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  1. #41
    soundscapes blue_tracer's Avatar
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    behind d waterfall
    partly due to global warming. probably ondoy was the tipping point. and we'll just have to live with it.

  2. #42
    Quote Originally Posted by QT II View Post
    Both - us and our poor excuse of a "government"

    I just wish the next floods would wash all of Metro Manila away in one great deluge...it shall be Mother Nature's middle finger gesture against this and previous administrations. Let's see if whoever's left running this tropical h3llhole can muster enough pride to go begging to the US, Japan and China for relief.
    E paano kung ikaw ang naisama ?


    Oh, sh!t. May customer akong government official ng Malolos. Iyon at iyon din ang binanggit niya last year! Sa dami ng residence na itinatayo, nasisipsip ang ground water.

  3. #43
    The simplistic answer (i.e. idiot-friendly) to the thread question can be described by the following hydrologic process:

    1.) Precipitation (rainfall intensity) exceeds the rate of absorption of natural ground and the vegetation cover (infriltration) and the environments' capacity to evaporate (evapo-transpiration) its ambient water/moisture thus producing excess rainwater in the surface (surface run-off)

    2.) Due to natural terrain (topography), surface run-off and infiltrating water (groundwater) will flow to the lowest portion either to the sea/ocean or basins (lakes/ponds/). The transportation mechanism will be the following:
    2a.) For surface run-off, by drainage (gravity flow) through natural conduits and waterways (i.e. rivers and its tributaries)
    2b.) For groundwater, by percolation to the aquifer/aquitard/aquifuge.

    3.) Flood occurs when either or in any combination of the following conditions are satisfied:
    3a.) The intensity of rainfall exceeds the capacity of natural or catchment basins (eg.lakes, flood plain, dams / reservoirs) to contain the volume thus the overflow of surface run-off.
    3b.) The intensity of rainfall exceeds the rate of infiltration/percolation to the ground, and it also exceeds the capacity of the aquifer/aquitard/aquifuge to store water, thus surface run-off.
    3c.) The rate of flow of surface run-off to natural conduits exceeds the capacity of the waterways to discharge/drain to the basins/lakes or open sea/oceans.
    3d.) Extreme change in weather patterns such as strong storm surges, and increasing mean sea level.

    The parameters therefore for flood to occur are:

    A.) Capacity to contain surface run-off
    Factors:
    -Insufficient reservoirs
    -Lack of retention ponds/lakes

    B.) Capacity to store surface run-off
    Factors:
    -Insufficient water sheds and vegetative cover (deforestation, indiscriminate land conversion, etc.)
    -Surface run-off not percolating to the ground aquifer/aquitard/aquifuge
    -Ingress of saline water to the groundwater aquifer/aquitard/aquifuge due to grounwater drawdown or pumping from development areas (eg. residential subdivision using groundwater pumps)

    C.) Capacity to discharge surface run-off
    Factors:
    -Inefficient sewer/stormwater network and system
    -Diminishing natural waterways due to economic development (eg. riverside development, informal settlers)
    -Clogged waterways either by garbage or siltation

    D.) Climate Change
    Factors:
    - Change in weather patterns (extended and/or wetter rainy season,extended and/or drier/hotter summers)
    - Rising sea levels
    - etc.



    =================================

    S O L U T I O N

    Having defined the parameters for flood to occur, the structural solution therefore should address each or in any combination of the following the parameters.

    A.) Capacity to contain Surface Run-off
    - Typical solutions are as follows:
    a.1) Provision for dams and reservoirs
    a.2) Provision for retention ponds & lakes

    B.) Capacity to store
    -Typical solutions are as follows:
    b.1) Watersheds and vegetative cover
    b.2) Artificial Recharging wells
    b.3) Swales

    C.) Capacity to discharge
    -Typical solutions are as follows:
    c.1) separate network for each of the stormwater, residential sewer and industrial sewer lines.
    c.2) increasing waterways capacity either, or in any combination of the following: dredging the river bed, widening the waterways, raising the embankment by providing dikes or levees.
    c.3) reduce the potential of siltation and scouring either or in any combination of the following: bioswales along embankment, baffle chutes to reduce velocity,riprap/gabions/rock armours along embankment,etc.
    c.4) diversion for other purposes such as irrigation, power generation, water supply, transportation, etc.

    D.) Climate Change
    - Typical solutions include:
    d.1) Scenario Planning
    d.2) Improved forecasting techniques
    d.3) Infrastructure adaptation

    The above solutions will be part of a comprehensive water management framework in a regional or national scale and should be incorporated in the land use zonation planning,natural hazard & disaster risk mitigation plan, infrastructure development plan, and economic development plan of the region concerned.

  4. #44
    Bee-doh bee-doh bee-doh bee QT II's Avatar
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    Oct 2007
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    Zombeeland
    Quote Originally Posted by faux_ph View Post
    The simplistic answer (i.e. idiot-friendly) to the thread question can be described by the following hydrologic process:

    1.) Precipitation (rainfall intensity) exceeds the rate of absorption of natural ground and the vegetation cover (infriltration) and the environments' capacity to evaporate (evapo-transpiration) its ambient water/moisture thus producing excess rainwater in the surface (surface run-off)

    2.) Due to natural terrain (topography), surface run-off and infiltrating water (groundwater) will flow to the lowest portion either to the sea/ocean or basins (lakes/ponds/). The transportation mechanism will be the following:
    2a.) For surface run-off, by drainage (gravity flow) through natural conduits and waterways (i.e. rivers and its tributaries)
    2b.) For groundwater, by percolation to the aquifer/aquitard/aquifuge.

    3.) Flood occurs when either or in any combination of the following conditions are satisfied:
    3a.) The intensity of rainfall exceeds the capacity of natural or catchment basins (eg.lakes, flood plain, dams / reservoirs) to contain the volume thus the overflow of surface run-off.
    3b.) The intensity of rainfall exceeds the rate of infiltration/percolation to the ground, and it also exceeds the capacity of the aquifer/aquitard/aquifuge to store water, thus surface run-off.
    3c.) The rate of flow of surface run-off to natural conduits exceeds the capacity of the waterways to discharge/drain to the basins/lakes or open sea/oceans.
    3d.) Extreme change in weather patterns such as strong storm surges, and increasing mean sea level.

    The parameters therefore for flood to occur are:

    A.) Capacity to contain surface run-off
    Factors:
    -Insufficient reservoirs
    -Lack of retention ponds/lakes

    B.) Capacity to store surface run-off
    Factors:
    -Insufficient water sheds and vegetative cover (deforestation, indiscriminate land conversion, etc.)
    -Surface run-off not percolating to the ground aquifer/aquitard/aquifuge
    -Ingress of saline water to the groundwater aquifer/aquitard/aquifuge due to grounwater drawdown or pumping from development areas (eg. residential subdivision using groundwater pumps)

    C.) Capacity to discharge surface run-off
    Factors:
    -Inefficient sewer/stormwater network and system
    -Diminishing natural waterways due to economic development (eg. riverside development, informal settlers)
    -Clogged waterways either by garbage or siltation

    D.) Climate Change
    Factors:
    - Change in weather patterns (extended and/or wetter rainy season,extended and/or drier/hotter summers)
    - Rising sea levels
    - etc.



    =================================

    S O L U T I O N

    Having defined the parameters for flood to occur, the structural solution therefore should address each or in any combination of the following the parameters.

    A.) Capacity to contain Surface Run-off
    - Typical solutions are as follows:
    a.1) Provision for dams and reservoirs
    a.2) Provision for retention ponds & lakes

    B.) Capacity to store
    -Typical solutions are as follows:
    b.1) Watersheds and vegetative cover
    b.2) Artificial Recharging wells
    b.3) Swales

    C.) Capacity to discharge
    -Typical solutions are as follows:
    c.1) separate network for each of the stormwater, residential sewer and industrial sewer lines.
    c.2) increasing waterways capacity either, or in any combination of the following: dredging the river bed, widening the waterways, raising the embankment by providing dikes or levees.
    c.3) reduce the potential of siltation and scouring either or in any combination of the following: bioswales along embankment, baffle chutes to reduce velocity,riprap/gabions/rock armours along embankment,etc.
    c.4) diversion for other purposes such as irrigation, power generation, water supply, transportation, etc.

    D.) Climate Change
    - Typical solutions include:
    d.1) Scenario Planning
    d.2) Improved forecasting techniques
    d.3) Infrastructure adaptation

    The above solutions will be part of a comprehensive water management framework in a regional or national scale and should be incorporated in the land use zonation planning,natural hazard & disaster risk mitigation plan, infrastructure development plan, and economic development plan of the region concerned.
    Why not work for DPWH?

  5. #45
    ^ marami naman magagaling sa dpwh.. yun nga lang they cannot turn bright ideas into reality.

  6. #46
    Working in planning departments is not all about technical know-how din kasi. There's also politics, rhetoric, and economics.

  7. #47
    Quote Originally Posted by QT II View Post
    Why not work for DPWH?
    Thanks but no thanks. Even if I work with DPWH, these solutions don't make it to the top because all of these will be watered down to only one or two (or worst, shot down) because of several reasons I don't even want to enumerate. The best I could do is put forward these ideas, and hope somebody here could influence policy-makers and decision-makers to consider these ideas and solutions in a bigger picture and longer time frame, and not just a band-aid/temporary solution.

    Solutions to problems like flood tend to be synergistic, wide ranging and trade-offs of a lot of different factors as I mentioned before:

    The above solutions will be part of a comprehensive water management framework in a regional or national scale and should be incorporated in the land use zonation planning,natural hazard & disaster risk mitigation plan, infrastructure development plan, and economic development plan of the region concerned.
    Otherwise, precious resources like calamity/emergency funds and foreign-assisted development aids are just wasted year-in and year-out on projects/solutions that does not address perennial problems like flood and other natural hazards in the context of economic development. You know what they say when you keep doing things over and over again expecting a different result...

  8. #48
    kasi para kay ***** kurapsyon lang daw ang problema ...

    other problems are nonexistent...

  9. #49
    hindi madaling bumaha sa Pinas...malakas lang talaga ang buhos ng ulan. dito sa UAE umulan lang ng tulad ng Signal 1 sa Pinas eh lubog na as in lubog

  10. #50
    I am not a Critic TuxTips's Avatar
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    I am a TAXpayer!
    Quote Originally Posted by QT II View Post
    Both - us and our poor excuse of a "government"
    Its the job of the government.
    Us(citizen) job is to pay tax.

    Tax is obligatory
    Public Service is voluntary, if they cant fix our problem, RESIGN.

  11. #51
    Member
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    San Francisco CA
    Wrong Disposal Of Garbage/trash

  12. #52
    Spirit of Vengeance Ghost Rider's Avatar
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    Hueco Mundo
    Quote Originally Posted by ponga_es View Post
    hindi madaling bumaha sa Pinas...malakas lang talaga ang buhos ng ulan. dito sa UAE umulan lang ng tulad ng Signal 1 sa Pinas eh lubog na as in lubog
    You are like comparing apples to oranges.

    Just study the geography and climate pattern of the two countries.

    If UAE has the same climate pattern of ours, sigurado ako hindi ganyan ang structures regarding sa drainage at lalong hindi ganyan ang natural environment dyan.

  13. #53
    Spirit of Vengeance Ghost Rider's Avatar
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    Oct 2005
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    Hueco Mundo
    Dredging projects, post solution cause by illegal logging.

    Kung marami lang puno sa gubat sa mga kabundukan, we have minimized the siltation level of inland water bodies. Nabawasan din sana ang water na pumupunta sa mga dams.

    Ngayon, we need to spend billions of pesos para sa dredging projects, which sa tingin ko masasayang din dahi in a few years or more, ganun ulit dahil wala ng puno na tumutulong sa pag-hold ng soil and prevent erosion (surface run-offs).

    People are now experiencing the greediness of illegal loggers and logging firms. Gagastusan pa natin.

  14. #54
    How sad, isn't it? Bottomless Greed and broken politics.

    And yet we as a pleople won't do the root of these evils:

    Politicians able to hide their loot in plain sight, because of protection provided by law.

  15. #55
    Quote Originally Posted by Ghost Rider View Post
    Dredging projects, post solution cause by illegal logging.

    Kung marami lang puno sa gubat sa mga kabundukan, we have minimized the siltation level of inland water bodies. Nabawasan din sana ang water na pumupunta sa mga dams.

    Ngayon, we need to spend billions of pesos para sa dredging projects, which sa tingin ko masasayang din dahi in a few years or more, ganun ulit dahil wala ng puno na tumutulong sa pag-hold ng soil and prevent erosion (surface run-offs).

    People are now experiencing the greediness of illegal loggers and logging firms. Gagastusan pa natin.

    Tumpak! Sa ngayon dredging na naman ang naiisip na band-aid solution ng mga genius sa gobyerno. Pati nga UP-NIGS, siltation daw ang dahilan. Anyone who thinks that trees don't have anything to do with floods and siltation should better go back to Grade 1. It's no rocket science.

    Couldn't they look up any further, take off their blinders, and train their eyes on the mountains? If they don't want to leave their aircon'd offices, they should just try Google Earth instead, doon makikita na nila ang mga kalbong bundok doon sa may Sierra Madre.

    How much longer can they afford to turn a blind eye on this issue? Pag tatlong bagyo na ang sunod-sunod na dumaan sa Central Luzon (na muntikan na mangyari) at lumagpas na sa bubong ang baha?

    Matanong ko nga, mas high tech ba ang mga private armies ng illegal loggers na ito kesa sa mga alagad ng Ampatuans? Bakit sa Maguindanao nakaya naman ng military sugpuin ang private armies, KUNG GUGUSTUHIN LANG. Pero dito sa Sierra Madre, ilang forest guards na ba ang napapatay doon? Ano ang ginagawa ng military doon?

  16. #56
    do i make you horny, baby? cuch's Avatar
    Join Date
    May 2002
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    clutch city
    Quote Originally Posted by kalyesiete View Post
    mga bisaya sa manila.
    kung walang bisaya, walang skwater
    kung walang skwater, walang mgtatapon ng basura sa ilog
    kung walang basura ang ilog, pag umulan..tuloi tuloi ang daloy..walang baha...


    noong panahon ng hapon
    walang bisaya sa manila...
    walang baha...
    nakow, yari ka kay dogblood pag nabasa nya ito, makakatikim ka ng galit ni annabelle rama hehehehehehe

  17. #57
    Los Indios Bravos albertus magnus's Avatar
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    Jul 2009
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    Maharloka, Mu
    Expect more stronger typhoons bringing more rains and flooding. Solar Maximum is still up to 2012.

    Flooding in Central Luzon looks like is partly man-made when 2 weeks rain flood was expected, release of water from the dam was not done. Our Water reservoir on dams and river system are all heavilly silted. Stoppage of DESILTING(dredging) and FLOOD CONTROL projects also is contributory. Another budgetary cuts by ABad?

    Heavy siltation on the mouth of Manila bay where Central Luzon river tributaries empty was brought about mainly by Pinatubo lahar deposits more than anything else. Siltation brought about by Deforestation on Sierra Madre mountain ranges is also contributory but more affecting Marikina and other adjacent environs during the Ondoy calamity.

  18. #58
    Nag me-meron baludoy's Avatar
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    Jan 2003
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    altoid world
    kawawa naman iyong mga kababayan natin na hanggang ngayon may baha pa din. sa catch basins talaga surrounding manila bay, numerous rivers, at laguna talaga ang todo apekto. a reflection of poor residential planning by private developers and government officials alike

    btw, misery truly loves company. if you watch cnn, the storms w/c brought so much destruction to our countrymen have also wreaked havoc in thailand and in the indochina locales. problema din nila iyong dam conondrum kung mag release sila ng tubig o hindi

    cuch: pabayaan mo na iyan si kalyesiete masyadong narrow minded. ako born and raised in manila pero i definitely do not share his views. in fact, i've dated several visayans back then (i'm with a manila girl right now) and a lot of my tagalog friends have definitely salivated for them from time to time because they're pretty, malambing, and intelligently eloquent

  19. #59
    ♥~i L♥ve u~♥ prEttyInDistr3ss's Avatar
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    dami kasi sachet ng shampoo, suka, toyo at kung ano anong plastik sa canal..kung binaha kayo, it's all your fault.. if you die from the flood, like as if you are worth any pity... pfft!!!

    kasalanan ninyo kung bakit may namamatay.. nobody to blame but you protohumans!!


    country of protohumans by the protohumans for the protohumans.. duh!!!

  20. #60
    Spirit of Vengeance Ghost Rider's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by prEttyInDistr3ss View Post
    dami kasi sachet ng shampoo, suka, toyo at kung ano anong plastik sa canal..kung binaha kayo, it's all your fault.. if you die from the flood, like as if you are worth any pity... pfft!!!

    kasalanan ninyo kung bakit may namamatay.. nobody to blame but you protohumans!!


    country of protohumans by the protohumans for the protohumans.. duh!!!
    Asus parang di binabaha ang China, ang tindi nga ng pollution sa inyo, industries muna before tao at environment.

    Nalason na ata ng mercury at lead ang utak mo PnD, maraming ganyan dyan sa inyo

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