Pinoy ba talaga ang mga Muslim?

[Bigot3AtBalbas]

Ilang beses ko na tinanong si bani kung pilipino ba sya dun sa "ipamigay ng mga kristyano ang isla sa tsina" thread. Hindi sinagot. Islam lang talaga sila, wala nang iba. Muslim, hindi Pilipino, hindi ano pa mang lahi o nationality... muslim lang. Proof that they don't integrate with society. They don't believe in the laws created by man in the first place

[java_man]

i am a filipino but muslim in religion. holder of a philippine passport. so anong problema dun. baka naiba lang ng pagkakaintindi sila bros ebra and bani.

[java_man]

ay may add pa pala ako kasi parang mali ang thread title. parang sinabi mo din na pinoy ba talaga ang mga katoliko? filipino is a nationality and muslim is a follower of islam (religion) so you have both. a muslim by faith an pinoy as a nationality. i dont see any big deal with this

[Baldozer]

basta ako hindi pilipino isa akong Muslim....pilino ay isang slave ng mga dayuhan kaya ayaw ko naman maging slave ng mga walang pananampalataya...

basa kasi kayo ng history para hindi kayo nagiging ignorante....paano tayo magkaroon ng kalayaan eh wala naman sa ating nakasakop....

Ngayon ko lang nalaman na ang mga taga Pilipinas na muslim ay di pilipino kundi muslim. Pagkakaalam ko yata ay ang mga muslim may kani-kaniyang lahi, may arabo, may malay, may tsino pero sa inyo ko lamang po nalaman na ang mga muslim sa pilipinas malamang mga illegal alien?

[Ateo]

Kasi si Java back-to-Islam na lang siya eh. Si Bani kasi ay Maguindanao. The Bangsamoros believe that Philippines as a geographic and national concept was invented by the Spaniards. During the colonial times, the Bangsamoro was never colonized. While we pinoys eagerly forgot our Bathala and adopted the Spanish Santa Trinidad, they retained their culture. They were autonomous. When the Philippine government assumed geographic control over Bangsamoro areas, they tolerated it on the assumption that the Philippine government would give them political and economic justice. Many believe that the Philippine government failed on that implied promise, thus forfeiting any moral claims to the Bangsamoro area. As an analogy, if I were adopted by the Arroyo family and fat Mike raped my butt, I would not have any obligation to continue carrying the Arroyo name. I would go back to my pre-adoption name of Dimawari, hahaha. Thus, Maguindanaos, who have history and culture far superior than Luzon, stopped considering themselves Pinoys.

Group hug, brother Bani.

[sugargame]

Kasi si Java back-to-Islam na lang siya eh. Si Bani kasi ay Maguindanao. The Bangsamoros believe that Philippines as a geographic and national concept was invented by the Spaniards. During the colonial times, the Bangsamoro was never colonized. While we pinoys eagerly forgot our Bathala and adopted the Spanish Santa Trinidad, they retained their culture. They were autonomous. When the Philippine government assumed geographic control over Bangsamoro areas, they tolerated it on the assumption that the Philippine government would give them political and economic justice. Many believe that the Philippine government failed on that implied promise, thus forfeiting any moral claims to the Bangsamoro area. As an analogy, if I were adopted by the Arroyo family and fat Mike raped my butt, I would not have any obligation to continue carrying the Arroyo name. I would go back to my pre-adoption name of Dimawari, hahaha. Thus, Maguindanaos, who have history and culture far superior than Luzon, stopped considering themselves Pinoys.

Group hug, brother Bani.

Following the same logic. The Muslims in our country should drop Islam too then lets all go back to the belief system of our much earlier ancestors. The Bathala religion and laws based on "Kodigo ni Kalantiaw"

I think the tikbalangs and the manananggals are less scary than Satan but would anyone have the courage to bring back death by antik (ants) bites as capital punishment?

[Ateo]

Following the same logic. The Muslims in our country should drop Islam too then lets all go back to the belief system of our much earlier ancestors. The Bathala religion and laws based on "Kodigo ni Kalantiaw"

I think the tikbalangs and the manananggals are less scary than Satan but would anyone have the courage to bring back death by antik (ants) bites as capital punishment?

No, Sugar babe, you were not able to follow the logic. The Bangsamoro chose Islam. They don't have problem with it. Their problem, it seems, is with the Philippine government who they believe does not have any moral sovereignty over them. The Manila government forfeited that claim when they raped the resources of Mindanao, installed pliant and corrupt leaders like Dimaporo, and failed to deliver on economic equality, thus making regions in Mindanao the poorest in the nation. The entire country paid for that mistake in terms of the longest rebellion in the world today.

At no time in Bangsamoro history were the Spanish, American or Philippine government had full control over them. They joined on their volition to call themselves Filipinos. And if the deal is not fair, they feel free to drop that appelation.

A couple of historical points:

1. The most relevant analogy is Singapore. Singapore chose to join the Federation of Malaya in partnership with Malaysia. The marriage did not work, so Malaysia and Singapore separated as independent nations. Now, Sabah wants out to.

2. There is no such thing as "Kodigo ni Kalantiaw". Did you hear of it in High School? It is cruel and embarassing fake. Check Google. It is at this point where I would have asked you to get a refund from your school, but I will excuse you because the Code of Kalantiaw was a proud and honored part of our history that turned out to be faked. And those absurd death penalties imposed by "Kalantiao" was just part of the sick mind of the faker whom we now know as Jose Marco, who should be ritually shot in Luneta every National History Month. Isn't that funny? The two worst fakers in Philippine History are named similarly: "Marco" for the "Code of Kalantiaw" and "Marcos", the "hero" of Bessang Pass.

http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Code_of_Kalantiaw

[java_man]

Kasi si Java back-to-Islam na lang siya eh. Si Bani kasi ay Maguindanao. The Bangsamoros believe that Philippines as a geographic and national concept was invented by the Spaniards. During the colonial times, the Bangsamoro was never colonized. While we pinoys eagerly forgot our Bathala and adopted the Spanish Santa Trinidad, they retained their culture. They were autonomous. When the Philippine government assumed geographic control over Bangsamoro areas, they tolerated it on the assumption that the Philippine government would give them political and economic justice. Many believe that the Philippine government failed on that implied promise, thus forfeiting any moral claims to the Bangsamoro area. As an analogy, if I were adopted by the Arroyo family and fat Mike raped my butt, I would not have any obligation to continue carrying the Arroyo name. I would go back to my pre-adoption name of Dimawari, hahaha. Thus, Maguindanaos, who have history and culture far superior than Luzon, stopped considering themselves Pinoys.

Group hug, brother Bani.

siguro naman magkaka idea na si TS tungkol dito. gusto lang kasi ata nila gumawa ng gumawa ng issue eh para may mapag usapan...........Yah salam!

[sugargame]

No, Sugar babe, you were not able to follow the logic. The Bangsamoro chose Islam. They don't have problem with it. Their problem, it seems, is with the Philippine government who they believe does not have any moral sovereignty over them. The Manila government forfeited that claim when they raped the resources of Mindanao, installed pliant and corrupt leaders like Dimaporo, and failed to deliver on economic equality, thus making regions in Mindanao the poorest in the nation. The entire country paid for that mistake in terms of the longest rebellion in the world today.

At no time in Bangsamoro history were the Spanish, American or Philippine government had full control over them. They joined on their volition to call themselves Filipinos. And if the deal is not fair, they feel free to drop that appelation.

A couple of historical points:

1. The most relevant analogy is Singapore. Singapore chose to join the Federation of Malaya in partnership with Malaysia. The marriage did not work, so Malaysia and Singapore separated as independent nations. Now, Sabah wants out to.

2. There is no such thing as "Kodigo ni Kalantiaw". Did you hear of it in High School? It is cruel and embarassing fake. Check Google. It is at this point where I would have asked you to get a refund from your school, but I will excuse you because the Code of Kalantiaw was a proud and honored part of our history that turned out to be faked. And those absurd death penalties imposed by "Kalantiao" was just part of the sick mind of the faker whom we now know as Jose Marco, who should be ritually shot in Luneta every National History Month. Isn't that funny? The two worst fakers in Philippine History are named similarly: "Marco" for the "Code of Kalantiaw" and "Marcos", the "hero" of Bessang Pass.

http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Code_of_Kalantiaw

Oh yes i do follow the logic. The crux of your argument here is that we are originally a Muslim people that never had problem with Islam before the Spanish came to ram Christianity down our throats.

Pre-hispanic history already states that we were originally animistic with small patches of buddhists and hindus before the Arab traders came to introduce Islam thru conquest and conversion. And yes we did have problems with Islam because there was sporadic resistance from the local populations The Bangsamoro people were not colonized? Yes they were. They were colonized by the Arabs.

Read for yourself:
http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Islam_in_the_Philippines

I am beginning to see that the much abhorred "divide and conquer" strategy by the Spaniards wasn't really aimed to weaken the "solidarity" of our ancestors (which was not there to begin with and nearly impossible to attain in an archipelago) for easy conquering. The real aim was to purge Islam. And they had good intentions for doing that after experiencing the problems they had with Islam back in Europe. Should I be resentful of Spain for turning me into a loving Catholic person? If they hadn't I would be like a dog overdosed in monosodium glutamate like the people in Indonesia and the Middle East.

[Ateo]

Focus, Sugar babe, I am not talking about you. This thread is talking about Bani and the Muslims of Mindanao. I agree, you did not resent your being a Christian; Bani also did not resent his being a Muslim. You are both happy in your chosen faiths, which thankfully not the same as that of the fake chief Kalantiaw, hehehehe.

My point is not to change you into a Muslim. You are from Luzon, presumably, and Luzon was not entirely Muslim. I did not argue that you go back to being a Muslim because I know that your ancestors never were.

My point IS only to explain why Bani does not feel that he is morally obligated to call himself Filipino. He can if he wants, but there is no moral betrayal in his mind if he does not consider himself Filipino. And that is historical fact, Kalantiaw or no Kalantiaw.

[sugargame]

Focus, Sugar babe, I am not talking about you. This thread is talking about Bani and the Muslims of Mindanao. I agree, you did not resent your being a Christian; Bani also did not resent his being a Muslim. You are both happy in your chosen faiths, which thankfully not the same as that of the fake chief Kalantiaw, hehehehe.

My point is not to change you into a Muslim. You are from Luzon, presumably, and Luzon was not entirely Muslim. I did not argue that you go back to being a Muslim because I know that your ancestors never were.

My point IS only to explain why Bani does not feel that he is morally obligated to call himself Filipino. He can if he wants, but there is no moral betrayal in his mind if he does not consider himself Filipino. And that is historical fact, Kalantiaw or no Kalantiaw.

And what Bani feels, together with the rest of our muslim brothers in Southern Mindanao is the cause of so much divisive mentality that hinders progress in the so called "Bangsamoro territories". No amount of money could ever uplift the living conditions of a given population suffering from this kind of mentality. They could have chosen the suppot secular "Maharlika" designation during Marcos' time if they had sincere intentions to integrate with the rest of the populations. Some muslims might say that the term "filipino" being a subject of Catholic Spain will be an insulting designation for them but the real reason is deep hatred to everything Christian.

He has no moral obligation to call himself filipino?

So let me rephrase: He has a moral obligation not to call himself filipino because that's what was brainwashed in his mind during his madrassa years. And I, on the other hand, am morally obligated to deliver him from the clutches of his evil, spiteful religion of hate and bring him back to the love and grace of Jesus Christ.

[Ateo]

...

So let me rephrase: He has a moral obligation not to call himself filipino because that's what was brainwashed in his mind during his madrassa years. And I, on the other hand, am morally obligated to deliver him from the clutches of his evil, spiteful religion of hate and bring him back to the love and grace of Jesus Christ.

Try. The Spaniards never quite made it. The Americans had to invent the 45 caliber to subjugate them to no avail. Marcos sparked the revolution. Erap overrun camps but never succeeded in ending the rebellion. Now, it is your chance in history, Sugar babe. Convert them to Christ. Amen!

[banimalek]

Yehey! nasa akin na napunta ang topic...agreed with Ateo...puwede na pala kitang magign spokesman

[Ateo]

This list shows the poorest provinces in the Philippines:

http://www.bukisa.com/articles/51159...pine-provinces

1. Sulu
2. Masbate
3. Tawi-tawi
4. Ifugao
5. Romblon
6. Maguindanao
7. Lanao del Sur
8. Sultan Kudarat
9. Camiguin
10. Camarines Norte

What is common in this list are these:
a. There are rebellions in these places. The rebels in Bicol are not Muslims, they are Christians. The rebels in Ifugaos are not Muslims, they are animists. Rebellions exist in the Philippines where there is poverty. It is not only in Muslim areas. There was a Muslim rebellion in the Philippines because of poverty. For so long, the Christian govt in Manila abused Mindanao as a source of resources, corrupt votes, and "new lands" for Christian resettlement. It was only later when they rebelled that we took notice.

If you know your history, which I doubt, you will recall that Maguindanao, Sulu, and Lanao del Sur were very rich and powerful kingdoms -- the Sultanates of Maguindanao, Ranao, and Sulu. They tried to join the Philippine geographic and political experiment and they were given a raw deal. They are now saying, "no deal." Can you blame them?

The only lasting solution of the Mindanao Problem is for you Christians to kill all the Muslims there (if you can; and that is a big, big IF). The other lasting solution is to give them a fair deal and allow them to catch up politically and economically.

[banimalek]

Bakit naman kasi pinapatulan pa ang thread starter, nais lang magkaroon iyan ng mapag-usapan dito sa PEX...

[sugargame]

Try. The Spaniards never quite made it. The Americans had to invent the 45 caliber to subjugate them to no avail. Marcos sparked the revolution. Erap overrun camps but never succeeded in ending the rebellion. Now, it is your chance in history, Sugar babe. Convert them to Christ. Amen!

Information ate-oh , is more powerful than the sword. Knowledge is power.

The real reason why militant Islam continuous to be a festering problem in our country is because Muslims have the uncanny ability to shield themselves from the truth, promote ignorance among themselves, and thus produce highly impressionable grownups who don't know anything else but the Koran. But now we have the technology to reach them from all angles. The truth will get to them no matter how hard they try to hide. There is no stopping me and the likes of Alaskador (have you seen his new website btw?) from rescuing their souls and bring them to salvation.

[Ateo]

Information ate-oh , is more powerful than the sword.

Hey, why the name calling? Are you insinuating that I am gay? Name-calling is a declaration of surrender. One name-calls when she runs out of argument.

[Ateo]

They call themselves Bangsamoro, which is at least more original than the name Filipino. We call ourselves after Felipe Segundo, the King of Spain, as if we are owned by him. Felipe was the husband of Mary I of England, and he could not even make Mary pregnant. Useless king, if one of the purposes of that union was to provide an heir and peace in Europe (between Spain and England). Sa pangalan pa lang minalas na tayo.

Our Asian neighbors have since dropped their colonial names -- China (Cathay), Viet Nam (Tonkin), Sri Lanka (Ceylon), etc. But the Filipinos seem to love Felipe so much.

Our historians tried to find our original name. Luzviminda was a candidate -- at least the names Luzon, Visayas and Mindanao are original names and pre-colonial. But the combination is tacky. Maharlika was strongly proposed by Marcos. But Maharlika was not a name of these lands. It was the name of Marcos' fake brigade though. Marcos was faking again; watch out, Sugar. But there were many good candidates -- from Rizal, to Katipunan to Atheist Kingdom of Asia. But we were lazy and not creative, so we keep our slavery name -- Philippines.

[banimalek]

They call themselves Bangsamoro,

Tama tulad ng nasa profile ko

[sugargame]

This list shows the poorest provinces in the Philippines:

http://www.bukisa.com/articles/51159...pine-provinces

1. Sulu
2. Masbate
3. Tawi-tawi
4. Ifugao
5. Romblon
6. Maguindanao
7. Lanao del Sur
8. Sultan Kudarat
9. Camiguin
10. Camarines Norte

What is common in this list are these:
a. There are rebellions in these places. The rebels in Bicol are not Muslims, they are Christians. The rebels in Ifugaos are not Muslims, they are animists. Rebellions exist in the Philippines where there is poverty. It is not only in Muslim areas. There was a Muslim rebellion in the Philippines because of poverty. For so long, the Christian govt in Manila abused Mindanao as a source of resources, corrupt votes, and "new lands" for Christian resettlement. It was only later when they rebelled that we took notice.

If you know your history, which I doubt, you will recall that Maguindanao, Sulu, and Lanao del Sur were very rich and powerful kingdoms -- the Sultanates of Maguindanao, Ranao, and Sulu. They tried to join the Philippine geographic and political experiment and they were given a raw deal. They are now saying, "no deal." Can you blame them?

The only lasting solution of the Mindanao Problem is for you Christians to kill all the Muslims there (if you can; and that is a big, big IF). The other lasting solution is to give them a fair deal and allow them to catch up politically and economically.

I live in Mindanao btw and have mingled with the poorest of the poor.
MIndanaoans are poor in financial terms but they are not in any way impoverished. Poverty is greatly exaggerated here because the people can still eat decent food even if they're not earning anything. There is so much food here that you can get free unlike in Manila where many people eat "pagpag". There is no such thing as "pagpag" here in Mindanao. There is so much food here that so much end up as animal feed. This place will only be a perfect paradise if we can just eradicate Islam. I'm inviting you to visit Mindanao once if you have time, You will learn that life here is 100x easier and less stressful than Manila. Just stay clear of Muslims of course.

And another thing. Productive agricultural lands here are cultivated by hardworking Catholics. Muslim populated lands are pristine and jungle like, with cogon reaching 4 meters hign. They wouldn't lift a finger to develop any fertile landspace available to them. Only a few of them practice agriculture. Many muslims would rather resort to banditry and piracy because they generally look down on farming. Muslims here will die of hunger without hardworking Catholics who pity them and give them food,