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  1. #1
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    Protestant Clergy Abuse Equals or Exceeds Catholic Clergy Abuse

    Baket ayaw pag-usapan ang aral at ang gusto na lang yata pag-usapan dito eh iskandalo? Dahil ba sa wala pang umuubra na protestante/ebanghelico/INC at iba pang secta sa debate laban sa Catolico dito sa PEX ukol sa ARAL? So black propaganda na lang? Samantalang ang problema ng clerical abuse eh halos pareho lang o higit pa sa mga protestante kaysa sa mga catolico. Hindi ba't ilang ulit na namin yang inilampaso yang paksa na yan? Na yan eh problema ng lipunan at hindi confined sa Catholic Church at may datos? So masaya na kayong maging mga hipocrito?

    Protestant Clergy Abuse Equals or Exceeds Catholic Clergy Abuse

    By Bob Allen

    The Associated Press reported recently that three insurance companies receive upward of 260 reports each year of young people under 18 being sexually abused by Protestant clergy, challenging the assumption that clergy sexual abuse is an exclusively Catholic problem that does not take place in other churches.

    That is a higher number than the annual average of 228 “credible accusations” brought against Catholic clerics in records reported by the Catholic Church in response to media scrutiny, a priest observed in a Fox News commentary questioning why the story isn’t garnering more attention.

    While the report about abuse in Protestant churches doesn’t absolve guilty Catholic priests or those who enabled them, said Father Jonathan Morris, it offers a more complete picture. “The problem of sexual abuse has no denominational boundaries,” he wrote.

    The AP obtained figures on sex-abuse claims from three companies that insure the majority of Protestant churches in America–Church Mutual Insurance Company, GuideOne Insurance and Brotherhood Mutual Insurance Company.

    The largest company, Church Mutual, reported an average of about 100 sex-abuse cases a year involving minors over the last decade. GuideOne, with about half the clients of Church Mutual, said it has received an average of 160 reports of sex abuse against minors every year for the past two decades. Brotherhood Mutual said it received an average of 73 reports of child sex abuse and other sexual misconduct every year for the last 15 years but did not specify how many victims are younger than 18.

    That compares to at least 10,667 people who reported plausible claims of childhood sexual abuse by 4,392 priests or deacons between 1950 and 2002 in a study commissioned by the Catholic Church with the John Jay College of Criminal Justice in New York as part of its response to its clergy abuse scandal. That represents 4 percent of the approximately 110,000 diocesan and religious priests who served in the United States in those years.

    The U.S. Conference of Catholic Bishops offers an extensive annual report monitoring sexual-abuse claims. There were 635 new allegations reported in 2006, 9 percent fewer than in 2005. A total of 14 allegations (2 percent) involved children under the age of 18 in 2006. The remaining 621 allegations were by adults alleging abuse as minors in previous years.

    Protestant numbers are harder to come by, the AP reported, because the denominations are less centralized than the Catholic Church. Many churches are independent, making reporting even harder.

    “This bad news for Protestant Churches is sad news for all of us,” Father Morris wrote. “I would prefer the problem be limited to any one church–even if that church were my own–because it would mean more kids would be safe. But as I have said repeatedly over the last few years, the problem of sexual abuse of minors is not an issue of religious affiliation because there is nothing religious about abusing children. The phenomenon of sexual abuse of minors in church settings is the story of sick human beings taking advantage of their position of moral authority to prey on the weak and vulnerable. If Catholic clergy were to be faithful to their church’s teaching, there would be no abuse in the Catholic Church. The same goes for Protestant clergy. The problem, then, is not one of corrupt doctrine, but of individuals being unfaithful to the most basic precepts of their own religious belief.”

    Insurance officials told the AP the numbers of sex-abuse cases has remained steady over the past two decades, but churches are doing more to prevent child-sexual abuse by conducting background checks, installing windows in nurseries and play areas and requiring at least two adults in a room with a child.

    Still, said Patrick Moreland of Church Mutual, churches are particularly vulnerable to abusers.

    “By their nature, congregations are the most trusting of organizations, so that makes them attractive targets for predators,” he said. “If you’re a predator, where do you go? You go to a congregation that will welcome you.”

  2. #2
    Quote Originally Posted by ElCid View Post
    Baket ayaw pag-usapan ang aral at ang gusto na lang yata pag-usapan dito eh iskandalo? Dahil ba sa wala pang umuubra na protestante/ebanghelico/INC at iba pang secta sa debate laban sa Catolico dito sa PEX ukol sa ARAL? So black propaganda na lang? Samantalang ang problema ng clerical abuse eh halos pareho lang o higit pa sa mga protestante kaysa sa mga catolico. Hindi ba't ilang ulit na namin yang inilampaso yang paksa na yan? Na yan eh problema ng lipunan at hindi confined sa Catholic Church at may datos? So masaya na kayong maging mga hipocrito?

    Protestant Clergy Abuse Equals or Exceeds Catholic Clergy Abuse

    By Bob Allen

    The Associated Press reported recently that three insurance companies receive upward of 260 reports each year of young people under 18 being sexually abused by Protestant clergy, challenging the assumption that clergy sexual abuse is an exclusively Catholic problem that does not take place in other churches.

    That is a higher number than the annual average of 228 “credible accusations” brought against Catholic clerics in records reported by the Catholic Church in response to media scrutiny, a priest observed in a Fox News commentary questioning why the story isn’t garnering more attention.

    While the report about abuse in Protestant churches doesn’t absolve guilty Catholic priests or those who enabled them, said Father Jonathan Morris, it offers a more complete picture. “The problem of sexual abuse has no denominational boundaries,” he wrote.

    The AP obtained figures on sex-abuse claims from three companies that insure the majority of Protestant churches in America–Church Mutual Insurance Company, GuideOne Insurance and Brotherhood Mutual Insurance Company.

    The largest company, Church Mutual, reported an average of about 100 sex-abuse cases a year involving minors over the last decade. GuideOne, with about half the clients of Church Mutual, said it has received an average of 160 reports of sex abuse against minors every year for the past two decades. Brotherhood Mutual said it received an average of 73 reports of child sex abuse and other sexual misconduct every year for the last 15 years but did not specify how many victims are younger than 18.

    That compares to at least 10,667 people who reported plausible claims of childhood sexual abuse by 4,392 priests or deacons between 1950 and 2002 in a study commissioned by the Catholic Church with the John Jay College of Criminal Justice in New York as part of its response to its clergy abuse scandal. That represents 4 percent of the approximately 110,000 diocesan and religious priests who served in the United States in those years.

    The U.S. Conference of Catholic Bishops offers an extensive annual report monitoring sexual-abuse claims. There were 635 new allegations reported in 2006, 9 percent fewer than in 2005. A total of 14 allegations (2 percent) involved children under the age of 18 in 2006. The remaining 621 allegations were by adults alleging abuse as minors in previous years.

    Protestant numbers are harder to come by, the AP reported, because the denominations are less centralized than the Catholic Church. Many churches are independent, making reporting even harder.

    “This bad news for Protestant Churches is sad news for all of us,” Father Morris wrote. “I would prefer the problem be limited to any one church–even if that church were my own–because it would mean more kids would be safe. But as I have said repeatedly over the last few years, the problem of sexual abuse of minors is not an issue of religious affiliation because there is nothing religious about abusing children. The phenomenon of sexual abuse of minors in church settings is the story of sick human beings taking advantage of their position of moral authority to prey on the weak and vulnerable. If Catholic clergy were to be faithful to their church’s teaching, there would be no abuse in the Catholic Church. The same goes for Protestant clergy. The problem, then, is not one of corrupt doctrine, but of individuals being unfaithful to the most basic precepts of their own religious belief.”

    Insurance officials told the AP the numbers of sex-abuse cases has remained steady over the past two decades, but churches are doing more to prevent child-sexual abuse by conducting background checks, installing windows in nurseries and play areas and requiring at least two adults in a room with a child.

    Still, said Patrick Moreland of Church Mutual, churches are particularly vulnerable to abusers.

    “By their nature, congregations are the most trusting of organizations, so that makes them attractive targets for predators,” he said. “If you’re a predator, where do you go? You go to a congregation that will welcome you.”
    Tama ka Elcid, tingnan mo yung android na may alalay pa, yung Krams, dahil di kaya nilang ipagtanggol ang aral nilang baluktot, eh eskandalo na lang ang inatupang....Yung isa pang Muslim na BB, pwera lang parang perpekto na yung founder nila...tsk tsk tsk/

  3. #3
    husband of 1, father of 1 JaRvis_Jayren's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by ElCid View Post
    Baket ayaw pag-usapan ang aral at ang gusto na lang yata pag-usapan dito eh iskandalo? Dahil ba sa wala pang umuubra na protestante/ebanghelico/INC at iba pang secta sa debate laban sa Catolico dito sa PEX ukol sa ARAL?
    Please give this fellow some coffee...

    Quote Originally Posted by ElCid View Post
    So black propaganda na lang?
    Seriously, this fellow needs coffee, para magising-gising nang kaunti...
    Last edited by JaRvis_Jayren; Jun 28, 2012 at 11:51 PM.

  4. #4
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    Quote Originally Posted by JaRvis_Jayren View Post
    Please give this fellow some coffee...

    Seriously, this fellow needs coffee, para magising-gising nang kaunti...
    Eh di tignan mo hall of fame pare ikaw ang magkape-kape para magising ka naman sa katotohanan? lolz.

    Eh sa issue na nga lang ng imahe on the defensive kami walang lumalaban eh oh. Ikaw kakasa ka ba? lols.

  5. #5
    ElCid, this thread will not prosper because the thesis is weak. Your argument is that Evangelicals are worse victimizers than Catholic priests. But then so what? The fact did not justify priestly abuse. Each time a child is fellated against his will ( like what happened to you ) is like a spear thrust at the pure heart of Jesus.

    Thus, this issue is a non-issue to most of us.

  6. #6
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    Quote Originally Posted by Ateo View Post
    ElCid, this thread will not prosper because the thesis is weak. Your argument is that Evangelicals are worse victimizers than Catholic priests. But then so what? The fact did not justify priestly abuse. Each time a child is fellated against his will ( like what happened to you ) is like a spear thrust at the pure heart of Jesus.

    Thus, this issue is a non-issue to most of us.
    It is obviously a none-issue for most of you since you turn a blind eye precisely on this issue since it would make catholic bashing based on the premise of pedophilia and other sexual offenses hypocritical since this problem isn't confined to the Catholic Church alone - this happens to all sectors of society and sometimes even with more frequency and even abetted in other religions like Islam. But that is another none-issue to you since it is 'safer' for you to bash catholics than muslims.

    And the issue here is not really about clerical abuse or pedophilia for that matter. It's the propensity of PEXers to post issues about catholic clerical abuse which is already an old and tired topic which has long been admitted and settled by our side.

    The issue being raised here is not pedophilia per se but PEXers reluctance to talk and debate about substantial issues relating to TEACHINGS AND DOCTRINES. It would have been an issue if pedophilia is taught in catholic schools - but it is not. It would have been a good issue if pedophilia is OFFICIAL catholic doctrine - but it is not. It would have been even a better issue if the POPE himself endorses it. But such is not the case.

    So since no protestant, evangelical nor INC or anyone could ably defend their doctrines nor criticize ours - they'd rather dwell on scandals. Whose church anyway doesn't have any? I'm just stressing the point that many of the people here are hypocrites

    Wala na bang lalaban sa Catolico ng debate? Ha? Black propaganda na lang kaya niyo? Mga hipocrito!

  7. #7
    etu nanaman po tayo...

    Laging naka front ang evangelical sa ginagawan mo ng issue Elcid ah, personal na galit na ba yan?

  8. #8
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    Quote Originally Posted by jeric92002 View Post
    etu nanaman po tayo...

    Laging naka front ang evangelical sa ginagawan mo ng issue Elcid ah, personal na galit na ba yan?
    Baket kapag ikaw pinapaksa mo aral catolica - personal din ba? Eh kung lumalaban ka na lang ng discusyon eh di mas maganda pa para mapag-usapan eh aral? Saka nilahat ko naman na di mga catolico oh:

    protestante/ebanghelico/INC at iba pang secta

    Alangan namang ilista ko yung libo libong mutation ng mga secta tulad ng sa iyo na biblia lang DAW ang gamit? lolz

  9. #9
    Wow. Wala palang morals ang Catholics at Protestants. Parang atheists.

  10. #10
    ElCid, the big difference between the Catholics and the Protestants are not in your dietary tastes. You have proven well that pare-pareho kayong mahilig sa sausage, at lumuluhod kahit walang belo.

    The only and the crucial difference between your priests and all the other pedos is this one simple phrase: SYSTEMATIC COVERUP. While all other pedos are dumped in jail immediately, your Church has a whole set of system to frustrate justice, such as:

    - hiding guilty priests
    - doctrine of silence: Secrecy of the Confessional
    - parallel investigation using your Canon Law
    - billions of dollars of shut-up money and legal funds
    - abuse of the people's awe and respect to settle out most cases
    - the prioritization of protecting the Church's honor by smoothering scandals instead of prioritizing the justice to victims.
    - global prevalence of the same crime.

    No other church manage this crime in exact same manner than the RCC. As in the Watergate case, the COVERUP is bigger and worse than the original crime. And even your pope is personally guilty as he orchestrated the global coverup while he was head of the Congregation of the Doctrines of the Faith, otherwise known as the Dirty Tricks Department.

    I am not making this up. Some jurisdictions want to prosecute him if he was not able to hold on to the ultimate coverup - diplomatic immunity.

  11. #11
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    Quote Originally Posted by superlucky20 View Post
    Wow. Wala palang morals ang Catholics at Protestants. Parang atheists.
    Supermalas20 maski pagsamahin pa kami at lahat ng relihiyon wala pa ding tatalo sa sexual depravity ng mga ateo tulad mo. Sample na lang nung panahon ni Stalin na gahasain ang 2 million na german women from age 8 to 80:

    Kaya kung sa larangan ng kahalayan at kalibugan -panalo na naman kayo - mas magagaling kayo sa amin maski isama pa sa amin mga muslim na apat mga asawa lols

    http://www.exulanten.com/humanloot.html

    The American premiere of the German film A Woman in Berlin and a groundbreaking university study on German rape vicitms are bringing new attention to an issue long considered a taboo in German society: the mass rape of women by Soviet Red Army soldiers after the fall of Hitler's Third Reich.

    The movie is based on the real diary of an anonymous Berlin woman. Historians believe some 2 million German women were raped after Soviet and Allied forces defeated Hitler's army in the spring of 1945.

    For decades, German women largely kept quiet about the trauma. Now, a German researcher has embarked on a first-of-its-kind study of German rape victims.

    http://www.npr.org/templates/story/s...ryId=106687768

  12. #12
    Let's stop and talk awhile. tonton's Avatar
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    Ateo, gagahasa ka ba ng 80 years old?

  13. #13
    Quote Originally Posted by ElCid View Post
    Supermalas20 maski pagsamahin pa kami at lahat ng relihiyon wala pa ding tatalo sa sexual depravity ng mga ateo tulad mo. Sample na lang nung panahon ni Stalin na gahasain ang 2 million na german women from age 8 to 80:

    Kaya kung sa larangan ng kahalayan at kalibugan -panalo na naman kayo - mas magagaling kayo sa amin maski isama pa sa amin mga muslim na apat mga asawa lols

    http://www.exulanten.com/humanloot.html

    The American premiere of the German film A Woman in Berlin and a groundbreaking university study on German rape vicitms are bringing new attention to an issue long considered a taboo in German society: the mass rape of women by Soviet Red Army soldiers after the fall of Hitler's Third Reich.

    The movie is based on the real diary of an anonymous Berlin woman. Historians believe some 2 million German women were raped after Soviet and Allied forces defeated Hitler's army in the spring of 1945.

    For decades, German women largely kept quiet about the trauma. Now, a German researcher has embarked on a first-of-its-kind study of German rape victims.

    http://www.npr.org/templates/story/s...ryId=106687768
    Bakit ako panalo? Di naman ako komunista socialista ek ek. Padamihan ba naman ulit?

    Pareho ba yan sa mga ginawa ng conquistadores sa mga natives ng South America? Di ba Katoliko din sila?

  14. #14
    The Catholics were world power for almost 2,000 years. It is not just during the age of the conquistadors. So imagine ilang altar boys ang nabiktima nila. As early as in 100 AD, the Didache already mentioned the abuse of boys. Ngayon pa lang nasupalpal ang Simbahan ng dumating ang mga atheist. Pasalamat ang mga sakristan dahil sa mga godless, hehehe.

  15. #15
    Let's stop and talk awhile. tonton's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by Ateo View Post
    The Catholics were world power for almost 2,000 years. It is not just during the age of the conquistadors. So imagine ilang altar boys ang nabiktima nila. As early as in 100 AD, the Didache already mentioned the abuse of boys. Ngayon pa lang nasupalpal ang Simbahan ng dumating ang mga atheist. Pasalamat ang mga sakristan dahil sa mga godless, hehehe.
    How can the one true Church of the one true Loving God founded by Jeeezas himself with Peter guided by the Holy Mamaw be constantly associated with pedophilia? Since 100 AD pa pala. That I cannot fathom.

  16. #16
    Quote Originally Posted by Ateo View Post
    The Catholics were world power for almost 2,000 years. It is not just during the age of the conquistadors.

    How can you equate the arrival (birth) of Jesus with empowerment of Catholicism? Even Jesus had not been in power in the last 2000 years. In fact the whole Christian world is anticipating the 2nd Coming, as thy Kingdom Come.


    As for Spain, the conquistadors are not even genuine Christians but Conversos and Marranos or ill-fitting mix of Christian converts from Islam and Judaism. They are not prime Christian examples in the likes of St Francis who gave up the sword, abandoned the gold and embraced the cross. The reason why they became Christians is to escape persecution of the Spanish Inquisition rather than by belief and understanding in the Good News of God's Kingdom.

  17. #17
    PgUp, careful. I did not say 2,000 years. I said, "ALMOST 2,000 years."

  18. #18
    Quote Originally Posted by Ateo View Post
    PgUp, careful. I did not say 2,000 years. I said, "ALMOST 2,000 years."
    Your history is screwed up. You got no idea of Catholicism and what happened to the Holy Roman Empire. Some people do not even consider it an empire because it suffered from persistent war and chaos similar to the modern Middle East conflict for that much amount of time that you thought it had been in power.

    The Holy Roman Empire was a love-hate relationship between the crown and the cross, the monarchs and the clerics; or the state and the church. There are times when the church seems to be ahead and taking the lead but these can be considered milestones of history in this odd relationship rather than the rule. In fact, the Eastern Orthodox Church dismissed the Western Church as lame and weak, fighting for its survival as soon as Rome succumbed to the power of the barbarians in the absence of Roman military fortification. As the Eastern Orthodox Church rose in might and influence, the Western Church succumbed to the Dark Ages where clerics are persecuted and were made to support the campaigns of their kings who fought fiercely with one another. Thus, the cross was politicized and fragmented by chaotic and barbaric wars until the Pope manage to offer civilization and stability in the guise of declaring a Holy Roman Empire.

    But the Truth is the HRE was never holy and it cannot be a real empire anyway but a violent arena of war and chaos among former barbaric tribes that the original Romans failed to assimilate into their civilization.

  19. #19
    Quote Originally Posted by PgUp View Post
    How can you equate the arrival (birth) of Jesus with empowerment of Catholicism? Even Jesus had not been in power in the last 2000 years. In fact the whole Christian world is anticipating the 2nd Coming, as thy Kingdom Come.


    As for Spain, the conquistadors are not even genuine Christians but Conversos and Marranos or ill-fitting mix of Christian converts from Islam and Judaism. They are not prime Christian examples in the likes of St Francis who gave up the sword, abandoned the gold and embraced the cross. The reason why they became Christians is to escape persecution of the Spanish Inquisition rather than by belief and understanding in the Good News of God's Kingdom.
    This just shows how utterly incompetent the method of salvation your gods want for this world.

  20. #20
    Quote Originally Posted by PgUp View Post
    Your history is screwed up. You got no idea of Catholicism and what happened to the Holy Roman Empire. Some people do not even consider it an empire because it suffered from persistent war and chaos similar to the modern Middle East conflict for that much amount of time that you thought it had been in power.

    The Holy Roman Empire was a love-hate relationship between the crown and the cross, the monarchs and the clerics; or the state and the church. There are times when the church seems to be ahead and taking the lead but these can be considered milestones of history in this odd relationship rather than the rule. In fact, the Eastern Orthodox Church dismissed the Western Church as lame and weak, fighting for its survival as soon as Rome succumbed to the power of the barbarians in the absence of Roman military fortification. As the Eastern Orthodox Church rose in might and influence, the Western Church succumbed to the Dark Ages where clerics are persecuted and were made to support the campaigns of their kings who fought fiercely with one another. Thus, the cross was politicized and fragmented by chaotic and barbaric wars until the Pope manage to offer civilization and stability in the guise of declaring a Holy Roman Empire.

    But the Truth is the HRE was never holy and it cannot be a real empire anyway but a violent arena of war and chaos among former barbaric tribes that the original Romans failed to assimilate into their civilization.
    Puro semantics and obfuscations, blah blah blah. Alam mo naman ang ibig sabihin ni Ateo. Wag mo na guluhin ang logic.

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