DLSU-M standards...going down or up?

[sh_knight]

I graduated in year 1999 with a degree in Engineering. At my time, I still remember DLSU ranks top 2 or 3 in CHED and/or overseas school rankings among Philippine Schools Category...Engineering and Computer Science (plus BS Accounting) showing consistent high performance in Goverment exams but also in intercollegiate competitions. We are much recruited by MNCs and overseas like in Singapore. How about now? Since I am not in Manila, I heard DLSU-M ranking went down even below UST? This is not real right? Is Dr. Quebengco still around? Was she pirated to San Carlos in Cebu? How about the President?

[LOLOLOLOL]

we are pretty much the same great school, but we need to clean house and change a lot of things.

[dashingdevonair]

It's probably not that quality of education in La Salle has drastically lowered, but other schools like Ateneo have been more aggressive in introducing developments and innovations. Once only known for its humanities and law program, in recent years we have seen innovations like:

Doctor of Medicine-MBA program
Management Engineering
Health Science
Master of Public Administration
Master of Laws
Ateneo-Regis MBA
MBA-Health Management

These are professional and research heavy courses. It's not surprising that the gap of Ateneo and La Salle is pretty wide. A lot of graduate applicants (even La Salle graduates) seem to prefer taking their masters degree in Ateneo.

On the other hand, La Salle has been taking the saferoad. The medicine program is still under DLS-HSI while the Architecture program was opened in CSB instead of DLSU. We're still offering the same standard MBA program.

La Salle is still a good school but it has been resting on its laurels for quite some time. However we have seen developments recently such as the establishment of the College of Law and the opening of the new S&T Complex. Hopefully we would be able to catch up with Ateneo sometime soon.

[smarter_21]

@TS: I'm not sure where you got news about DLSU being lower in ranking than UST. As per the recent THES-QS rankings (which a lot of local universities in the country disapprove of btw), DLSU is still ahead of UST.

@dashingdevonair: I don't think it's a fair thing to claim that such gap exists between DLSU and ADMU just because graduates 'seem' to be preferring to take their masters in ADMU than in DLSU - that's conjecture at best unless there's data to back that up. While DLSU does not have programs as diversified as that of ADMU, our current slew of graduate programs also offer a lot of opportunities for research and thus, for being published in professional journals and contributing to knowledge generation.

In it's aim of increasing the number of students who will be doing research for the university, DLSU became more aggressive in getting quality high school graduates by providing more scholarships to deserving high school graduates (Vaugirard Scholarship Program, Gokongwei Grants etc.). It is also easy to avail scholarship in its graduate programs if one happens to have good undergrad and/or professional credentials (I'm speaking based the experiences of my colleages).

For sure there are still a lot of areas for improvements for DLSU in the field of research or in its newly established programs. However, given the above-average results the school registers in different board exams (Accountancy, Engineering boards etc.), the bulk of students and faculty that garner national and international awards/recognitions, and the high employability of DLSU grads compared to grads of other schools in the Philippines (such employer preference does exist generally speaking), I guess DLSU still remains to be one of the best universities in the country.

[dashingdevonair]

Haha yeah DLSU is still a good school. If I'm a high school student I would still enroll in DLSU. Reforms are nevertheless urgent.

Yes UST went ahead of DLSU last year. In last year's rankings, UP was 62nd, Ateneo was 65th, UST was 104th and DLSU at 107th.

Whether we use the QS rankings or our own observations, unfortunately I find merit in the contention that the gap between UP, the leading Philippine institution, and La Salle is incredibly wide. I'm not sure if the gap between the two has been this wide since the 80s or the 90s but I was fortunate enough to have studied in both schools and UP was a culture shock for me to say the least. The faculty and the student population are in a class of their own and a lot of La Salle professors would concede to this.

If we will look through the QS rankings throughout the years, it has shifted from being

UP-DLSU-Ateneo to UP-Ateneo----DLSU

I personally wouldn't rule out the QS as a sham, as this trend coincides with what the three universities have been doing in recent years. While UP is staying afloat, Ateneo has been aggressive as I mentioned before. La Salle on the other has also been trying to stay afloat albeit not as successful. In recent years we have seen plenty of capable faculty members leave the institution and efforts to get faculty members from UP doesn't seem to be effective (a few of them said they'd rather go to Ateneo).

The question is, what have we done in recent years to chase UP? Do we have a better faculty? Do we get smarter students now? Besides building new buildings, what have we done to strengthen academics?

While I'm both green and maroon, my loyalties are still with La Salle so I am deeply concerned with what's happening to our beloved school. Ultimately I want the administration to get rid of the "Mayaman pero bobo" image by enforcing stricter retention policies and employing a more selective admission process. Hopefully after they fix our basketball program and the new campus, they would start of enforce a university-wide restructuring of academic policies.

[vennd]

It's probably not that quality of education in La Salle has drastically lowered, but other schools like Ateneo have been more aggressive in introducing developments and innovations. Once only known for its humanities and law program, in recent years we have seen innovations like:

Doctor of Medicine-MBA program
Management Engineering
Health Science
Master of Public Administration
Master of Laws
Ateneo-Regis MBA
MBA-Health Management

These are professional and research heavy courses. It's not surprising that the gap of Ateneo and La Salle is pretty wide. A lot of graduate applicants (even La Salle graduates) seem to prefer taking their masters degree in Ateneo.

On the other hand, La Salle has been taking the saferoad. The medicine program is still under DLS-HSI while the Architecture program was opened in CSB instead of DLSU. We're still offering the same standard MBA program.

La Salle is still a good school but it has been resting on its laurels for quite some time. However we have seen developments recently such as the establishment of the College of Law and the opening of the new S&T Complex. Hopefully we would be able to catch up with Ateneo sometime soon.

Just a correction :

1. Management engineering has been existing since the 70's and 80's in ateneo. I know this for a fact since this this the course I passed in Ateneo in the 80's
2. MBA-Health Management was developed in the 90's again because of the trend in nursing etc the 90's and early 2000's

Ateneo actually introduced "mixed courses" just lately, DLSU has IME since the 70's. Introduced computer science in 1981. Introduced several variations of commerce courses. In fact, Ateneo stuck with the regular courses for a time and recently just joined La Salle in introducing new courses. The FEU-DLSU MBA - Law is also new.

I am lasallian by heart but I really like how Ateneo uses the media to hype everything that they do. In some cases, they create spin that at first it is "not true" but eventually becames true. They are very good at that. Many decades ago, I heard somebody being castigated "You are an atenean act like one" or "you must be good since you are from the ateneo" . I guess it rubs in and this becomes gospel truth. La Salle brothers are a little timid, likes to be with the company of students. How many times did I see la salle brothers play football or handball with students. They are more like "happy" people. That is why Lasallians are "cool under pressure" and they can go with the flow.

Ateneo courses are not "board exam" related courses. How many courses does ateneo have that has a board exam. Except for Law which is not even in the loyola campus, only ECE, Teacher Education and chemistry have board exams.

1 ECE even with accepting only a few students every year has not had a single 100% passing rate. The average is in the 50 to 60s. Not bad, but I expect more from Ateneo.
2. Teacher exams. Both Ateneo and La Salle do good in the board examinations.
3. Chemistry, La Salle and Ateneo have both bad and good years.


La Salle must intensify their marketing office. Last I heard, most of the employees are not La Salle graduates and therefore cannot market La Salle effectively.

Points to consider

1. We have to tell everyone that we have scholars in La Salle. Name the schools where they come from and the students name too.
2. La Salle used to have the alumnus news every 2 weeks or every month ? how come our website is not even updated?
3. Increase the number of students who take the DLSUCET. tell them of number 1.


just my opinion



This is just my opinion.

[sh_knight]

You are right...we need to catch up...DLSU or La Salle Institution is very famous worldwide but this Qs ranking showing we are either laid back or defocused on other things...like infrastructure investments which i think not 100% necesssary. I personally think we need to overhaul the system.

- Trimestral system may not be effective anymore. Profit-wise yes for DLSU. But for students, we lack the opportuity to go through each subject and students may just turned into studying topics that they think it will be included in the exam. We can't even finish the whole book.
- Lack of innnovation and pressure. I want to see DLSU students suffer, have re-take exams or get kick-out if they didnt basic acedemic standards.

We are just lucky that the name "La Salle" is quite famous in other countries like in HK, Singapore or in Europe which they have La Salle High School and La Salle School of Arts which we know it is not affiliated to DLSU-M But with this popularity, people get to know us too...

[sh_knight]

Take Academic Standards as a product to sell in the market. QS Rankings are like SGS or intertek where they check the quality of the product using specific metrics. Why ADMU offered thoses courses? Simply because these metrics require these schools to have certain measurable output. Even DLSU graduates often argue that we norture students to be "boss"...are they measured? not at all...who cares about this...

UP & ADMU know this. As a school, in order to keep up with "global" standards or so called metrics, they have to offer "many" courses as possible even no job vacancies.

If DLSU just wanted to maintain current courses, then at least consistently perform well in Engineering, Accounting, Medicine etc...and have more "industry partner" research programs

[dashingdevonair]

Ateneo gives particular importance to its "core curriculum", hence it's difficult to structure an effective curriculum on courses like ECE wherein students need to take a lot of major-related subjects. Kaya hanggang ngayon wala pa silang Accounting, Architecture or Mechanical Engineering.

I have to agree that the trisemester structure should be abandoned. There's a reason why Ivy League universities are using a semestral system instead of a trimestral one. A semestral system gives you the opportunity to study the materials thoroughly and there is likewise more retention. I experienced the semestral sytem in UP and I must say I have learned more, even though I took more subjects at La Salle.

However the most urgent reform necessary is the imposition of stricter retention policies. A student will be kicked out only if he incurs 15 units of failures at the end of each year. 15 units? That's more or less 5 subjects and I find that too lenient. I have some acquaintances who have flunked more than ten subjects and they're still in the university (and they graduated). Ideally dapat 9 units lang ang allowable failures every year. Anything more than that should be impermissible.

[smarter_21]

Whether we use the QS rankings or our own observations, unfortunately I find merit in the contention that the gap between UP, the leading Philippine institution, and La Salle is incredibly wide. I'm not sure if the gap between the two has been this wide since the 80s or the 90s but I was fortunate enough to have studied in both schools and UP was a culture shock for me to say the least. The faculty and the student population are in a class of their own and a lot of La Salle professors would concede to this.

If we will look through the QS rankings throughout the years, it has shifted from being

UP-DLSU-Ateneo to UP-Ateneo----DLSU

What's your undergrad in DLSU? I did some research in Google and learned you're currently pursuing Law in UP Diliman. UP Law is very selective that even a huge chunk of applicants who took their undergrads in UP Diliman or UP Manila fail to get in to the program; hence, it's only expected that the quality of the students there would be in "a class of their own." This also shows that UP Law is WAY more selective than regular UP courses (with a few exceptions perhaps).

So, I think saying that the gap between UP and DLSU has been incredibly wide by using UP Law as a point of comparison to DLSU's programs in general is not right. You're comparing the cream of the crop of UP with DLSU's general student body and it's not logical. I wouldn't say the gap is THAT wide based on my interaction with UPD peeps in competitions, the workplace and personal connections.

I personally wouldn't rule out the QS as a sham, as this trend coincides with what the three universities have been doing in recent years. While UP is staying afloat, Ateneo has been aggressive as I mentioned before. La Salle on the other has also been trying to stay afloat albeit not as successful. In recent years we have seen plenty of capable faculty members leave the institution and efforts to get faculty members from UP doesn't seem to be effective (a few of them said they'd rather go to Ateneo).

I haven't really heard anything about the trend of capable faculty members leaving DLSU. Last time I checked, the bigwigs are still in my college and the school in general has a huge roster of faculty from UP. I've actually had more professors from UP than from DLSU. DLSU shouldn't stop though in getting more capable faculty members, esp. those who've taken graduate studies from prestigious unis abroad.

The question is, what have we done in recent years to chase UP? Do we have a better faculty? Do we get smarter students now? Besides building new buildings, what have we done to strengthen academics?

While I'm both green and maroon, my loyalties are still with La Salle so I am deeply concerned with what's happening to our beloved school. Ultimately I want the administration to get rid of the "Mayaman pero bobo" image by enforcing stricter retention policies and employing a more selective admission process. Hopefully after they fix our basketball program and the new campus, they would start of enforce a university-wide restructuring of academic policies.

I'm all for getting smarter students and I think the admin is already doing steps in getting smarter high school students to enroll through offering more scholarship programs as I mentioned in my previous post. I agree with employing a more selective admission process. I think generally, DLSU gets good students as per my experience in the College of Business and Economics. Majority of my classmates have good numerical skills and are fast learners. However, I also noticed that there are a couple of 'bad apples', the types which would make one wonder how they managed to pass our entrance exam. It's good that they're more the exception rather the rule, and they usually get weeded out after a year or so.

I'd agree though with having stricter retention policies, like imposing a maintaining GPA across courses like what Ateneo is doing. This would filter out our grads better.

[dashingdevonair]

I also took a lot of undergraduate units in UP Diliman

Yeah I agree, matalino naman mga taga DLSU. I'd like to think that the admission process is now more competitive than what it was a few decades back. I was actually very happy when I entered DLSU because students are smart and they in fact do their assigned homework and projects, compared to what I experienced during high school. However if we are to compete with Ateneo and UP, we have to make sure that these students reach their full potential, and nothing will make them study harder than the threat of getting kicked out

Cheers!

[sh_knight]

I wish those faculties and admin can do something about this...i just dont wanna hear "Go La Salle...then turned-out to be Bo-Bo La Salle"...

Being laid back, complacent is killing the reputation we have established before...

[sh_knight]

Any faculties/ professors can give thei POV?

[MissDaisy]

We should revive our traditional values that instill quality education.

DLSU needs to stop growing too fast. We need to focus more on quality. There are simply too many students who are accepted, too many LS schools that are sprouting all over, etc. Quantity has been emphasized moreso than quality.

The trimestral system should be stopped. We should revert to the semestral system. DLSU has focused more on speed (fast-paced trimester) instead of breadth and depth. Proper pacing of learning is necessary to achieve breadth and depth. Learning takes time to digest, especially at the collegiate level.

We need to change our business model from being a "fast-food chain" into a truly world-class institution.

[Gooner]

The trimestral system is okay. It's proven that it's something that Lasallians can use. However, the administration and the colleges should gear into strengthening admissions and programs. Instead of creating many scholarships and buildings, we probably should allocate a good chunk of money to restructuring the system. It's not totally broken, but if we don't start fixing it right now, it will soon be.

And please, administration, stop creating mind-boggling and head-scratching policies! Focus on the set of rules and find a way to strengthen them!

[statespace]

The trimestral system should be stopped. We should revert to the semestral system. DLSU has focused more on speed (fast-paced trimester) instead of breadth and depth. Proper pacing of learning is necessary to achieve breadth and depth. Learning takes time to digest, especially at the collegiate level.

It's nice that you brought up the need for breadth and depth that a university education must have. However, I disagree that DLSU should revert back to the semestral system. It is possible to get both in a trimestral system.

For example, math/stat students take calculus (Math113-116) for 4 terms, which is equivalent to 15 units. Students from other universities like UP take calculus for 3 semesters, which is equivalent to 13 units. Another example, economics/business majors take basic economics (Econone and Econtwo) in 2 terms. Students from other schools usually take a 1 semester course in basic economics.

In cases like these, DLSU students in fact get more classroom hours compared to their peers. This also works for many minor and major subjects.

DLSU is well-known for its LIA-COM and COM-COM programs. While these programs existed prior to the institution of the trimestral system, it would be difficult to have double-major programs if we shifted back to a semestral system because students take more subjects nowadays compared before. There are fields that didn't even exist in the 70s and 80s.

[dashingdevonair]

The trimester system is actually primarily directed towards the professors. With a shorter semester, professors are ideally forced to deliver lessons efficiently and swiftly without wasting time. In schools with a semester system, a lot of time if often wasted on useless reports or group discussions. In short you should get more out of your tuition fee from a trimester system.

The trimester system usually doesn't work not because the system is at fault, but many professors aren't actually making use of their time very well. As a result depth and retention is sacrificed. In many of my classes, hours were spent on listening to our fellow classmate's incompetence through reporting.

The so called transformative learning does not fit well in a trimester system. Transformative learning requires a lot of time to be effective and time is a scarce resource in a trimester system. Transformative learning will probably only work in a small classroom of 8 to 10 graduate students.

Instead, lessons should revert back to traditional lectures and exams for non-project courses. There's a reason why Ivy League universities are still mostly relying on master lecture classes. It's simply the most efficient way to deliver lessons. Everything I still remember from college, I heard it from a lecture.

[Gooner]

The so called transformative learning does not fit well in a trimester system. Transformative learning requires a lot of time to be effective and time is a scarce resource in a trimester system. Transformative learning will probably only work in a small classroom of 8 to 10 graduate students.

Instead, lessons should revert back to traditional lectures and exams for non-project courses. There's a reason why Ivy League universities are still mostly relying on master lecture classes. It's simply the most efficient way to deliver lessons. Everything I still remember from college, I heard it from a lecture.

LOL YES! Tanggalin na yang transformative learning na yan. It is useless and is of no added value to DLSU-M.

[magfc]

LOL YES! Tanggalin na yang transformative learning na yan. It is useless and is of no added value to DLSU-M.

The transformative learning system is okay but I still prefer the traditional lectures. Pag kasi group activities hindi maiiwasan na may free loader at pa-chill chill lang.

[andresbonifacio2]

I graduated in year 1999 with a degree in Engineering. At my time, I still remember DLSU ranks top 2 or 3 in CHED and/or overseas school rankings among Philippine Schools Category...Engineering and Computer Science (plus BS Accounting) showing consistent high performance in Goverment exams but also in intercollegiate competitions. We are much recruited by MNCs and overseas like in Singapore. How about now? Since I am not in Manila, I heard DLSU-M ranking went down even below UST? This is not real right? Is Dr. Quebengco still around? Was she pirated to San Carlos in Cebu? How about the President?

Dr. Quebengco, along with PYT, and Bro. Andrew were the last great administrators of De La Salle. Now that they are gone. The rats are on the loose.

Right now prestige and quality is going down. Chairs and deans do not have simply the balls to manage their own ranks. A lot of professors are simply there for the fattest paycheck in the country.

A lot of traditional La Sallian families are now sending their children to Ateneo De Manila University.

Oh by the way let us not forget the dismal and abysmal image of the College of St. Benilde where professors fear their students (keywords: spoiled brats). A lot of professors from around the country is now avoiding St. Benilde. And also students are known for disrespecting their teachers.

In La Salle, today, it is one big fight.