

    Won't happen. :nope:
    its your choice but Muslim also feel that your god is fake and in a sense, they are atheist like you.

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