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  1. #1

    The Beauty of Filipino Martial Arts

    I'm new to this and would like to start a new thread regarding the Filipino martial Arts so as to educate the people who for the most part are not aware of the effectiveness and beauty of their ancestral arts. (KAli- Arnis -Eskrima). These arts were responsible for the development of the colt .45 cal pistol model 1911 for stopping power against the "juramentados" or the muslim jihads of their day. What other arts can boast of this? In the Martial arts community western boxing as it stands today is said to have beenmodified because of Filipino Martial Arts, the old style of boxing had their arms extended and when the Americans came in the 1900's they boxed that way, but Filipino Martial Arts(FMA) tactic of limb destruction forced to bring in their guard closer to the head and body (look all of this up in the net and check out the old style pics for yourself) . The term "leathernecks" is sinonimous with US marines. In their gala uniform they have a black band around their uniform (parang chinese collar style) that commemorates all the US Marines that died back in the Philippines. Leathernecks because they had to use thick banmds of leather to proteck their necks from slashes of the feared blade of the Filipinos. The "yoyo" was once a weapon of the Philippines before a US G.I. brought it back to the US and turned it into a game. If these things sound new to you as it did to me when I first learned of it when I was In the US Air Force from a "Putih" (no disrespect intended), Then we have to ask ourselves how can we bring back the wealth of knowledge lost to us or hidden within our own people. Know this, it is being taught and prolifereated all over the world. The FMA have proven itself and is quite effective over the so called Macdojo or popular commercialized tae kwon do , aikido or karate in our own land.
    You have the use of information at you hands, Gamitin nyo ang internet , read about it for yourself. I have my own site www.rochesterkali.com, My passion is the fma, I was once guilty of colonial mentality but through the FMA I regained my pride in being a Pinoy. Stand proud Pinoy! know who you are!! keep our arts alive and well in our own homeland. Seek it, support the Manongs and masters who are still out there teaching in their backyards. MabuhaY!!

  2. #2

    Cool

    i'm getting tired of the 45's-birth-attributed-to-arnis thingie. the colt 1911 45 is just an evolutionary development by a country that finds itself, time and again, in a strange new kind of war. before the advent of the 45 auto, american soldiers were equipped with far more powerful sidearms like the 44-40 and 45 long colt, both single action revolvers. after the civil and indian wars, the US army stopped issuing these since their long arms already had sufficient repeating capability and power. double-action 38s and 38 autos then were introduced since the pistol's primary role had diminished and these types of handguns were far easier to shoot than those big single actions.

    when the time came to really test these 38s in 1901, they found that they lacked stopping power for any kind of enemy, not just a hyped-up tausog coming at you with a kampilan.

    boxing has been evolving since greek times. you see new techniques applied in each olympic event and pro-boxers just keep getting better. to attribute FMA as a milestone in the development of sports boxing is stretching it a bit. i don't think any of the great heavyweight champions and their trainers in the first half of the 20th century knew FMA. i may be wrong, though. look up jack johnson, jack dempsey, max baer, jim braddock, max schemelling and joe luis on the net.

  3. #3

    Post before this thread gets consolidated

    Douglas,

    Before this thread gets consolidated into "What daya know about arnis" or the "Pekiti Tirsia" threat, I thought I'd just say hello and thanks for the info. BTW, how are you? Remember when we practiced "push-hands" last June at the Kalideleon camp in Albion Hills? Yup, its me. I love it here in the Philippines.

    Nice web site. Love the pics.

    Take care.

  4. #4

    Cool

    You're getting tired of the .45 cal -birth? you have valid arguements such as mine because our history is a muddled mass of Hearsay, But you can't also say for sure that it didn't happen that way, The tausog offfensive may have been the final push for the development of such a firearm. To quote a compiled literature from the Veterans Of Foreign Wars (VFW) who wrote about the juramentados,
    A form of warefare unique to the Moroland was the rite of running juramantado. Derived from the spanish word, juramentar, the term described "one who had sworn an oath" to kill infidels. With hair cropped, eyebrows shaved and arteries and genitals bound (to slow the flow of blood) the juramentado waged a personal Jihad. Killing Christians assured one's place in paradise.
    The juramentado invincibility was legendary, stories of suicidal attacks were told around US campfires for years (spark!) In one instance , a juramentado recieved 14 wounds three of which penetrated his head and yet he fought on ( you work in a mandaluyong hospital right? I can attest to such possibilities as I'm part of the trauma team at the hospital that I work for.)
    As a seasond officer put it, "even the veteran indian fighters among them (army regulars) had to learn that "( a moro juramentado was more dangerous than a renegade Apache and twice as hard to kill" The Colt .45 caliber automatic pstol issued in 1911 was developed to stop fero moro fanatics ...VFW magazine may 2002. A letter from brig. Gen Pershing confesses, "The fighting was fiercest i have ever seen" He added "they (moros) are absolutely fearless, and once committed to combat they count death as an incedent" He also admiredtheir unswerving courage and superb gallantry"-regarding the battle at Bud Bagsak-more than 500 moros died defending the fortress.
    You can also read more about the model 1911 though the internet. You can't say that it did not have an effect because 100 years later, the US marines still talk about it, gun afficionados have mentioned it in their web pages and articles in gun magazines. Regarding the late great boxers and a question if FMA may or may not have influenced them? Historical literature shows that as early as 1765, Filipinos lived along the Southeastern coast of Louisiana, Filipinos came to America as part of the galleon trade conducted between the Phlippines and Mexico uner the Spanish crown ANd as fierce seamen working for the famous pirate Jean Leffite (Battle of New Orleans-Louisianna) A lot Jumped ship . The first filipino community known as "Manila village" was founded in 1880 in Jefferson Parish Louisina.
    What does this all have to do with our discussion? Filipinos have
    been in the US since the late 1700's you're right it's hard to prove that we may have influenced "keeping the guards up" which by the way was my point about the influence of fma to wetern boxing I was talking about their guard . You mentioned to check these great boxers? Please do so , check out the pictures in the net. LOOK AT HOW THEY KEEP THEIR GUARD!!) way out. This is how you boxed in the ealry 1900's, Let me educate you on a common Filipino MA tactic-We will not intitally punch you in the head or body, we will destruct your limbs , it's called defanging the snake. So when the American Marines boxed locally in the PI with the Filipino locals in 1900, they saw that they kept their guard up closer to their body-maybe because when asked- Juan would say. If you bring your arms out like that to me, I'll slice it with my knife. Keep it closer. In The FMA arts we demolish your arm with lower limbs (no padded fist to protect you-don't worry , we're patient, the head and body comes next! Just like the way they found some US soldiers ambushed -arms cut off- legs cut off and head on top (cinco teros cut to those of us in the FMA)Yes it is hard to find writen documents . A lot is from oral history as we guarded our arts secretly.
    But this I know is true- Just last month in a joint training execise with the modern day US Marines, the Filipino Arts shined. It was headed by Leo T. Gaje Head Of Pekiti Tirsia and Assisted by Jun De Leon of Kali DE Leon from Canada - we totally blew their minds" Despite modern firearms- bladed weapons are still a constant threat in jungle warefare and is faster to deploy than a fire arm. At close quater combat is just as effective. You don't cut bushes with your gun, bolo is easier- More info next time from actual statements taken from soldiers I trained with when I was back home at a training camp in Subic. Check out the Force Recon Battalion of the Philippine marines, asked them about their encounters, ask them if despite carrying their firearms how effective a ginunting or bolo is! Better yet, look in their eyes , see that thousand yard stare gained from being in confrontations where comrades have died, in both bladed and firearm deployments.- and ask them what"martial art" they use, -all your kicks , punches, elbows and locks mean nothing to their blade._ On my next visit maybe I would love to meet and educate you on our FMA arts or I can have you meet the FMA practitioners who are alive and well in the Philippines
    Mabuhay!

  5. #5
    Currus Meus Fractus Est
    Join Date
    Nov 2001
    Location
    Metro Manila

    Talking Kudos to Guro Doug

    Pareng Douglas,

    that's a very good reply to MacBolan_00 and his MacDojo way of thinking. no offense, pareng Mac, but honestly a lot of Pinoys are just like you, stuck in the Steven Seagal era.

    Doug, why not post some of those boxing pics here? Show us a BEFORE and AFTER pic or two. BTW, some people say that Ali got some good moves from his friendship with Gabriel "Flash" Elorde who was a Cebuano boxer and also an arnisador. He's dead now but his good friend and sparring partner in Filipino style boxing, GM Tanny del Campo, is still in Cebu and teaching their brand of arnis, both with blades or sticks and empty hands.

    The .45 caliber 1911 did come out in 1911. I've had arguments with some creep named Rosanna (actually a guy here on PEx, I was told by others) who kept saying it had nothing to do with the Moro wars. Actually it did. In 1911 the Moro wars were at their very peak...and between 1901 and 1911 there was incessant fighting between the Muslim Filipino warriors and the American troops. Doug, why don't you also cut and paste stuff from the Net about the relationship between the .45 caliber's invention and the Filipino warrior culture? Please post the actual URL links here for people like pareng Mac. Also some pics and other stuff. It's high time we wake up and get real with our martial heritage!

    TensionPH, whadya mean Pekiti-Tirsia threat? Hehehe! And what about the Daya thing? Wala namang doce pares thread dito ah.

  6. #6
    Currus Meus Fractus Est
    Join Date
    Nov 2001
    Location
    Metro Manila

    Talking Arnis/Kali in HOLLYWOOD

    Recently, I noticed that arnis/kali/escrima is making waves altho' silently in the American film industry. Take the ff. examples of recent movies within the past 2 years:

    1) BLADE 1 and 2 starring Wesley Snipes. Wes is a Pekiti-Tirsia student of Guro Jeff Ward, who in turn studied under Maginoo Guro Tom Bisio and Tuhon Leo Gaje in the early 80's. They met at some bar where challenge fights with prize money were allowed and became instant friends. Jeff is Wesley's stunt coordinator in both BLADE 1 and 2. Both movies featured not just kungfu kicks and karate stuff but also arnis/kali sword techniques and maybe some empty handed stuff like chokes, holds and disarms.

    2) MINORITY REPORT starring Tom Cruise. I was told on another thread by some Fil-Ams that Tom Cruise will do some arnis/kali in the movie! Coming soon by June's end. In the Philippines,maybe by September pa.

    3) THE BOURNE IDENTITY starring Matt Damon. Matt said in a TV interview for Entertainment Tonight that he prepared for the movie by training in the "Filipino arts of Kali" for 1.5 hours a day!

    4) STAR WARS EPISODE 2 starring Ewan McGregor. The Jedi guys were said to have trained in kali/arnis moves before they did any Kendo training. Weird, but in the credits the Sydney and Boston Kendo clubs got mentioned but no word or anything about FMA, Kali or Arnis. Why?! I guess the FMA aspect came out in their constant twirling (arko movements) of their light sabres. Last time I checked, they didn't have such moves in Kendo, which is always a two-handed style.

    What's next? How come no one talks about the martial arts of the Philippines itself? How come the Kali just comes out as a matter of fact or as a mere incident? Well, at least it isn't a hard sell the way karate and ninjutsu were hard sells thru those dumb movies NO RETREAT NO SURRENDER and AMERICAN NINJA series.

    P.S. I'm still waiting for the DEFINITIVE kali movie.....our own version of THE KALI KID with Mang Jun or Tuhon Gaje as the Filipino Miyagi.

  7. #7

    Post

    Hey Guys, I just read your threads on FMA, I guess I should have done so before I posted mine, This way I would not be posting another "bickering" infested forum. I spend too much time training hard with an art that I have so much respect and passion to argue about it with people on line- I do most of my fighting in my training sessions , I don't need to do it on my free and leisure time.It's easy to talk tough when the person is not in front of you and an empty barrel makes a lot of noise! Guys, The topic "The beauty of Filipino Martial arts" is hopefuly just that. To be able to appreciate what we can call our own. Not just in Fighting but in the Science of the art. Bottom line , All the traning and mastering of an art, no matter what doesn't really matter when it comes to blowing the guys head from the back or stabbing him to death when he is not aware of an impending attack! You don't need martial arts to fight or kill. Then why train FMA? because it is my ancestral art. I find it fascinating to find that even in the old days we were already doing plyometric drills. Neuroliguistic programing, pavlovian training principles these are the sciences, the principles, the arts that I appreciate. My reply to mac was not a castigation but an honest invitation to share information for I once shared the same mentality on anything pinoy. But I want to share with my pinoy brothers and sisters the same passion and pride I have found because of the Filipino ARts. I stress the possitive. I once was at a knife making seminar with Tuhon Bill Mcgrath, we were presenting the FMA. I noticed that a lot of my blade collection was crap compared to the blades that were presented by these craftsmen. They only looked at the quality of my krises and bolos. One actually made such a comment, with a sly smile, I simply said, "Not all Filipinos could afford to have such metals, what we lack in quality of material , we make up for in fighting skill, my rusty balisong and your damascus blade will both hurt if it gets inside my body" with that we presented to show our arts and we were the talk of that seminar. Now people know more about the Philippines. We are survivors, We can't afford barbed wire? - bubog sa semento! the "remedio" mentality may be frowned upon, I smile and call it Mcguyver pinoy style!! This is what I hope to accomplish, If you want to compare my art, do so versus other foreign styles, not common Filipino systems. Because not matter what it is, it's still filipino. Better yet, let's look at the similarities then the differences.

    I begin with - how do you teach such a weapons oriented martial art to children? You don't. Kids are immature in their thinking. you can teach a child to punch and kick, it still is not as devastating as a pencil in the other kids eyeball. The filipino arts went underground and was practiced in the guise of cultural dances, games and roll plays. This way a child develops the attributes and muscle development required for the fighting art but does not know that he is already learning how to fight. This is kept from him till he is mature enough , then "little cockroach" your game of sipa (tagalog) - takyan(bisaya) is actualy teaching how to kick-and balance yourself. The conditioning is if you use a heavy tinga and play with tsinelas! masakit sa paa!!

    Another game I used to play was shatong- it was a small stick (about 12 inches and a long stick) espada y daga anyone? while you would familiarize yourself with the games with different strikes at different angles , you already getting comfortable with holding a stick (weapon) this creates a comfortable feeling for the child. when the time come for him to learn the fighting art, he does not fear or feel uncomfortable when he knows it is a weapon.
    Ever wonder if hollen, tumbang preso, tex, trumpo develop projectile skills? (FMA -TActic how do you enter on a knife?-you spit the way jeepney drivers have developed the sophisticated conistency of their laway or uhog from respiratory infections right at the guy before you enter- or you can throw stuff at him (coins-towel-shoes -playboy mag-oops teka - tikboy nalang.
    Dances- naglalatik, thr dance where they are wearing coconut shells all over? these are target points of the body-can anyone tell me where they exactly are? But in the fma we would adjust it to the right target ares- the exchange of tapping each other in the dance , striking points.

    what's that candle dance? wher you balance the candle on your head and in a circular fashion twist your wrist (how to get out of wrist locks- better yet have a knife in your hand- have someone grab your hand and twist out of it)-pandango sa ilaw !!

    of course there's the tinikling dances- but that's where footwork comes in. In pekit it the three beat rule-you get in - you get out. don't stand there and trade blows, this is not suntukan. Stand there any longer and you risk being stabbed, get in get out. If you think of the forward triangle (brandon96) what is the timing and beat? same as tinikling di ba? A target that stands there is a target that is easy to hit, a target that moves is harder to hit, a target that stikes and evades is a formidable target...you want to be the target that hit you...that you never saw..LAGING UNA!(kalideleon)
    I hope I got your wheels turning in your head..share, doesn't matter if it happened or was meant to be that way..THIS IS YOUR FILIPINO MENATALITY AT WORK. We are survivors, we do what it takes to survive. This is inherent in all cultures and peoples. but each one has a unique way in expressing their way to survive.
    Share experiences, constructive ones, positive ones, you don't need to tell me how good you are or how good your stuff is or what martial art you studied.( This is dedicated to the Beauty of the Filipino Martial ARts), I'm here your'e there unless we meet it's a mute point. I hope this sheds light , a bright one I hope


  8. #8

    Post just some thoughts...

    compared to you guys, im probably the neophyte on FMA, but i can tell you that no one needs a college degree or be a rocket scientist to appreciate the Filipino Martial Arts. they're practical and functional, and thats what martial arts are supposed to be about, the easiest way to [disarm, defeat, stop diable] an opponent. movie martial arts, [w/ the exception of bruce lee's] are too "beautiful" to be really effective. what these can probably show is that properly trained , you can do amazing stunts [jacky chan]. now, i dont think we should be ashamed our "practical/scavenger" techniques to get by, coz this concept is what martial arts are about! say in arnis, no stick? use an umbrella, jeez, even a pencil[like doug pointed out] can seriously injure anyone! the point of this is that be the origin good or bad, us filipinos have found ways to adapt to our situation, althoug it may not be pretty to the "elitistas" or to the "banyaga", but for most of us Filipinos, it is pretty effective and it gets the job done

    peace all!

  9. #9

    Post graceful motions

    Actualy, I find the FMA quite beautiful in it's motions. If you have ever had a chance to see demonstrations of FMA done to music you will see what I mean. After all it was hidden in some of our dances. The "sayaw" of Kali De Leon is just that, a dance of the fighting motions, Guro Jun makes it a point that you actualy showing the art in it's lethal beauty if "suck" he'll gladly tell you so. Grand Tuhon Gaje and his nephew Rommel are quite graceful. You should see them weild their sword or better yet see their presentation of the balisong "song of the butterfly" it is poetry in motion. Bruce Lee knew that martial arts in movies and martial arts in the streets are quite different. You have to be a lot wider in your delivery for the camera to capture your motions. It is hard for the audience to appreciate martial arts that use economy of motion in demonstrations. Also note that it was Dan Inosanto who taught Bruce the nun-chaku and double sticks as he was a student under Bruce and eventualy lead JKD to what it is today.
    San Miguel Eskrima is an "internal " weapons fighting system using fluid motions rather than broken strikes to promote inner harmony that gives a calmness attitudes that is needed when fighting with weapons for it is when you are relaxed that you become faster with your strikes without expending too much energy. Note that it's founder Filemon "Momoy" Canete the elder of the Doce pares Canentes of Cebu was an artist who painted, played the guitar and was a Tango dancer. A San Miguel player would stand upright like a "matador" or "guapo" stance as he would say to correct Tom Bisio meaning keep your spine straight , chin up chest out for better posture and alignment of the body and it keeps you from using this tunnel vision when you are hunched and too focused on one point this way you see everything around you and not just what is in front of you. I am hoping to get some video feeds to show some demo stuff at my website www.rochesterkali.com, it's in the works. I will post it when it is running.

    In terms of practicality, the simplier the better always works best-when weapon to weapon encounters, the Filipino Arts have numerous disarming techniques- Yet remember, the best disarm is to strike and strike and strike then just blow-bagsak, or with your blade it's dis-arm on the floor, dat arm ober der

    Weapons disarming is actualy an advanced way of teaching you emptyhanded locks and breaks ( the difference between a lock and break ..is speed, if you go slow the body has time to adjust it's a lock if you go fast you can break or tear ligaments)-

    by learning how to disarm someone while still having a weapon in hand teaches you to be ultra refined so that when you are empty handed versus a weapon you have finger dexterity to make it easier and by training with a weapon you will have learned distancing - just like training for track and field by running with a parachute attached to you, when you drop the chute it's easier to fly.- that to me is what disarming is about . weapon to weapon-use your weapon don't lock up and get stabbed. emptyhand versus weapon- you have the advanced training to back you up. This is what I once again term as the sciences of our art- I have always been commended by my students who teach jiujutsu-aikido and locking shooto for the ease in tansitioning or doing locks. They often say that htey have the same thing in their arts but are impressed at the ease in which we apply. Well that's because we have to do the same locks with a weapon in our hand and becasue we have a basic understanding of the body learned from such drills as lock flow.bottom line once learned in drills then you must spar or drill it in real time and see if you can actually do it because the other guy will be fighting you back and he too is well versed in the arts.

  10. #10

    Post

    the irony of life is that here in our own country, there are only a few people who really appreciate the FMA. A lot of people have been wowed by the other arts such as Krav Maga, BJJ, Pankration and so on. The unique thing about the FMA is that we learn how to fight using our street smarts and not relying on some certain fixed technique. I myself want to study FMA but only if there was a school here in the south area at a price not above the budget.

  11. #11

    Post nuff said!

    i almost forgot about that part, guro doug! thank you for reminding me of the dance-like FMA's and other MAs for that matter! ones like capuera [correct spelling?] are just amazing to see, especially in action [altho the closest i got to see it was on tekken 3&4 ]

    anyway, i've got a question to all guros, enthusiasts and practitioners out there; is there really a "better" FMA compared to another? like brandon, he's very enthusiastic about pekiti and so are a lot of others, does this mean it is a very potent FMA? just a question guys, lets not spark any zealous other-FMA bashing comments, just an honest opinion please!

    blake - where in the south are you located? am from the south too! muntinlupa to be more specific, and you're right that there is a rarity of nearby quality and reasonably priced schools here... [y not join brandon's training grp? "shameless plug..." ]

    bradon - i've just joined the dlsu arnis team! sorry pare! it happens that my old teacher was from there! i'll start out muna with a school i can easily access first! no hard feelings! [after bothering you so much]

    also, have you heard the news? there's gonna be a college level competition in arnis this june 16... any thoughts?

  12. #12
    western economic slave
    Join Date
    Jun 2002
    Location
    Metro_Manila

    Post June 16 tournament

    Hi all.

    Yeah, the June16 tourny is an invitational tournament, Mahalin Ang Sariling Atin II (M.A.S.A. 2), Handog kay Grandmaster Jeremias Valencia delaCruz. It's an invitiational tournament, not just college clubs. Arnis Philippines competition rules will be used.

    Since I'm part of the organizing committee, I'd be pretty biased to give opinions about it.

    UNSUMMONED: So, I'll be seeing you around the tournament next week? I'll be the guy in glasses running around making sure all the grandmasters and participants are all OK.

  13. #13

    Cool don't light a fire baby!

    Once again let's not go there,
    Understand this, it will always be inherent to be biased when you spend time training in a particular system . No one can make any claims as to which system or style is better because in the end it is the student that makes the system or style work for themselves.
    You will find more common and similar things among FMA systems where the difference may be in the way they do things or terminologies are different but all in all they realy aren't differences. Instead to me you will find different interpretations from different instructors.
    I learned Pekiti Tirsia from six different instructors, Each one had a different take on it based on their respective backgrounds, One from a standpoint of a Buisness Math who was very scientific in analytical approach, one was from a military background-very tactical, another a court officer, one had a chinese healing background as well as chinese martail arts and taught me more about the body mechanics. and so on. I myself have studied 6 different systems and will continue to study . What you will find is that there will be particular systems or interpretations of instructors that will suit you best.
    My core system happens to be Pekiti Tirsia, but by studying Kali de leon, San migule eskrima , Indonesian silat, yaw ayn each one make me appreciate the other even more.
    Once again if we compare systems do so in a positive note, this is one reason why we do not flourish in our own land because infighting will result from this, You want to compare then compare styles, karate-kung fu etc. Keep it united among pinoy systems.
    As it is other styles are more popular in our homeland. Yet in other countries the FMA are alive and developing at a fster pace. we need to find a way to bring it back or improve it's staus back home , with said programs like M.a.s.a. kudos to such things like that. But in the end it's about informing our people who will only take note when it is presented to them from an outside source. This is something that is in the works, to try to get signed petitions started by all fma schools here in the US so as to send this to someone in the high ranks of the Philippine government and show that our arts can be used as income to the country fro tourism if only we flourished in it's teachings, As it is among you guys back home , you have a hard time finding schools or instruction. Can anyone get names and emails to such influencial people like "mang Tulfo-bakbakan, Or Sen orly Mercaoda where we here abroad can start sending emails from all FMA practitioners as a sign of requesting support for the homeland art?

  14. #14

    Post

    This is something that is in the works, to try to get signed petitions started by all fma schools here in the US so as to send this to someone in the high ranks of the Philippine government and show that our arts can be used as income to the country fro tourism if only we flourished in it's teachings, As it is among you guys back home , you have a hard time finding schools or instruction. Can anyone get names and emails to such influencial people like "mang Tulfo-bakbakan, Or Sen orly Mercaoda where we here abroad can start sending emails from all FMA practitioners as a sign of requesting support for the homeland art?
    The guy to contact in the Philippines is Carlo Laserna. He is just a young guy, a Sto. Thomas student actually. But he's dedicated a lot of time and effort to promote FMA on a national level through the Filipino Martial Arts Congress. I was a delagate at the 2nd Congress in February of this year. Anyway, the two main items on the agenda were the bill introduced by Congressman Zubiri to get Arnis named as a national sport. Secondly, there will be a martial arts festival in Dec (16th to 21st) to recognize FMA in the Philippines. ONe of the objectives of this is to promote arnis as part of a "sports tourism" to help the economy. Anyway Carlo has already garnered the support of the head of the Philippine Sports Commission and various other government people.

  15. #15
    western economic slave
    Join Date
    Jun 2002
    Location
    Metro_Manila

    Post

    Originally posted by tensionPH


    The guy to contact in the Philippines is Carlo Laserna. He is just a young guy, a Sto. Thomas student actually. But he's dedicated a lot of time and effort to promote FMA on a national level through the Filipino Martial Arts Congress. I was a delagate at the 2nd Congress in February of this year. Anyway, the two main items on the agenda were the bill introduced by Congressman Zubiri to get Arnis named as a national sport. Secondly, there will be a martial arts festival in Dec (16th to 21st) to recognize FMA in the Philippines. ONe of the objectives of this is to promote arnis as part of a "sports tourism" to help the economy. Anyway Carlo has already garnered the support of the head of the Philippine Sports Commission and various other government people.
    December ba? Akala ko minove na to March? I met Carlo last Saturday, at yun yung date na minention niya.

    Yeah, promotion has to be done. But slowly! Takot sa pagbabago ang politiko (unless magkakapera sila doon).

    Lobbying IMO won't do any good, unless may concrete plan. Kung walang planom hanggang privilege speeches and unenforceable laws on paper lang ang aabutin niyan. We need a plan.

    On Sport Arnis, it's admittedly a different beast and mentality from Martial Art Arnis. There are people who do nothing but train in Sport Arnis, for them, the sport competitions is all there is.

    PSC Chair Buhain has given the go ahead na?

  16. #16

    Post

    Berzerker,

    pare, it sounds like you're much more in the know than I am. Again, this is a problem here in that we don't know what each other is doing in the FMA community. I don't want to bother Carlo too much because he looks so overworked. But I'll contact him soon enough.

    BTW, where is the tournament on the 16th? HOw much is admission?

  17. #17

    Post Re: Kudos to Guro Doug

    Originally posted by Brandon96
    Pareng Douglas,

    that's a very good reply to MacBolan_00 and his MacDojo way of thinking. no offense, pareng Mac, but honestly a lot of Pinoys are just like you, stuck in the Steven Seagal era.


    [what's wrong with preferring hamburgers and fries to smelly kilawen and gritty sisig? i was into MA long before the first karate kid movie came out (and was already retired when niko came along.)]

    The .45 caliber 1911 did come out in 1911. I've had arguments with some creep named Rosanna (actually a guy here on PEx, I was told by others) who kept saying it had nothing to do with the Moro wars. Actually it did. In 1911 the Moro wars were at their very peak...and between 1901 and 1911 there was incessant fighting between the Muslim Filipino warriors and the American troops.

    [the .45 ACP was simply the .45 long-colt chopped down and the rim removed to work in an auto pistol. the 1905 survey bid for a standard US army sidearm was entered into by several entrants. the first question was caliber. the US .38 auto and the european 9mm were both scrapped because of bad experiences not just in the philippines but also in the US-Mexico border, cuba and some persistent indian groups in the mid-west.

    many revolver advocates insisted that even the .45 auto lacked the power and range to give the soldier a 'rifle' that can be carried in a holster. they suggested something similar to the walker colt .44 long-barreled revolver with a range and stopping power beyond 100 yards.

    on the other end, there were those who advocated a powerful, repeating rifle that will eliminate the need for a sidearm altogether. no handgun cartridge can match a .30 caliber rifle round when it comes to range and stopping power. show me a moro fighter who can stay on his feet after a solid hit from a garand or springfield inside 50 meters.

    the americans encountered two types of fanatics in jolo and maguindanao. first was the amok. an amok is simply a muslim (and in rare cases a christian) who spontaneously goes berserk and goes into a killing spree with guns and knives. these guys are relatively easy to spot and subdue. the tougher one is the juramentado who really prepares for three days before going out to kill as many christians as he can. he conceals an entire arsenal of knives in his body and launches his spree in a crowded place full of unsuspecting christians. as the american author of "bullets and bolos" described it, an amok is a bomb-dropping zeppelin while the juramentado was a stealthy U-boat. this author took part in the pacification of maguindanao and in the final battle at bud dajo. before going to moroland, he was in negros where he helped destroy the babaylanes whe were just as fanatical at times. he never mentioned any inadequacy with their issue weapons. his sidearm was a single action 45 colt. according to him, the key to stopping amoks and juramentados was to BE ALERT at all times.

  18. #18
    Currus Meus Fractus Est
    Join Date
    Nov 2001
    Location
    Metro Manila

    Talking Why Then?

    Why then pareng Mac did the Americans themselves say that it's the Moro wars that provided the main impetus for the developing of the .45 caliber pistol? Oh well, we're not here to argue. The records are there to speak for themselves, along with anecdotal accounts and narratives from a hundred years ago.

    It's hard to find quality arnis/kali schools in the country. You can find a lot of them at QC Memorial Circle, but you have to watch out for quality. Sure, they're all around at the Luneta and at QC Memorial Circle, and even in college clubs, but will you get what you want there? Will they just teach you fancy stick twirling or will they get you right into the meat of the matter? I remember when I saw this old man at QCMC teach; the guy was yes indeed oh so traditional and authentic, but he couldn't teach properly as his movements weren't effective. Caveat emptor......why not go direct to the bigwigs even if it costs a little more and takes some effort to get to?

    People should be willing to travel far just to learn. In the USA I keep reading in several e-groups about how those Americans would travel on weekends long distances by car just to learn from an instructor (hindi pa nga grandmaster yun ha!).

    False economy in martial arts is another hindrance to training. A lot of folks feel that training in combatives should cost just as much as a meal at Kenny Roger's or a burger meal at Burger King. That's OK if you want to go for big group classes where you have 10-30 people arrayed in lines a la karate dojo or taekwondo class where the teacher just asks you to imitate him and will not take the time to critique you right on the spot, giving you many days until you realize by yourself what you're doing wrong. Small group classes of no more than 7 people, with personal lessons have faster learning curves than big group classes ala karate dojo. People are willing to spend a lot of dough on gizmos and stuff they don't really need, but when it comes to their very own martial arts heritage, they'll scrimp and save. We're talking here of knowledge that you'll carry to the grave, buster! You won't lose it in a fire should one raze your house and all your precious collections.

    Wala lang...just frustrated how people would rather do other things.

  19. #19
    Currus Meus Fractus Est
    Join Date
    Nov 2001
    Location
    Metro Manila

    Exclamation Training vs. Discussion

    I agree with Doug that it's better to train long and hard than to enter into pointless arguments online or even to just talk about them. However, sometimes it just gets so frustrating that people would very easily and quickly lambast their own martial heritage and put a foreign art over theirs. Once in a while we get into arguments, and a lot of times the arguments would get nasty but the bottomline is, we still have our minds in reality and our own priorities focused on the real thing--training. There are times, though, when we are forced to be deskbound and the nearest thing to FMA other than wrist drills and knife drills while seated is the PEx arnis threads (see Mac? I know now where you're comin' from.............

    IMO, the best way to promote the Filipino martial arts is to use AN ENTIRELY PRIVATE SECTORAL approach. You can never count on government to get anything done, unless the politicos will get something out of it (Orly Mercado's thrust for arnis during Erap's time was due to the fact that FMA was his passion). Furthermore, a government-supported or government-led program would look even more tackier than those Presas books at National Book Store. I do not hate the Presas brothers but I do feel that in their good and laudable intentions of reviving FMA interest, they even PUSHED it way way back into the sidelines. Filipinos in the Phils. are inherently colonial minded and will only believe in something if Hollywood and the Western media tells them it is so--hence my empghasis on getting Guro Dan to reprint his book THE FILIPINO MARTIAL ARTS. Otherwise, people will always think of arnis as clickety clack clack bamboo fencing in tacky karate imitation uniforms and stances and blocks and kata positions. I should know, since as a layman before getting into the martial arts, I looked down on FMA precisely because of those books!

    I have my reservations about the tinikling dance and sipa game being secret FMA training techniques for kids. Rather than give them a secret arnis training identity, I would rather ascribe to them a major source for Filipinos' inherent grace and flexibility, the same way I'd attribute the African people's inherent dance graceful moves to their very musical dance-oriented culture. Remember, the Tinikling is a Tagalog dance and Pekiti Tirsia and similar footwork-oriented styles (Pekiti, among others are more footwork and mobility-oriented than other arnis styles) come from Negros Occidental and other locations where Tinikling doesn't come from. As for the coconut shell dance (maglalatik), I would be a bit more imaginative since the old people used to say that the maglalatik was INDEED a martial dance in origin, just like the Visayan "sagayan".

  20. #20

    Post quality training

    You're right, I only teach 3 people at a time because they all get my attantion, The tri-v formula that That Tuhon Gaje always talks about is the circular round robin training wher you are the reciever- feeder - and observer(you coach and critique or holler reminders. We also video tape our session and sparring to be able to see for ourselves ( you'll be surprised at how you think your doing something but actually are not)This I find is a very good way to train, Once again a nice outcome of the scientific way of training in the arts. As for lobying, send me emails and contact information. I believe it still has to be done. One day there will be a huge delegation of FMa practitioners from abroad who will visit at some big gathering and demonstrate to our people the beauty of our arts. Just like TKD (korea) Muay thai (thailand), karate (okinawa), kung fu (hong kong- china) etc. practitioners visit the respective countries to learn their arts. We can do it, YOu guys can make a difference , we just need direction as to working smarter at it rather than harder. I am here, use me and give me direction, vise versa.

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