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  1. #1

    Marc Pingris or Ranidel de Ocampo?

    Both got drafted last 2004 by Fedex franchise, #3 and #4.
    Both won championships and individual awards.
    Two of the best forwards in the league, coveted for the Gilas team. Two different playing styles.

    Career ave (from pba-online):
    Pingris - 7.61 PPG, 7.32 RPG, 1.31 APG, 0.46 SPG, 0.87 BPG
    de Ocampo - 11.8 PPG, 6.14 RPG, 2.01 APG, 0.58 SPG, 0.33 BPG

    Ping, unleashes the energy and hustles like no one else can do, is perhaps one of the best all-around defenders today and can light up the offense too.
    While RDO, proud Gilas PF starter silent he may seems, is evidently the better offensive player (outside and inside) but can also empower a great interior defense.


    If given a choice, who will you choose for your team and who do you think is better overall?

  2. #2
    It depends on how your team is composed.

    If your team has a lot of shooters/scorers, you would need Pingris to 'balance' it out on the floor and give you intensity, hustle, defense, and rebounding. He's the type of player that even if he doesn't score a single point, he can do a lot more in other facets of the game.

    Ranidel, on the other hand, would be perfect for a structured offense. He's very successful in TNT because Chot Reyes, and now Norman Black, employs the dribble-drive motion offense, which requires players with good perimeter touch. RDO is valuable to TNT because they can run their offense without giving up too much height, as RDO is a big men who can shoot from the outside. I can see him doing well with Tim Cone's triangle as well, as a big men who has a respectable perimeter shooting to make those mid-range jumpers.

    Overall, RDO is clearly the better player. But if I'm to choose among them, I'd pick Pingris. Bias aside, not only do Ping give the intangibles everybody knows he's giving every game, but also gives Cone's triangle offense a different dimension. He's proven to be a good interior passer under Tim's system. Being a limited player, offensively, opposing players have the tendency to leave him wide open at times, which he takes advantage by sneaking inside the shaded lane for a drop/bounce pass. He's developed a jump hook thus he's not that much of an offensive liability anymore. He's also a decent pick-and-roll guy.

  3. #3
    Depends on your team needs.

    if you need defense,intensity and energy = Pingris
    if you need jump shooting big, stretch 4/5 = RDO

  4. #4
    While RDO may thrive in a structured type of offense that coaches like Tim Cone, Norman Black, Chot Reyes and Jong Uichico provide, I think he's more than that. RDO can also be a shot-creator - someone who can take the ball to the hoop if the offense breaks down. He's capable of doing everything offensively - post up, shoot from the perimeter or beyond it, move well without the ball, and set up bone-crunching picks to free up his shooter teammates. We've seen how capable RDO was as an offensive threat when he was still with Air 21 playing for Bo Perasol.

    Ping's defense is one of the best in the league. He's extremely hardworking and does a lot of intangibles that won't be seen in the stat sheets. Ping is also the better rebounder slightly primarily because he uses his bulk and physique to fight for the boards.

    Hard to pick really but to make the discussion simpler, if a team needs...

    Offense - RDO
    Defense - Ping

  5. #5
    ping is a liability in offense. in defense its not that he is aggressive but team defense is the success to any teams.. like the miami heat. bosh is not a great defender but what makes him great is because of the help defense miami is helping each other.. pingris is good at 1 on 1 defense but thats not the case today.. with no illegal defense. any player can defend even the weakest defender like jwash can defend depends on how his teammates react on their help defense..

    clearly its ranidel de ocampo. he will give you many mismatches not only in the post but also in midrange.. just like miami heat. they chose bosh to be their center because it will give many options for them if they double james .. bosh can spot up or cut inside the lane..

    and ranidel fits the bill to any teams. plus ranidel is not a weak defender also. he has a strength that can defend any center in the pba. his timing in his rebound is great and basketball IQ is much greater than pingris.

  6. #6
    Quote Originally Posted by Jay P. Mercado View Post
    While RDO may thrive in a structured type of offense that coaches like Tim Cone, Norman Black, Chot Reyes and Jong Uichico provide, I think he's more than that. RDO can also be a shot-creator - someone who can take the ball to the hoop if the offense breaks down. He's capable of doing everything offensively - post up, shoot from the perimeter or beyond it, move well without the ball, and set up bone-crunching picks to free up his shooter teammates. We've seen how capable RDO was as an offensive threat when he was still with Air 21 playing for Bo Perasol.

    Ping's defense is one of the best in the league. He's extremely hardworking and does a lot of intangibles that won't be seen in the stat sheets. Ping is also the better rebounder slightly primarily because he uses his bulk and physique to fight for the boards.

    Hard to pick really but to make the discussion simpler, if a team needs...

    Offense - RDO
    Defense - Ping
    This!

    The choice will boil down to what the team needs in a particular situation.

    RDO, IMO is the BEST SCORING BIGMAN in the league today. He can score either from the post, face up and even off the dribble. His range covers any area on the floor; can operate inside the shaded lane, make pull-ups from midrange and drain those occasional threes. And what makes him "special" is his underrated defense. While other premiere scorers of the league are relatively "poor" on the other end of the court, RDO is one of the few who can hurt you on both ends. He may not be as defensively-adept as Ping but we cannot say he is a liability in defense.

    On the other hand...Jean Mark Pingris is probably the PBA's BEST DEFENSIVE PLAYER. Yup, you read it right. Seldom you see someone who can defend the ace player of the opposing team; LOCAL or IMPORT, AND AT ANY POSITION. It may not necessarily show up as statistics on the scoreboard but everyone from the players themselves, the coaches and the fans feel the presence of Ping every time this guy is on the floor. There was a research conducted a few years back determining the PLAYER WHO HAS THE BEST POSITIVE OUTPUT FOR HIS TEAM. It was computed thru the players' personal statistics and the ( +/- lead/deficit) he gives his team while on the court. I thought the likes of Santos, Williams or Caguioa will lead that category as they are proven statistical monsters. I was a bit surprised that Ping came out on top. But when I looked at the numbers, I understood. It is not the number of points, rebounds, assists, steal or blocks that matters but how a player contributes thru tangible or intangible means that leads a team to a win.

    Anybody who says Ping has low basketball IQ is either nuts or simply a guy full of hatred. (i-utot mo na yan ) Someone who has shackled the likes of:

    - Mike Cortez (a PG) to lead Purefoods back from a 1-3 series deficit,
    - David Noel (an import) in the last 2 games of the Finals to lead SMB to a title
    - 6'7 Sonny Thoss for a series sweep
    - and ironically Ranidel De Ocampo who was limited in 5 of 7 games of the Commissioner's Cup Finals last year

    cannot be a player w/ low IQ. Nah! It cannot be. Great defensive players don't rely on mere athletic abilities. It entails dedication and intricate knowledge of the game.

  7. #7
    if im the coach of the GILAS team.. and 1 player will just be added to our lineup and im thorn between two defensive center.. who will i pick?

    THOSS OR PINGRIS?

    its a no brainer. its sonny thoss. yes pingris is mobile defensively. but interms of defensive dominance inside the paint. SONNY THOSS is the man.. pingris is only 6'5 while thoss is 6'8, also when thoss is posting up pingris.. pingris cant stop thoss.. well.. its not a comparison of a great center like thoss to a so so performer like pingris.. because the comparison is pingris vs ranidel.. and in my opinion. ranidel is the better player in both ends of the court.

    in the miami heat or lakers championship team. they dont have a defensive center primarily.. they have a DOMINANT center.. the likes of shaquille oneal. chris bosh, both are dominant not only in scoring but in court awareness... pingris is a liability because he doesnt attract defenders when he is posting up.. because people knew that pingris will only post up and tear drop shot.. he doesnt know how to hook shot or left handed scoop shot which sonny thoss does...

  8. #8
    marunong ba si pingris ng ganito?



    the best defensive center is not pingris but sonny thoss.. he can defend imports like dawson. believe me.. wala pa sa kalingkingan si pingris ni thoss.. even yeng guiao wil pick sonny thoss over pingris any day

  9. #9
    Kahit ilang mini clips pa ang ilagay dito.

    Pingris or Thoss. Choice is pretty moot and academic.

    Mas mahirap pang choice ang RDO vs Pingris.

    Chot was asking for Pingris from SMC to aid Gilas in covering up their defensive loopholes. Thoss? He had his chance being a part of previous Gilas teams. People, be the judge! Was Thoss as effective in the international game manning the Center or PF slot? If my memory serves me right...mas impresibo pa si Enrico Villanueva.

    Wala pa sa kalingkingan ni Thoss si Pingris?

    Sagot ko.

    4 - 0...w/ Ryan Gregorio

    8 - 0?...w/ Tim Cone

    If you're that dominant Center, why can't you save your team?

    Mini-clips show CHOICE MOMENTS but it doesn't show the whole picture. A game, a series, an 8-game unbeaten streak provides a better explanation.

  10. #10
    simpleng matematik pinapalala mo pa.. sabi nga diba sa isang commentator for ros and alaska sa isang blog.. its not how you compare for stats.. its not the stats. its the players on how to make plays..

    yeah pingris may be ahead of stats but that doesnt mean he maybe better against thoss..

    remember its hard to compare chris andersen = pingris against tim duncan = sonny thoss..

    fundamentaly sound. thoss has a variety of moves on lowpost.. and in defense he is a monster against imports..

    for pingris.. he better yet show his skills in defending greater imports or bigger centers like thoss, taulava or even shaquille oneal to make his name the great defender in what your opinion is saying

  11. #11
    Quote Originally Posted by calvinabueva View Post
    simpleng matematik pinapalala mo pa.. sabi nga diba sa isang commentator for ros and alaska sa isang blog.. its not how you compare for stats.. its not the stats. its the players on how to make plays..

    yeah pingris may be ahead of stats but that doesnt mean he maybe better against thoss..

    remember its hard to compare chris andersen = pingris against tim duncan = sonny thoss..

    fundamentaly sound. thoss has a variety of moves on lowpost.. and in defense he is a monster against imports..

    for pingris.. he better yet show his skills in defending greater imports or bigger centers like thoss, taulava or even shaquille oneal to make his name the great defender in what your opinion is saying
    Last time I checked this is thread is about RDO or Pingris not Pingris or Thoss

    Anyway nasagot na ni sir JPM

    Defense: Pingris
    Offense: RDO

    Both are very good doing with their respective roles. RDO mapa PBA or FIBA Asia maasahan mo yan sa offense and tigin ni RDO sa sarili is more of a role player than a superstar kaya actually kahit kaninong coach maasahan mo yan si RDO.

    For Pingris same din kay RDO he thinks himself as a role player than a superstar and one of the best defensive player today. Para sa akin Pingris is a Freddie Abuda on steroids

  12. #12
    Pati ikaw naco-confuse na sa pinagpopost mo. A sign of a person running out of rational explanation.

    You say Pingris is superior statistically than Thoss. You're saying Thoss is better and even referenced it to a blog "kuno" - it's how players make plays.

    Well...what I can say is... a play no matter how simple or fancy it was done, what really counts is if it contributed to a WIN. Kahit isang damukal na highlight plays ang gawin ng player if in the end TALO pa rin, it doesn't matter. I'd rather see simple plays - either on offense or defense that makes a mark in the game. Again, a swept series and an 8-game winning streak more than confirms that Pingris is doing the right plays for his team.

    You have a penchant for comparing players. Andersen=Pingris, Duncan=Thoss...ano pa? previously on your alternicks, sinabi mo rin Paul=Tenorio pero ngayon si Casio na. Bryant=Miller pero ngayon si Cyrus na. Dati tinitira mo si Hontiveros, pero ngayon Ray Allen na sya.

    Mas natatawa ako dito. Naging defensive monster na pala si Thoss as compared to Ping. Eh kung tutuusin, ngayon pa lang nagpapakita si Sonny ng improvement nya on defense. Naka-ilang Defensive team citation na ba sya?

    Aside from the lack of sense, there is an obvious bias in your comparisons...But people don't care about comparisons. They will simply look at 3 things: statistics, intangible contributions to team and the most important of all...WINS for the team.

  13. #13
    ano kaya ang title ng Thread na ito? d ba, Marc Pingris or Ranidel de Ocampo?

    may mga tao talaga na......................

  14. #14
    May trying hard kasi na pinipilit ipasok ang ilang players sa lahat ng thread.

    Ang pinag-uusapan eh sina Pingris at RDO. Biglang isiningit si "Defensive monster". Naglagay pa ng mini-clip.

  15. #15

    Wink

    Quote Originally Posted by Loofee View Post
    May trying hard kasi na pinipilit ipasok ang ilang players sa lahat ng thread.

    Ang pinag-uusapan eh sina Pingris at RDO. Biglang isiningit si "Defensive monster". Naglagay pa ng mini-clip.
    agree ako dito --- 100%

  16. #16
    If i already have three all-stars, i'll take Ping,
    If i have a poor team like Air 21, Barako or Global Port, i'll take RDO

  17. #17
    kay thoss ako <---- dwight howard ng PBA daw

    hehe

  18. #18
    hay nako loffee.. kaya ka natanggal sa pagiging mod dito e.. madali kang mapikon

    relax lang. argumento ito at opinyon hindi ito personal na away ni thoss at pingris.. kaya ko naisama si thoss kasi sinasabi mo sa posts mo kaya ni pingris butatain lahat kasama na si rdo at thoss.. pinakita ko lang na weak pa si pingris at nananalo lang dahil may mga kakampeng.. hindi lang magulang.. pati referee pa .. anyway tama na away dto walang patutunguhan.. sige panalo na si pingris...



    sa panaginip madami pa syang kakaining bigas kay RDO

  19. #19
    akala naman nung isa dito may napipikon pa sa kanya. nahiya pang isama si dabist sa comparison.

  20. #20
    kala ko bulag iyong isa dito.. nababasa pala mga sinusulat ko

    nga pala nagpapabati si jems yup ng maligayang araw kay max buwakang.... ut0t

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