Is UST better than Ateneo?

[letranistako]

Just a scholarly discussion lang po kasi I have respect to both institutions but I am starting to feel that UST is getting better than Ateneo. Consider the following posts and facts:

Originally Posted by freelancer07

UST is still the top private university rivaled only by UP.

Originally Posted by citrus_bean

University of Santo Tomas - Manila

Its leadership in Medical and science courses are exceptional. No one can under estimate the university's performance. Always included in the top ten in various board exams.

Last year,

University of Santo Tomas - Manila,
Ateneo de Manila University and
University of San Carlos in Cebu

was chosen to have a corporate partnership with Harvard University in the US. Various newspaper articles and billboards can attest to that in Massachussetts.

The top 20 schools in the country, based on this criteria are:

1. University of the Philipines-Diliman
2. University of Santo Tomas - Manila
3. Saint Louis University, Baguio City
4. University of the Philippines-Los Banos
5. Xavier University (Ateneo de Cagayan)
6. Ateneo de Davao University
7. Ateneo de Manila University
8. Silliman University
9. University of San Carlos
10. Mindanao State University-Iligan Institute of Tech
11. University of the Philippines-Manila
12. De La Salle University-Manila
13. Pamantasan ng Lungsod ng Maynila
14. University of the Cordilleras(Formerly Baguio Colleges Foundation)
15. University of Negros Occidental-Recolectos
16. Mindanao State University-Gen Santos City
17. Polytechnic University of the Philippines
18. Mapua Institute of Technology
19. Central Mindanao University
20. Adamson University

In the local scene, the latest top 20 rankings are credible.

UP Diliman participates in 20 licensure exams
UP LB and Manila has less than 15 courses that has a licensure exam each
Ateneo participates in 3 licensure exams
La Salle participates in 7 licensure exams
Santo Tomas participates in 19 licensure exams

Take Note: PRC conducts 49 licensure exams yearly

Universities with the most number of CoE’s and CoD’s

1. University of the Philippines, Diliman - 33
2. De La Salle University-Manila -16
3. University of the Philippines, Los Baños - 16
4. University of Santo Tomas - 16
5. Ateneo de Manila University – 13
6. Adamson University - 11
7. MSU-Iligan Institute of Technology - 11
8. University of San Carlos - 10
9. Xavier University (Cagayan de Oro) - 10
10. Saint Louis University (Baguio City) - 9

[Khaffalmhoukz]

Uh. Okay.

The message you have entered is too short. Please lengthen your message to at least 10 characters.

[purpleheadd07]

i don't know and i don't care.

[Carl Malone]

letranistako, I doubt if something "scholarly" (as you put it) could come out of this. That is, a discussion that engages the intellect penetratingly and critically and after which we would arrive at something profund and useful for many. But, anyway, lets give it a little whirl and see.

I am a Thomasian and I respect Ateneans. They are different in many respects and is better left so and not be compared. At best we can only make observations but not judgements. And we shouldn't even wish them to be the same or equal for God designed us NOT to be the same for a wonderful and holy purpose. Our common or innate sense alone would indicate to us the saneness and sensiblenes of differentness and diversity. Do you think it is correct to say that tilapia is better than bangus? Or kamagong wood is better than narra? One who says so indicates that he or she has a prefence but preference should not mean that one is better than the other. Or what if you have two children, one is emotionally intelligent while the other is intellectually endowed, would it be loving for the parent to prefer one over the other or to say that one is better than the other.

When one uses the term "better", it then invites the notion of superiority and involves ideas of preference. And if you say something to someone, even if subtle or unintended, that you are better or superior than he is because of some label or generalization, isn't that hurtful?

[letranistako]

Well, they compare UP and Ateneo. Why not put UST up there where it really belongs. Besides, facts don't lie the statistics I quoted are either true or not. Sometimes, I get this feeling that this school is just really overrated because of the elitist culture in our society when in truth and in fact a lot of institutions where most students are in (UP and UST) are way better.

Are they really different from one another? I don't think so both are learning institutions and let the truth be told that the oldest institution still has that distinction of being the best (then and now).

As I said facts don't lie.

P.S. what's profund?

[eugenebegood]

Originally Posted by letranistako

Well, they compare UP and Ateneo. Why not put UST up there where it really belongs. Besides, facts don't lie the statistics I quoted are either true or not. Sometimes, I get this feeling that this school is just really overrated because of the elitist culture in our society when in truth and in fact a lot of institutions where most students are in (UP and UST) are way better.

Are they really different from one another? I don't think so both are learning institutions and let the truth be told that the oldest institution still has that distinction of being the best (then and now).

As I said facts don't lie.

P.S. what's profund?

I think a lot of what you've posted on here aren't very clear with you.

First of all, medical schools are professional schools and are entirely separated from the undergraduate school. Whilst it is true that UST's medical school is superb, as it is arguably the second best med school in the country after UP Med, it's undergrad school/education is far from being number 2 in the country. It is not even in the top 5 in my assessment.

The top schools for undergraduate are UP Diliman, UP Manila, Ateneo de Manila and De La Salle University (in any order.) These are the favorite destinations of choice by the economic and intellectual elite. Very rarely would UST compete with any of those schools for undergrad education, and UST's poor enrollment yield of those from the extremely talented pool of students from elite high schools clearly explains that it is in a notch below those 4 elite schools. That is not to say however that UST isn't a good school. Of course it is. I think UST is superior to most of the schools in the country. But when you try to compare it with the very best schools such as those 4 schools I've mentioned above, it is when UST has problems competing against. It just does not have the prestige to attract the best students. It does not have the faculty caliber that those elite 4 schools have. It does not have the best student quality as those elite 4 schools have. It has problems with overpopulation (45k students with only less than a thousand faculty many of them don't have postgrad qualification), poor graduation rate, poor student retention rate, poor academic support system, poor student guidance related to scholarly works, poor participation rate in research, less stellar alumni roster despite its size, poorer employment prospects for their graduates and so on.

I am not a huge fan of Ateneo but I would be lying if I won't say it is in a notch above UST.




Professional Schools:

Medicine
1. UP Manila
2. UST
3. DLSU-Dasma
4. AdMU - since it's new


Law
1. UP
2. AdMU
-
-
-
UST - distant 5th of 6th

Business
1. UP
2. DLSU
3. AdMU
-
-
-
-
UST - distant 6th or 7th



UNDERGRADUATE EDUCATION
1 UPD, UPM, AdMU, DLSU

-
considerable gap
-
UST

Since this is about undergraduate education, the answer is, NO, UST isn't on par with Ateneo. Ateneo has a considerable lead over UST for undergraduate education.

[Aphasia017]

Moderator, kindly close this thread.

As for eugenebegood aka warwick, don't try too hard cause you have no credibility at all.

I just observed you have new rankings na ngayon, dati you keep on insisting na CIM is better than UST when it comes to Medicine. And now iba na naman.

[Juntrix]

UST is not better than Ateneo.
Ateneo is not better than UST.


It's like comparing Mastercard and Visa... one is not really better than the other.

[eugenebegood]

Originally Posted by Aphasia017

Moderator, kindly close this thread.

As for eugenebegood aka warwick, don't try too hard cause you have no credibility at all.

I just observed you have new rankings na ngayon, dati you keep on insisting na CIM is better than UST when it comes to Medicine. And now iba na naman.

I never confirmed UST is number 2 for medicine. I said "arguably", and apparently, you did not understand the meaning of that word. Thanks to your UST education. Nagmukhang kang tan@a.

[eugenebegood]

Originally Posted by Juntrix

UST is not better than Ateneo.

It's like comparing Mastercard and Visa... one is not really better than the other.

college desirability is measurable using metrics that are relevant to undergraduate teaching and learning. For example, a faculty-to-student ratio would be a good metric, and so are: graduation rate, retention rate, faculty caliber, student caliber, employment prospects and so on.

Ateneo is not better than UST.

I strongly object. Using metrics I stated above, it's obvious that AdMU is superior to UST. In fact, I think the gap is substantial.

[Carl Malone]

Sorry, letranistako, “profund” was misspelled, it should be profound, which means having deep insight and understanding that is beyond the superficial or mundane.

UST and ADMU are different:

1. Dominicans and Jesuits have different charisms and missions. Charism is a gift that God supernaturally endows for a certain purpose. You can look up each order’s mission in the internet.
2. Owing to a higher level of tuition costs in Ateneo compared to UST’s, students in each school generally come from different income strata.
3. Admission policies are different. ACET and USTET require different levels of aptitude. UST seeks to embrace a greater number of students to render them good catholic education; ACET tends to limit them.
4. The number of courses and the scope and focus of their curriculum are not the same. UST has a greater number of courses that involves board licensing.
5. All of the above, as a result, provide a different campus and academic environment.
6. Finally, and most importantly, no two individuals from the same school (Ateneo or UST) are the same, so how could a student from UST and Ateneo be any similar.

You want them to be the same because you have an agenda, yet these two schools cannot be the same as I’ve pointed out. And so it is too with U.P. and Ateneo, they are not the same. People want to believe that some things are the same so that they could justify their feeling of superiority over the other or that they don’t want to feel inferior to another. Why do people entertain ideas of superiority? Because the idea of superiority is seductive, it’s like a drug that gives you a false sense of well-being and advantage or power over something or another but in truth it is an empty idea. It is an illusion. It separates people instead of making them realize their commonalities.

God did not intend one being or thing to be better than the other. Superiority is man’s creation that arises from limited perspectives, imposed preferences and false understandings. Superiority is probably the worst idea that visited man on this planet. Remember Hitler telling the Jews that they were a sub-human species. Remember the subjugation of human slaves in many countries. Remember Martin Luther King who fought for the American negroes’ civil freedoms. Remember Milosevic and the civil war in Bosnia. It is because of this false idea of superiority which is why racism and discrimination still abound in many places.

Man is not better than a woman. Young is not better than old. Christians are not better than Muslims. Americans are not superior to Filipinos. Cold is not better than Warm. Blue is not better than Green. Oh, there are many more examples. Let us seek to be profound.

[eugenebegood]

Originally Posted by Aphasia017

As for eugenebegood aka warwick, don't try too hard cause you have no credibility at all.

maybe here on PEX, but I couldn't care less. anyway, the real world seems very much aligned with my observation about the Philippine higher education. In fact, UST's prestige hasn't gone up since i first critiqued its academic standard. It still lags behind the top 4 (UPd, UPm, AdMU, DLSU) and even UA&P, CSB and maybe even UPLB in the academic prestige race not only amongst the mainstream public but also amongst the top employers. Nothing has really changed since I first posted on PEX about UST and other schools. The view of the elite students is still unchanged as they would still go for the Top 4, which I often call, the Solid 4, when given a choice to pick a college to spend the next 4 years of their lives. I understand why you're so upset with my post, as it somehow reflects your real status, but what i said is what it is.

[Aphasia017]

eugenebegood aka Warwick_Leyte = No credibility!.

What's new?

[anima9]

threads like this will always be infested by some sort of pest.

I'm from UST. I respect ADMU because I know the capabilities of ADMU.

If we were to base it on total vs total, UST will be a notch up simply because it has far more programs to offer. But if we were to base it with ADMU's limit, ADMU COULD be better than UST.

I respect the reason why we're only usually in the 4th spot. recent surveys also suggest that ADMU is 2nd best in the country.

and that's from a Thomasian

[Xena_316]

Just showing those facts you can conclude that UST is the Top private University, that's an obvious fallacious generalization. I still think ADMU or DLSU is on the top lead...

[aramat_2nd]

^ Exactly.

No offense to the Tomasian pexers but your school is way behind Ateneo and De La Salle.

You can post your board topnotchers here and all but the total passing rate is still less than of Ateno's. Facilities pa lang wala na kayo.

So my answer to the question is NO. It's not and it will never be.

[letsrockandroll]

Originally Posted by eugenebegood

I think a lot of what you've posted on here aren't very clear with you.

First of all, medical schools are professional schools and are entirely separated from the undergraduate school. Whilst it is true that UST's medical school is superb, as it is arguably the second best med school in the country after UP Med, it's undergrad school/education is far from being number 2 in the country. It is not even in the top 5 in my assessment.

The top schools for undergraduate are UP Diliman, UP Manila, Ateneo de Manila and De La Salle University (in any order.) These are the favorite destinations of choice by the economic and intellectual elite. Very rarely would UST compete with any of those schools for undergrad education, and UST's poor enrollment yield of those from the extremely talented pool of students from elite high schools clearly explains that it is in a notch below those 4 elite schools. That is not to say however that UST isn't a good school. Of course it is. I think UST is superior to most of the schools in the country. But when you try to compare it with the very best schools such as those 4 schools I've mentioned above, it is when UST has problems competing against. It just does not have the prestige to attract the best students. It does not have the faculty caliber that those elite 4 schools have. It does not have the best student quality as those elite 4 schools have. It has problems with overpopulation (45k students with only less than a thousand faculty many of them don't have postgrad qualification), poor graduation rate, poor student retention rate, poor academic support system, poor student guidance related to scholarly works, poor participation rate in research, less stellar alumni roster despite its size, poorer employment prospects for their graduates and so on.

I am not a huge fan of Ateneo but I would be lying if I won't say it is in a notch above UST.




Professional Schools:

Medicine
1. UP Manila
2. UST
3. DLSU-Dasma
4. AdMU - since it's new


Law
1. UP
2. AdMU
-
-
-
UST - distant 5th of 6th

Business
1. UP
2. DLSU
3. AdMU
-
-
-
-
UST - distant 6th or 7th



UNDERGRADUATE EDUCATION
1 UPD, UPM, AdMU, DLSU

-
considerable gap
-
UST

Since this is about undergraduate education, the answer is, NO, UST isn't on par with Ateneo. Ateneo has a considerable lead over UST for undergraduate education.

warwick!! you're back


buking ka day!

[thebestusername]

nung pumili ako ng school para sa college, it's either Ateneo or UP lang. And I'm sure ganun rin ang mentality ng iba pang maraming mga high school students.

[letsrockandroll]

^^ i don't think so.

iba kasi nagagawa ng rebyu center advertisements.

davah? as if naman that it will matter if you're already working. eh ang sweldo niyo eh pare parehas lang din naman..

susme.

[ustyger]

Originally Posted by thebestusername

nung pumili ako ng school para sa college, it's either Ateneo or UP lang. And I'm sure ganun rin ang mentality ng iba pang maraming mga high school students.

Most students pefer UST and UP. Mahangin kasi ang dating ng mga atenista, figuratively and literally...tipong puro hangin lang.