Bakit sinabi sa Bibliya na si Ishmael ay “wild man”?

Peace CrusaderPeace Crusader Banned by Admin PExer
20100130.0020

Heto ang sinabi ng angel of the Lord sa Genesis 16:12 tungkol kay Ishmael nang siya ay nasa sinapupunan pa ni Hagar – “And he will be a wild man; his hand will be against every man, and every man’s hand against him; and he shall dwell in the presence of all his brethren.”

Ina-accept ng mga Arabs na sila ay nanggaling sa angkan ni Ishmael. At alam natin na most Arabs are Muslims. Totoo ba ang sinabing ito ng angel of the Lord? Pakibigay ng example.
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Comments

  • Peace CrusaderPeace Crusader Banned by Admin PExer
    20100203.2340

    Bakit walang nag-respond ni isa sa post kong ito? Nagkatotoo ba ang sabi ng angel of the Lord tungkol kay Ishmael na noon ay nasa sinapupunan pa ni Hagar?
  • retxedretxed Member PExer
    20100203.2340

    Bakit walang nag-respond ni isa sa post kong ito? Nagkatotoo ba ang sabi ng angel of the Lord tungkol kay Ishmael na noon ay nasa sinapupunan pa ni Hagar?

    just wait for the muslim brothers - bani and mani!!!! para kang mao-ondoy!!! floods of copy and paste!!! *okay*
  • banimalekbanimalek Bangsamoro PExer
    20100203.2340

    Bakit walang nag-respond ni isa sa post kong ito? Nagkatotoo ba ang sabi ng angel of the Lord tungkol kay Ishmael na noon ay nasa sinapupunan pa ni Hagar?

    Brad kristiyano ba ang tinatanong mo diyan o muslim?

    retxed wrote: »
    just wait for the muslim brothers - bani and mani!!!! para kang mao-ondoy!!! floods of copy and paste!!! *okay*

    Bakit kailangan paba kami ng sumagot diyan, baka naman ma-mis-interpretet naman kami kapag nagpaliwanag kami at sasabihin na nag-aangkin kami ng talata sa bibliya :lol:
  • Peace CrusaderPeace Crusader Banned by Admin PExer
    20100204.0655

    Dear banimalek and my Fellowmen,
    banimalek wrote: »
    Brad kristiyano ba ang tinatanong mo diyan o muslim?


    Bakit kailangan paba kami ng sumagot diyan, baka naman ma-mis-interpretet naman kami kapag nagpaliwanag kami at sasabihin na nag-aangkin kami ng talata sa bibliya :lol:

    Ang aking tanong ay para sa lahat. Ang aking qu-in-ote ay galing sa Genesis, isang aklat sa Old Testament na kinikilala ng mga Jews, Christians, and Muslims as part of their religion. Ano ang masasabi ninyo rito mula sa inyong pananaw? banimalek, ikaw na isang Muslim. Ano ang iyong masasabi tungkol dito? Ito ay isang prophecy na sinabi ng isang angel ng Diyos habang nasa sinapupunan pa lang ni Hagar si Ishmael.

    Ang pinagkaiba ng true God sa mga false gods ay ang pagpro-prophesy. Ang true God ay makapagpro-prophesy whereas a false god cannot. Tandaan sana ninyo ito. At ito ay isang plain and simple and logical test para malaman kung ang isang diyos ay tunay o hindi, kahit na hindi gamitin ang anumang holy scripture ng isang religion.

    With love, your brother in Jesus,
    Aristeo Canlas Fernando, Peace Crusader and Echo of the Holy Spirit
    Motto: pro aris et focis (for the sake of, or defense of, religion and home)
    http://aristean.org/ and http://peacecrusader.wordpress.com/
    “The Internet is mightier than the sword.”
  • KatholikonKatholikon Pax et Bonvm PExer
    The English translation "wild man" of the original Hebrew word is rather not accurate.

    An examination of the original Hebrew term used by the sacred Genetic author tells us that the Hebrew more accurately means "violent man".

    So that the prophecies foretell Ishmael, the son of Hagar the slave woman, to be being a violent man.

    This prophecy is more eloquently fulfilled today by Ishmael's present day descendants: Muhammed and the Arabs and the Mohammedan religion.
  • banimalekbanimalek Bangsamoro PExer
    Ito ay isang prophecy na sinabi ng isang angel ng Diyos habang nasa sinapupunan pa lang ni Hagar si Ishmael.

    So, anghel ng Diyos ang nagsabi niyan at hindi iyong paniniwala ng iba na second person :rolleyes:

    Actually ayaw kung magkomento kasi wala naman importansiya niyan sa Islam faith.
  • banimalekbanimalek Bangsamoro PExer
    Katholikon wrote: »
    The English translation "wild man" of the original Hebrew word is rather not accurate.

    An examination of the original Hebrew term used by the sacred Genetic author tells us that the Hebrew more accurately means "violent man".

    So that the prophecies foretell Ishmael, the son of Hagar the slave woman, to be being a violent man.

    This prophecy is more eloquently fulfilled today by Ishmael's present day descendants: Muhammed and the Arabs and the Mohammedan religion.

    Islam lang ba ang bayolente na nakikita ninyo, papaano na iyong pagpatay ng mga naunang mga kristiyano daw :eek:
  • TLGTLG The Dark Knight PExer
    banimalek wrote: »
    So, anghel ng Diyos ang nagsabi niyan at hindi iyong paniniwala ng iba na second person :rolleyes:

    Actually ayaw kung magkomento kasi wala naman importansiya niyan sa Islam faith.

    Bani tumigil kana dahil sa haba ng pinag-usapan natin ni isa wala kang na-absorb at naintindihan!:lol:
  • Peace CrusaderPeace Crusader Banned by Admin PExer
    20100205.2005

    Dear banimalek and my Fellowmen,
    Katholikon wrote: »
    The English translation "wild man" of the original Hebrew word is rather not accurate.

    An examination of the original Hebrew term used by the sacred Genetic author tells us that the Hebrew more accurately means "violent man".

    So that the prophecies foretell Ishmael, the son of Hagar the slave woman, to be being a violent man.

    This prophecy is more eloquently fulfilled today by Ishmael's present day descendants: Muhammed and the Arabs and the Mohammedan religion.

    In the Holy Bible, King James Version, it states “wild man”. However, you said that the original Hebrew term is more accurately translated as “violent man”. What is the Hebrew term? What is its English translation in the Hebrew Bible or Torah?
    banimalek wrote: »
    So, anghel ng Diyos ang nagsabi niyan at hindi iyong paniniwala ng iba na second person :rolleyes:

    Actually ayaw kung magkomento kasi wala naman importansiya niyan sa Islam faith.

    Hindi ba importanteng malaman ito sa faith ng Islam? Akala ko ba, naniniwala ang mga Muslim hindi lamang sa Qur’an kundi pati sa Taurat(?) (Torah) including the Pentateuch, the first five books of the Old Testament, and in Injeel (the New Testament)?
    banimalek wrote: »
    Islam lang ba ang bayolente na nakikita ninyo, papaano na iyong pagpatay ng mga naunang mga kristiyano daw :eek:

    Inaamin mo ba, banimalek, na ang Islam ay “bayolente”? Noong bago pa lang ipinalalaganap ang katuruan ni Jesus Christ, nag-alsa ba ang mga mamamahayag? Hindi ba sila ay m-in-artyr? Pinagpapatay. P-in-ersecute. Gumanti ba sila?

    With love, your brother in Jesus,
    Aristeo Canlas Fernando, Peace Crusader and Echo of the Holy Spirit
    Motto: pro aris et focis (for the sake of, or defense of, religion and home)
    http://aristean.org/ and http://peacecrusader.wordpress.com/
    “The Internet is mightier than the sword.”
  • tontontonton Let's stop and talk awhile. PExer
    Hindi ba importanteng malaman ito sa faith ng Islam? Akala ko ba, naniniwala ang mga Muslim hindi lamang sa Qur’an kundi pati sa Taurat(?) (Torah) including the Pentateuch, the first five books of the Old Testament, and in Injeel (the New Testament)?

    According to the Quran, the book attributed to Moses was corrupted.
    2:75 Did you expect that they would believe with you, when a group of them had heard the words of God then altered them knowingly after having understood?
    2:76 And when they come across those who believe, they say: �We believe!� And when they are alone with each other they say: �Why do you inform them of what God has said to us? Then they would use it in argument against us at your Lord. Do you not comprehend?�
    2:77 Do they not know that God knows what they conceal and what they declare?
    2:78 And among them are Gentiles who do not know the Book except by hearsay, and they only conjecture.
    2:79 So woe to those who write the Book with their hands then say: �This is from God,� so that they can purchase with it a cheap price! Woe to them for what their hands have written and woe to them for what they gained.

    Biblical Proof:
    Gen 22:2 And he said, Take now thy son, thine only son, whom thou lovest, even Isaac, and get thee into the land of Moriah.

    Gen 22:12 And he said, Lay not thy hand upon the lad, neither do thou anything unto him. For now I know that thou fearest God, seeing thou hast not withheld thy son, thine only son, from me.

    We all know that Abraham had two sons.

    And about Solomon - a person the bible has gravely maligned. It simply is not logical that a man sent by God for a mission will turn into a sex maniac and an idol worshiper.

    The Quran says:
    2:102 And they followed what the devils recited regarding the kingship of Solomon. Solomon did not reject, but it was the devils who rejected by teaching people magic, and teaching them what was sent down on the two angels in Babylon, Haroot and Maroot.

    38:30 And to David We granted Solomon. What an excellent and obedient servant.

    But the bible portrayed Solomon, some that Jehovah "loved" and made a King, as a sex maniac and an idol worshiper.
    2Sa 12:24 And David comforted Bath-sheba his wife, and went in unto her, and lay with her: and she bare a son, and he called his name Solomon. And Jehovah loved him;

    1Ki 11:1 Now king Solomon loved many foreign women, together with the daughter of Pharaoh, women of the Moabites, Ammonites, Edomites, Sidonians, and Hittites;
    1Ki 11:2 of the nations concerning which Jehovah said unto the children of Israel, Ye shall not go among them, neither shall they come among you; for surely they will turn away your heart after their gods: Solomon clave unto these in love.
    1Ki 11:3 And he had seven hundred wives, princesses, and three hundred concubines; and his wives turned away his heart.
    1Ki 11:4 For it came to pass, when Solomon was old, that his wives turned away his heart after other gods; and his heart was not perfect with Jehovah his God, as was the heart of David his father.
    1Ki 11:5 For Solomon went after Ashtoreth the goddess of the Sidonians, and after Milcom the abomination of the Ammonites.
    1Ki 11:6 And Solomon did that which was evil in the sight of Jehovah, and went not fully after Jehovah, as did David his father.

    With that said, how can the muslim hold the Old Testament of the bible in high regard?

    Jer 8:8 How do ye say, We are wise, and the law of Jehovah is with us? But, behold, the false pen of the scribes hath wrought falsely.
  • banimalekbanimalek Bangsamoro PExer
    TLG wrote: »
    Bani tumigil kana dahil sa haba ng pinag-usapan natin ni isa wala kang na-absorb at naintindihan!:lol:

    Baka naman ikaw ang walang naintindihan kasi dinadaan mo lang sa emosyon mo, nabasa mo ang post ni PC anghel daw iyong nagbigay daw ng propesiya at hindi iyong second person mo na puro haka-haka lang .

    Tuloy ang verbo/lgos mo ay hindi mo masagot ng deretsahan :lol:
  • banimalekbanimalek Bangsamoro PExer
    Hindi ba importanteng malaman ito sa faith ng Islam? Akala ko ba, naniniwala ang mga Muslim hindi lamang sa Qur’an kundi pati sa Taurat(?) (Torah) including the Pentateuch, the first five books of the Old Testament, and in Injeel (the New Testament)?

    Opo naniniwala po kami ng Taurat at Injeel pero ayaw namin na kapag nagbigay kami ng intpretasyon diyan sa nabanggit mong talata ay sasabihin naman na inaangkin namin, tulad ba doon sa Deutronomy about sa propesiya patungkol sa propheta Muhammad (pbuh) kaya nga sa Quran na lang kami bumabatay ng aming pinapaniwalaan sapagkat ang mensahe ng Allah sa naunang kasulatan ay walang binago sa mensahe niya sa Quran.

    Sana naunawaan mo, lalo na mayroon isang half/half na katoliko na puro emosyon niya ang pina-iiral :lol:

    Inaamin mo ba, banimalek, na ang Islam ay “bayolente”? Noong bago pa lang ipinalalaganap ang katuruan ni Jesus Christ, nag-alsa ba ang mga mamamahayag? Hindi ba sila ay m-in-artyr? Pinagpapatay. P-in-ersecute. Gumanti ba sila?

    Hindi ko sinabing bayolente ang Islam pero bayolente ang tingin ng karamihan sa inyo, pero kapag mayroon bayolenteng kristiyano ay agad dumedepensa na hindi daw sila tunay na kristiyano :rolleyes:
  • prEttyNdisTressprEttyNdisTress Banned by Admin PExer
    Wild ba talaga si Ishmael? Where can I find him?? :hmm:



    :naughty:
  • Peace CrusaderPeace Crusader Banned by Admin PExer
    20100206.0800

    Dear banimalek and my Fellowmen,
    banimalek wrote: »
    Opo naniniwala po kami ng Taurat at Injeel pero ayaw namin na kapag nagbigay kami ng intpretasyon diyan sa nabanggit mong talata ay sasabihin naman na inaangkin namin, tulad ba doon sa Deutronomy about sa propesiya patungkol sa propheta Muhammad (pbuh) kaya nga sa Quran na lang kami bumabatay ng aming pinapaniwalaan sapagkat ang mensahe ng Allah sa naunang kasulatan ay walang binago sa mensahe niya sa Quran.

    Bakit pa sinasabi ng mga Muslim na naniniwala sila sa Taurat at Injeel, tapos hindi naman gagamitin ang mga ito?

    Sa Christianity, tinatanggap ang Old Testament as part of their religion. Why? Because the one true God, as God the Father, talked to the people. He, Himself, gave a sign (Isaiah 7:14): “Behold, a virgin shall conceive, and bear a son, and shall call his name Immanuel.” Imagine, a virgin to give birth to a son (not just any child but a son, a male child). And this prophecy became true when Jesus Christ was born by the Blessed Virgin Mary. Jesus Christ is God incarnate. He is God the Son in the New Testament. Then Jesus said in John 14, 15 and 16 that He would send the Paraclete, the spirit of Truth, the Holy Spirit. This is God the Holy Spirit. And He is a spirit (John 14:17) “whom the world cannot receive, because it seeth him not, neither knoweth him”. Is Muhammad the Holy Spirit? Muhammad was seen, wasn’t he?

    The above concept is called the Trinity. There is only one true God. And because He is powerful, He made Himself into three: as God the Father, as God the Son Jesus Christ, and as God the Holy Spirit. Is it impossible for the true God to do this?

    I will relate to you what a holy spirit who we (plural) talk to said:
    “And I tell you, the Devil can also speak very well and explain things about the Bible. And what he says are also things about God. Because any pauper who desires to marry a princess borrows clothes of a prince and hides his being a pauper to the princess he desires to marry. And I tell you, the Devil also speaks about God and he presents things about God. However, in his explanation, he inserts and he distorts things and presents the beauty of hell. That is why I tell you, do the best you can to scrutinize what I say so that even a word, a comma, a period will not pass you in what I say. There maybe things that is favorable to evil. That is why, keep your eyes wide open and be attentive so that they won’t close because of sleepiness. Watch out for the pauper in disguise as a prince.”

    If you will believe it, He is the Holy Spirit Himself. He is the author of what I just presented. It was taken from http://aristean.org/sermon006.htm and is only one and a third pages long.

    With love, your brother in Jesus,
    Aristeo Canlas Fernando, Peace Crusader and Echo of the Holy Spirit
    Motto: pro aris et focis (for the sake of, or defense of, religion and home)
    http://aristean.org/ and http://peacecrusader.wordpress.com/
    “The Internet is mightier than the sword.”
  • TLGTLG The Dark Knight PExer
    banimalek wrote: »
    Baka naman ikaw ang walang naintindihan kasi dinadaan mo lang sa emosyon mo, nabasa mo ang post ni PC anghel daw iyong nagbigay daw ng propesiya at hindi iyong second person mo na puro haka-haka lang .

    Tuloy ang verbo/lgos mo ay hindi mo masagot ng deretsahan :lol:

    Simple lang naman bani eh, isang tanong na patuloy mong iniiwasan! Sabihin na nating anghel yung nagsalita, pagbibigyan na kita!

    Kanino nanggaling yung message? Yung source ang tinatanong ko bani! Source hindi yung speaker! SOURCE (kailangan ko pang ulit-ulitin para mabaon sa kukote mong mahinang umintindi!)

    Sabi sa message

    "WALANG INANYUAN DIYOS NA UNA SA AKIN NI SUSUNOD PA PAGKATAPOS KO"

    Ang tinatanong ko kanino source ang message na yan? Sabihin na nating anghel nga nagsalita, kanino ang source? Ang nagsasalita jan INANYUANG DIYOS. Bakit di mo masagot-sagot ha!
  • YAKIYAKI SAVED BY GRACE PExer
    tonton wrote: »
    According to the Quran, the book attributed to Moses was corrupted.
    2:75 Did you expect that they would believe with you, when a group of them had heard the words of God then altered them knowingly after having understood?
    2:76 And when they come across those who believe, they say: �We believe!� And when they are alone with each other they say: �Why do you inform them of what God has said to us? Then they would use it in argument against us at your Lord. Do you not comprehend?�
    2:77 Do they not know that God knows what they conceal and what they declare?
    2:78 And among them are Gentiles who do not know the Book except by hearsay, and they only conjecture.
    2:79 So woe to those who write the Book with their hands then say: �This is from God,� so that they can purchase with it a cheap price! Woe to them for what their hands have written and woe to them for what they gained.

    Biblical Proof:
    Gen 22:2 And he said, Take now thy son, thine only son, whom thou lovest, even Isaac, and get thee into the land of Moriah.

    Gen 22:12 And he said, Lay not thy hand upon the lad, neither do thou anything unto him. For now I know that thou fearest God, seeing thou hast not withheld thy son, thine only son, from me.

    We all know that Abraham had two sons.

    God described Isaac as the only son of Abraham because Ismael left already and was no longer living with Abraham. Ismael was as good as non-existent with regards to Abraham when God asked him to sacrifice Isaac. Isaac was the only son left to Abraham since Ismael was gone already. *okay*
  • tontontonton Let's stop and talk awhile. PExer
    YAKI wrote: »
    God described Isaac as the only son of Abraham because Ismael left already and was no longer living with Abraham. Ismael was as good as non-existent with regards to Abraham when God asked him to sacrifice Isaac. Isaac was the only son left to Abraham since Ismael was gone already. *okay*

    That doesn't stop him from being a son. In fact, until Abraham's death, he was still considered a son.

    Gen 25:9 And Isaac and Ishmael his sons buried him in the cave of Machpelah, in the field of Ephron the son of Zohar the Hittite, which is before Mamre.
  • TLGTLG The Dark Knight PExer
    ^^^ The author acknowledge Ishmael as Abraham's son but God does not, that is why when God is speaking he refers to Isaac as abraham's only son.
  • YAKIYAKI SAVED BY GRACE PExer
    tonton wrote: »
    That doesn't stop him from being a son. In fact, until Abraham's death, he was still considered a son.

    Gen 25:9 And Isaac and Ishmael his sons buried him in the cave of Machpelah, in the field of Ephron the son of Zohar the Hittite, which is before Mamre.

    Is a lost toy ceased being a toy? If you have two toys and one was lost, how many toys do you have? Do you still consider a toy something that has ceased being a toy to you though it still exists?

    Ishmael ceased functioning as a son to Abraham after Ishmael left Abraham. The only joy of having a son left to Abraham was Isaac.
  • tontontonton Let's stop and talk awhile. PExer
    Uulitin ko ha!!


    Gen 25:9 And Isaac and Ishmael his sons buried him in the cave of Machpelah, in the field of Ephron the son of Zohar the Hittite, which is before Mamre.

    TLG, diba inspired ng Dios ang biblia? Siguro hindi inspired itong verse na ito! :lol: Burahin!!
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