Where should I go - UPD or ATENEO?

[Rona Francia]

I passed both the ACET and the UPCAT. Now I'm confused! I'm still undecided. I just wanted to know some of your suggestions..

I passed UP Diliman (BS Computer Engineering) and I passed Ateneo de Manila University with BS Communications Technology Management.

AdMU is offering a 100 tution, fees and dorm scholarship which is why it is so difficult for me to reject it. It is also hard for me to refuse UP.



What do you think?... I need your help!!!

[mike168]

mas mageenjoy ka sa ateneo imo

[buboybibo]

Scholarship na yan. Wag ng pakawalan pa. Atleast yung daily expenses na lang ang proproblemahin ng mga magulang mo.

Both UPD and ADMU are COE/COD pagdating sa computer studies.

[math_techie]

Go to Ateneo, wala ka naman pala gagastusin eh...sa UP, magbabayad ka pa.

[cretinous00]

I din't know they already have BS comp. eng. at Diliman. Hmmmm....

[Dacs]

All things equal, I'd choose UP.

But with the scholarship, you really really have to think hard about it.

You have to consider though that it's much more expensive (misc wise) in Ateneo over UP.

[batangmarikit]

di lamang academics ang inooffer ng UP. malaking training ground ang UP sa tunay na buhay.

sa UP wala talaga msyadong rules, kaya talagang ikaw ang magdedesisyon para sa iyong sarili araw araw. walang magsasaway kung umaabsent ka sa mga klasses mo.

matetest din pati critical thinking mo. (d lang critical thinking sa acads kundi pati na rin sa pang araw araw na buhay). matututo kang mag isip.d lahat ng sabihin sa iyo ng mga tao ay tatanggapin mo na lang na tama.

matututo ka din makihalubilo sa lahat ng klase ng tao. mayaman, mahirap. masipag mag aral. delinkwente at iba pa.

d naman sa inaangat ko msyado ang UP. sinasabi ko lang kung ano ang meron sa eskwelahan na ito. hindi ibig sabihin nito ay walang ganito sa ateneo.

[ghostdancer]

Wherever you go-- there you are. Why not talk to upperclass persons from both schools and in your own major. Pero sayang din ang scholarship mo.

I faced the same situation but I chose UP because:

1) the tuition was waaaaaay lower than Ateneo
2) I always wanted to study in UP (altho I'm an AHS grad)
3) Nagsawa na ako sa Ateneo campus -and yung mga tao dun kaklase ko noong high school and grade school.
4) UP has a "liberating" atmosphere.
5) UP profs are quite cool

But if I had the scholarship like you, I would go to Ateneo. All things being equal, the prestige of bagging one of only a few scholarships speaks volumes about you.

Congrats

[Myst]

"AdMU is offering a 100 tution, fees and dorm scholarship which is why it is so difficult for me to reject it. It is also hard for me to refuse UP."

Go with Ateneo unless UP offers you something you can't refuse...

[Ice Burn]

Well I'm biased for Ateneo. :lol: Plus you have a full scholarship too? :lol: Even if UP has a low tution, you'd still be paying tuition fees. By going to Ateneo you'd be easing financial burdens on your parents.

But I do believe networking-wise after you graduate college especially if you find yourself wanting to work in the US, Ateneo has a stronger Alumni network. I have friends who went to both Ateneo and UP in the US and they find that the Ateneo Alumni network is very strong especially in the US.

But this is just my biased opinion talking. UP grads will have a lot to say otherwise. :)

Tell you what, it's still early right? Why not spend some time and sit in classes in UP and Ateneo to help you decide on which style of education fits you best. Just ask permission from the professors, I'm sure most of them won't mind. I believe this is the best way to help you decide because you can see for yourself and decide what's the best fit for you as opposed to listening to people here bicker and fight about the merits and demerits of both schools. :)

[weightloss]

^^ i agree... facilities are excellent... people are nice... you'll enjoy peaceful environment... what else? ohh, and they said, they're elite! :D

[feisty_virago]

Well, it really depends on your passion. If you really are into hard-core Computer Science training, go for UP (but IMHO, if you are into hard-core computer stuff such as programming etc. and after really good training, DLSU is the way to go).

As for Comtech, well...Comtech is more of a Management course that integrates the two disciplines of Computer Science and Communication Arts. You get exposed to a variety of subjects in each field, i.e Finance, Acctg, Stat, Marketing etc. for the Management subjects. In Comm Arts, you have Communication Theories, Media Production Techniques, Advertising etc. However, the Computer Science of Comtech is not very hard-core compared to what our CS peers were undergoing. Sure you learn about those techie hardware/trouble-shooting jargon stuff, but you will be exposed more in using various softwares that are essential in media, such as Adobe Photoshop, Premiere,Illustrator, 3D studio Max, Macromedia etc. In your third year, you are expected to choose a track. Those who are leaning towards business or the corporate life opt for Management and took electives under the Management program. Those who like Advertising and Media chose more Communication subjects. And I think those who were more into the nitty-gritty of computers, programming and telecomms chose the Computer Science track.

I was also accepted in both universities, and also got a 100%
scholarship in both schools. If I didn't get the scholarship in ADMU, I would have gone to UP if only to help ease my family's financial burden. But in the end, I chose to go to ADMU for the following reasons; I like my course there better, its nearer my house, has a smaller, relatively safer campus (Stricter security policy and I don't need to always keep loose change for those UP Ikot jeeps because I can just walk from 1 bldg to another) and the strong alumni support. Likewise, I've seen how terrible the Katipunan traffic is during rush hours and I have often heard the complaints of my UP friends saying that ADMU is the cause of traffic and why they were always late. :lol: This also contributed to my decision. :lol: Anyway, whenever I'd get those "What if naging Isko ako, ano kaya buhay ko moments," way back in college,it was easy for me to visit my UP friends and hang out with them for awhile.:lol:

[purpleheadd07]

^^go, admu!

i remember being faced with the same issue a looong time ago haha... i chose admu of course. ang hirap i disregard ng full scholarship na yan...si hirap ba naman mag aral, dapat lang talaga may sweldo ka! *okay* :lol:

congrats, btw! :beam:

[KuyaDanny]

Ang daming sumagot! :)

[philippines123]

go to ateneo.

Give your UP slot to deserving yet not so rich students from the provinces.

[yeson]

Ateneo! mas matimbang ang ateneo dahil sa scholarship.. pati madaling makakuha ng job pag ateneo grad ka.. malaki pa kaagad ang sweldo!

[yurat]

Or, (it can also be) Go to Up.

Give your ateneo scholarship to deserving yet not so rich students from anywhere in the Phil.

[iRebirth]

go to Ateneo.... then SHIFT to a better major!

[hanzo24]

Yup. Ateneo. Scholarship is not a joke. Take it!

I'm an isko, but money-wise, better go to Ateneo. May TOFI na eh, around 20k per sem... :(

At least Ateneo, libre di ba?

[ubermensch]

Ang daming sumagot! :)

kanina pa ako nagtataka at walang bashing so far. naisip ko, ang galing mag-kontrol ng mga tao. then naalala ko na filtered na pala ang posts sa academe :bop:

I passed both the ACET and the UPCAT. Now I'm confused! I'm still undecided. I just wanted to know some of your suggestions..

I passed UP Diliman (BS Computer Engineering) and I passed Ateneo de Manila University with BS Communications Technology Management.

AdMU is offering a 100 tution, fees and dorm scholarship which is why it is so difficult for me to reject it. It is also hard for me to refuse UP.



What do you think?... I need your help!!!

wow. i feel a lot of people would wish they had the same dilemma as you had, so congrats. biased ako eh. pero for reasons of practicality, go to ateneo kasi kung may babayaran kang school fees, if i remember correctly, very minimal na lang, like lab breakage fees for example (na refundable naman). it's also a small campus so it's easy to go around.

pero i have to say, the campus of upd is superior to that of admu. size pa lang. ang sarap maglakad. at madaming street food, yee-haw! :lol:

[_ozzakii]

With or without a scholarship offer, UP is still the best choice here. Let's admit it, UP is the BEST Philippine school there is. And if school prestige is what you really want, then there is one school whose brand name transcends all: The University of the Philippines.

You don't even have to get into INTARMED, BAA or Law. Just get into [i]any[i] UP program. By doing so, you'll be able to say that you went to UP. If what you really care about are a brand name so that you can impress people (in the Philippines or in Asian region) and an alumni network to leverage (not that there's anything wrong with that), then getting into some program at UP may be the way to go.

[KuyaDanny]

kanina pa ako nagtataka at walang bashing so far. naisip ko, ang galing mag-kontrol ng mga tao. then naalala ko na filtered na pala ang posts sa academe :bop:

I can assure you that I have not had to reject any posts made in this thread so far. Thanks to everyone for letting good sense prevail.

[adhd]

I passed both the ACET and the UPCAT. Now I'm confused! I'm still undecided. I just wanted to know some of your suggestions..

I passed UP Diliman (BS Computer Engineering) and I passed Ateneo de Manila University with BS Communications Technology Management.

AdMU is offering a 100 tution, fees and dorm scholarship which is why it is so difficult for me to reject it. It is also hard for me to refuse UP.



What do you think?... I need your help!!!

The academic environment of UP Diliman is hostile compared to ADMU. There are several terror teachers especially in the college of engineering. So, you better think twice. I know someone who was in the same situation a few years ago. He chose ADMU just to be safe.

[_ozzakii]

Or, (it can also be) Go to Up.

Give your ateneo scholarship to deserving yet not so rich students from anywhere in the Phil.

Exactly. It's a win-win situation for her. By giving up her scholarship slot at Ateneo, she would be able to help a poor student get an Ateneo education for free while she enjoys going to the number one school in the Philippines. Super talented students like you are supposed to converge in UP. It's what UP is designed for. Ateneo is not designed for that. But it also offers quality education nonetheless.

To the TS, go to UP. You will enjoy your stay there like everyone at UP has. Many Ateneans have found not liking the school after a while. They say life there is boring and monotonous. But there are some who do however. If you go to Ateneo, you'll meet almost the same kind of people -- boring (and some are ugly.) The student life in UP is bright and educational --makulay. :D Add to that, there are lots of hot chicks on the campus too. (But if you're a girl, there's the APO oblation run every December which has become a favorate event for the Tomasians.)

Do not be fooled by these alumni support claims. That’s not most likely true. Look, UP's endowment fund is way bigger than Ateneo's. Endowment fund is the real reflection of alumni support and school pride. There's only one alumnus who's giving support to Ateneo -- Manny Pangilinan. The rest are not as eager as he is (or doesn't have the money to give back to Ateneo.) While at UP, almost everyone there is giving back to the university. Most of UP’s alumni are the "who's who" in the country in practically all fields there are – from the sciences to engineering and from politics and business to arts. Ateneo's alumni are good too, but they're no match to UP's in breathe, count, quality and power.

[Churbs]

That's a tough one. I faced the same dilemma last year. I got into UPD's BS Chemical Engineering program and Ateneo's BS Chemistry with Materials Science and Engineering. Ateneo also granted me a 100% scholarship on tuition and fees.

I advice you to think very critically and carefully. Picture yourself as a UP/Ateneo student. Which school is more you? Then think about the pros and cons of both schools. Will it be okay to spend PhP 20,000+ for your UP education when you can study at Ateneo for practically free? Which course do you like better? Actually, only you can decide for yourself. It's all up to you.

Well, in my case I chose UPD despite the ToFI and my Ateneo scholarship simply because I believe that UP is the best school in the Philippines. Ateneo is also very excellent, but UP is just better in my opinion. I even resisted to attend the School of Science and Engineering open house even if I really wanted to for I did not want to be tempted to change my mind.

So far, I have no regrets for choosing UPD over Ateneo. Although sometimes I try to imagine what could've happened if chose Ateneo over UP. Still, I'm very happy that I chose UP.

That was my decision. It was based on my own personal preferences. Think about yours. Decide for yourself. :)

[n3X]

Favorite ko to Ateneo vs. UP. Hehe

Even with the scholarship, go to UP. In today's world, what you would learn now would be obsolete in a couple of years, especially in the realm of technology. What one needs are competencies that would enable a person to navigate an ever-changing terrain of knowledge and circumstances. Only UP could give that distinctive thinking which could empower you to not only succeed in any field of endeavor, but to also surpass your limits. Everybody knows how different UP graduates think and act. In any case, UP is still the best university in the country and aims to be one of the best in the world in the coming years.

Pero yun nga it depends, would you be able to afford the full tuition @ UP? Be practical also. A scholarship from Ateneo is really hard to ignore. But if you were to pay the full cost of attending UP, you would know it's all worth it. Think about yung mga poor families that do everything just to send their children to the university. Don't think in the short-term or in terms of costs and savings, think in terms of returns. Pera lang ba ang consideration mo about studies? How about yung transformative power ng education? Hindi ba mas matimbang yun?

Sabi nga sa speech ni Prof. Butch Dalisay to the graduating class of UP Baguio last 2005: "You are UP because you can think and speak for yourselves, by your own wits and on your own two feet, and you can do so no matter what the rest of the people in the room may be thinking. You are UP because no one can tell you to shut up, if you have something sensible and vital to say. You are UP because you dread not the poverty of material comforts but the poverty of the mind. And you are UP because you care about something as abstract and sometimes as treacherous as the idea of "nation", even if it kills you."

If ever you decide to join us, we look forward to welcoming you. Mabuhay ka bagong Iskolar ng Bayan!

Other comments:

mas mageenjoy ka sa ateneo imo

Mas mag-eenjoy sa ateneo vs. UP? Talaga lang ha. :lol: Campus pa lang bawal na inuman. Hehehe joke.

Alumni relations and support

Yeah, parang nga mas malakas ang alumni networking sa Ateneo than UP. This is one area that the university needs to work on. Lakas din kasi ng pride na ma-iinstill sa yo kapag nag-Ateneo ka (an observation from AHS grads). Although among UP graduates, kung nalaman na taga-UP ka rin, instant connection na yun. And I'm not talking about yung connection na nag-eexist naman sa lahat ng alumni coming from one school. It's weird. You know you could talk to him/her about ANYTHING, and siyempre (sometimes sad tho for me, pero pride na rin so okay lang) yung arrogance of being from UP na all else are "others". :lol:

[Kirkegaard]

Try to consider also if you can keep your scholarship in Ateneo; getting one is tough, staying in one is tougher.

But, to my mind, choice of course should be the decisive factor here. If you'd want to go hardcore in computer-related stuff, then go to UP. The EEE is known to be the best and the toughest department in UPD's College of Engineering. If you'd prefer a healthy mix of Communications and Computer-related stuff, then go to Ateneo. It's also a COE.

In the end, you can't go wrong with both schools. They're the best in the land, hands down.

[Rona Francia]

Thank you for your advices. These would really help me decide.

[Rona Francia]

Tell you what, it's still early right? Why not spend some time and sit in classes in UP and Ateneo to help you decide on which style of education fits you best. Just ask permission from the professors, I'm sure most of them won't mind. I believe this is the best way to help you decide because you can see for yourself and decide what's the best fit for you as opposed to listening to people here bicker and fight about the merits and demerits of both schools. :)

I wish I could but I'm from the province so I think that would not be possible. Anyway, thanks po for your suggestion. Are you from AdMU?

[Kolmogorov]

I'm a UP alumnus but since you already got a scholarship in ADMU, then by all means take it :D

[tyanak_soo]

Here's the most sensible post then: If you want to work in the US, by all means go to UP, sweat out the tough academics, and pay the full tuition (it's cheap anyway.) I assure you, you'll make it in the US, and you'll be a lot happier because you did it without any silly networking channels.

Just this: attrition among engineering majors from freshman to senior year is normally 70% (maybe more.)

[Rona Francia]

Scholarship na yan. Wag ng pakawalan pa. Atleast yung daily expenses na lang ang proproblemahin ng mga magulang mo.

Both UPD and ADMU are COE/COD pagdating sa computer studies.

Go to Ateneo, wala ka naman pala gagastusin eh...sa UP, magbabayad ka pa.

All things equal, I'd choose UP.

But with the scholarship, you really really have to think hard about it.

You have to consider though that it's much more expensive (misc wise) in Ateneo over UP.

Ateneo! mas matimbang ang ateneo dahil sa scholarship.. pati madaling makakuha ng job pag ateneo grad ka.. malaki pa kaagad ang sweldo!

Yup. Ateneo. Scholarship is not a joke. Take it!

I'm an isko, but money-wise, better go to Ateneo. May TOFI na eh, around 20k per sem... :(

At least Ateneo, libre di ba?

Kaya nga, eh... The scholarship is a really great offer... Not all are granted with it... Before, all I was praying is for me to get into a prestigious university with an affordable tuition fee for college... With this, I'd be helping my parents financially...

[_ozzakii]

Here's the most sensible post then: If you want to work in the US, by all means go to UP, sweat out the tough academics, and pay the full tuition (it's cheap anyway.) I assure you, you'll make it in the US, and you'll be a lot happier because you did it without any silly networking channels.

Just this: attrition among engineering majors from freshman to senior year is normally 70% (maybe more.)

Huwag mo naman takutin yung bata. :D

Malakas naman na daw ang personal care sa mga EEEdept students ng UP ngayon hndi tulad nung time nyo. :D kasi nga dahil sa hirap ng course load at considering mga high school valedictorians and salutatorians itong mga ito bumabagsak parin. So gumagawa naman ng steps ang UP Engg dyan ngayon to keep these talented kids from dropping out. Gusto kasi ng bagong dean na tataas ang graduation rate ng college para tataas din ang budget. Wala namang bobo sa mga nakapasok sa Engg kung iisipin mo talaga. Kaylangan lang nila ng pag aaruga whilst studying the course.

[boy_wonder]

May Iskolar-ship din naman sa UP ah? Waha. :D

Hindi na rin masamang choice ang ADMU. 100% scholarship pang offer. Pero, marami na akong nakilalang pinili ang UP education over ADMU's kahit may grant din sila. For the simple reason na hindi mababawi nung "scholarship" yung experience na gusto nilang makuha from UP. So yes, basically kung saan mo talaga gusto, or mas gusto, ang deciding factor since hindi ka naman maliligaw ng landas alinman ang iyong piliin.

Sa ADMU, libre ang tution and some other fees. It'd definitely be a lot of help to you and to your family while you're in college... Pero sa UP, I'm telling you, mas maraming "libre" :lol: that'd help you for the rest of your life. Naka naman!

Finally, if there's something you deserve more than a full scholarship from any other school, it's the opportunity to be in the country's best- UP!!! Hehe, biased lang. :)

[rabbaddal]

I didn't see you mention in your posts that you planned to work in the US. But if you really are and you're targeting to work in the corporate sector, then having networking channels will make you happier because you will find a better-paying job faster than your peers. Go for Ateneo.

However, ask yourself also what would happen if you lose your scholarship. How sure are you that you can remain a scholar for all 4 years? Can your family still afford to pay the tuition and fees? If not, then it might be to your benefit to go to a university that charges substantially less.

[cheeyu]

I know that this is not the most intellectual post you'll see, but if you choose Ateneo, you'll be able to experience the UAAP craze. :D Hehehe.

[bluecross]

Ako, malaking Ateneo boy. Mga sinasabi nila na marami kang matutunan na critical thinking at kung anu ano pa, matututunan mo rin ito sa Ateneo. Matututo ka rin makisama sa Ateneo, hindi naman lahat ng Atenista mayaman.

Pareho lang matutulungan mo ang mahirap pag pinili mo Ateneo / UP. Mapupunta rin sa iba ang scholarship na inoffer mo.

Instead, look at the dilemma this way. Computer Eng vs ComTech. Take note, ComTech is DIFFERENT from ComEng. ComTech is more of com and management.

[zacharaiolsen]

may nag suggest dito go to ateneo the shift to a better course.. e di ba pag nagshift ka mawawala na scholarship? tska tingin ko yung naman talaga gusto nyang course.

malaki na rin tuition ngayon sa UP, 15k ba? ang daming naghahangad ng full scholarships, at mas mahirap makuha yun. makakatulong pa sa magulang mo.

[ubermensch]

may nag suggest dito go to ateneo the shift to a better course.. e di ba pag nagshift ka mawawala na scholarship? tska tingin ko yung naman talaga gusto nyang course.

malaki na rin tuition ngayon sa UP, 15k ba? ang daming naghahangad ng full scholarships, at mas mahirap makuha yun. makakatulong pa sa magulang mo.

depende kung kailan lalabas itong post ko, baka outdated na. but just in case...

most scholarships in ateneo are financial aid scholarships na hindi naman mawawala dahil lumipat ng course.

[pretenred1]

ako din from UP.....
pero sabi mo 100 % scholarship ang nasa Ateneo
sayang yun
kasi diba mahal na din ang tuition fee sa UP ngayon

[baludoy]

However, ask yourself also what would happen if you lose your scholarship. How sure are you that you can remain a scholar for all 4 years? Can your family still afford to pay the tuition and fees? If not, then it might be to your benefit to go to a university that charges substantially less.

this is so true. a classmate of mine from ahs (a tulong dunong scholar btw) had to leave ateneo college because he was taken out of the scholarship program due to a grade requirement he failed to meet (by a very small percentage). he had no problem passing the university standard but his family could simply not afford the regular tuition fee load forcing him to transfer out. to think we were already in our junior year during that time

[hacksaw]

Both are good schools. Believe me, I come from a family that traditionally went to either UP or Ateneo for college. If you are inclined to pursue a career in engineering then go to UP. If you're leaning towards a career in management go to Ateneo. Walang management course ang UPD. If you are thinking in terms of a cash out point of view then go to loyola (libre lahat kamo) but if you feel you'd be more comfortable with people that come from different social classes go to UP. Forget taking up eng'g in Ateneo. Their program is in its embroyonic stage. My mom is an ME grad and a faculty member at the ateneo's JGSOM. She doesnt know what a Shear and Bending Moment Diagram is :D

[purpleheadd07]

I wish I could but I'm from the province so I think that would not be possible.

check mo din saan mag aaral yung ibang classmates, schoolmates mo. as much as possible wag ka dun sa andun din sila para iwas gimik at iwas gastos. in UP kse madami akong friends na andun kaya gusto kong maiba hehe. :p

[borlogs]

May Iskolar-ship din naman sa UP ah? Waha. :D

Hindi na rin masamang choice ang ADMU. 100% scholarship pang offer. Pero, marami na akong nakilalang pinili ang UP education over ADMU's kahit may grant din sila. For the simple reason na hindi mababawi nung "scholarship" yung experience na gusto nilang makuha from UP. So yes, basically kung saan mo talaga gusto, or mas gusto, ang deciding factor since hindi ka naman maliligaw ng landas alinman ang iyong piliin.

Sa ADMU, libre ang tution and some other fees. It'd definitely be a lot of help to you and to your family while you're in college... Pero sa UP, I'm telling you, mas maraming "libre" :lol: that'd help you for the rest of your life. Naka naman!

Finally, if there's something you deserve more than a full scholarship from any other school, it's the opportunity to be in the country's best- UP!!! Hehe, biased lang. :)


i definitely agree with you! ;)

im pretty sure that you can also get a scholarship from UP. there are lots of scholarship programs available to UP students, especially to engineering studs. even at this early, you can go to UP's office of student affairs to inquire about the scholarships. ang alam ko lang, nirerequire lang nila ang grades mo for the first and/or 2nd semester. i know someone who receives over 15k monthly because of his scholarships. pwede ka na rin mag apply for STFAP kung wala kang pang reg for the coming semester. alam ko ang deadline nun ay sa march pa. UP na yan neng, pakakawalan mo pa ba? paraparaan nalang at diskarte ang kailangan mo para magsurvive once you are in.*okay*

[tyanak_soo]

I didn't see you mention in your posts that you planned to work in the US. But if you really are and you're targeting to work in the corporate sector, then having networking channels will make you happier because you will find a better-paying job faster than your peers. Go for Ateneo.
Japanese saying:

"If sons of concubines can gain a victory, then sons of LEGAL WIVES will find no rivals in the world."

Go for UP.

[cretinous00]

go to ateneo.

Give your UP slot to deserving yet not so rich students from the provinces.

i've been reading posts like this for some years now, coming from a group of people who think they actually have the power to alter fate and change people's lives. it may be their school officials planted the thought in their minds, or perhaps someone in their school is paid to think of catchy lines, much like gag writers in a comedy show, or they could have genuinely composed the thought on their lonesome (believing their logic is unassailable.)

perish all thoughts related to it! if you fail the UPCAT, you're not going to UP, unless you're an insanely sexy female and you approach the UP president who's male and high on drugs. i thinks he's a she at the moment.

no amount of non-enrollment by UPCAT passers will get you into UP Diliman. yes, there are actually slots open even for flunkers but that's been pre-determined. it's not a case of someone hanging a bright streamer on enrollment day saying "hey, 50% of those who passed didn't enroll! the following colleges are admitting addtional applicants..."

even UPCAT passers who didn't make it to the quota on their first choice program don't get a heads up if those who made the grade didn't enroll. no announcment like, "hey, 50% of those admitted to BAA didn't enroll! go to dean cretinous00's office for a prerog. guys, bring whole cases of beer. girls, be sure to dress sexy."

if you believe in destiny, you're not in UP for a reason.

[Ice Burn]

I wish I could but I'm from the province so I think that would not be possible. Anyway, thanks po for your suggestion. Are you from AdMU?

Yes I'm from Admu. :)

Others have mentioned it but you have to be realistic about the "big if" you can keep your scholarship. I'm sure you are pretty smart to pass both schools but maintaining a scholarship will entail extra responsibility on your part. Also studying in Ateneo is no joke. In fact the kick out rate (well back in my time) was 1 out of 5 due to being unable to maintain QPI requirements. I don't know if it has gone higher or lower. It's also not easy to drop classes because once the 3 week time frame after subject enrollment has lapsed, the class you dropped though will not be an "F" but will still have a zero equivalent thus pulling your QPI down.

I also know people who have lost their scholarship status and had to leave because they couldn't afford the tuition. Will you be able to handle the tuition in the event that you lose your scholarship?

Well here's something that might help you decide kahit mababaw lang...My sister had kind of the same problem as you. She passed BS IE in UPD and BS ME in Ateneo. And she was a scholar in both schools. Mababaw lang reason niya why she chose Ateneo. It was because of the ladies bathroom. Mas malinis daw yung sa Ateneo. :lol:

[purpleheadd07]

^^nah, don't worry so much about the difficulties in maintaining the scholarship, you can always make an appeal in case you get an F or a double D. (yeah, in our case, getting a double DD is never considered as desirable) :glee:

i should know, i made an appeal for retaining my sholarship twice. the third time should have kicked me out but i managed naman kahit papano. and the Appeals Director was nice din, he told me after his sermon to just smile, go out and say "I've just been scolded" hehe.

besides, having the scholarship is a great ease in one's studies. isn't it much easier that one only has to worry about maintaining grades and not much about how to pay for one's tuition especially when exams are nearing and allowances from the province get delayed? double whammy yun. :)

and if maintaining one's grade becomes too difficult you can always shift to a different course which you can manage better. :wink:

[_ozzakii]

I didn't see you mention in your posts that you planned to work in the US. But if you really are and you're targeting to work in the corporate sector, then having networking channels will make you happier because you will find a better-paying job faster than your peers. Go for Ateneo.



This is not entirely true. There are far more UP grads going abroad to study postgrad than are Ateneans. The Fulbright and Chevening scholarship grants are dominated by UP grads. Even private sponsored scholarship grants are dominated by UP grads --from Shell to Ayala. And on top of that, Banatao sponsors UP grads who wish to take up postgrad studies in IT/science and Engineering at either UC Berkeley or Stanford. Such privilege is not extended to Ateneans. Most Ateneans entering schools abroad are in business schools, which is understandable given many undergrad courses in Ateneo are business-oriented. But if the TS is sure that IT is what she wants to do after college life, UP is the best place for her to go. If she wants to go into Investment Banking, UP IT grads are also core schools for IB jobs. For example, 5 UP IT grads have joined McKinsey in the past 5 years. 11 have joined JPMorgan during the same number of years. And UP is a core school for recruitment for HSBC, Citigroup and Standard Chartered. Join peyups.com if you wish to know more about how marketable UP grads are. In fact, they’re so marketable that even a mere Library Science grad can get into HSBC, Citi and the like.

About two weeks ago, a friend of mine who’s a Harvard Business School grad emailed me the number of Filipinos who are alumni of Harvard Business School. HBS is the best business school in the world. Here are the numbers:

UP - 46 (+ 3 currently enrolled. 5 made got an offer but only 3 enrolled)
AdMU - 30
DLSU - 18
UE - 8
UST - 1
MSU-Iligan Institute of Technology - 2
University of San Carlos – 1

Sure, there are many Ateneo alumni in the US. But in what way can they be of help to you when you decide to study abroad later on? Will they pay your tuition? Well, I have not heard any Atenan done that yet. Maybe it happened in the past. But I personally have never heard of it. I do, however, know UP alumni do that to UP grads. In fact, a number of fraternities have done that several times in the past. I personally know someone who went to the University of Cambridge in England to study epidemiology for 3 years as a recipient of his fraternity. Is there something like that in Ateneo? I don’t know. I haven’t heard of any yet.

[_ozzakii]

this is so true. a classmate of mine from ahs (a tulong dunong scholar btw) had to leave ateneo college because he was taken out of the scholarship program due to a grade requirement he failed to meet (by a very small percentage). he had no problem passing the university standard but his family could simply not afford the regular tuition fee load forcing him to transfer out. to think we were already in our junior year during that time

Wait. what? I don't think Ateneo's tuition is that expensive. We're not talking of Harvard here. Come one, let's be real. The last time I checked, Ateneo's tuition is just about 70k per sem or 140k a year. How can that be expensive these days? That's just about 12k per month or a 15-day salary of a junior executive.

[_ozzakii]

ako din from UP.....
pero sabi mo 100 % scholarship ang nasa Ateneo
sayang yun
kasi diba mahal na din ang tuition fee sa UP ngayon

Marami na actually ang nag turn down ng scholarship ng Ateneo in favour to UP. I even think there were more students who turned down the scholarship offer of Ateneo (for UP) than there were students who actually availed it. Check out Ateneo's statistics. 4,800 students passed this year. Only about 2k of them would actually enrol. That's not even 50% yield rate. UPD's admitted students this year: 3,800. Expected students to enrol: 3,400 or a yield rate of 89%.

Check this out: http://peyups.com/posts.khtml?mode=viewtopic&topic=27353&forum=10

[cheeyu]

Wait. what? I don't think Ateneo's tuition is that expensive. We're not talking of Harvard here. Come one, let's be real. The last time I checked, Ateneo's tuition is just about 70k per sem or 140k a year. How can that be expensive these days? That's just about 12k per month or a 15-day salary of a junior executive.

Some people have other bills to pay (rent, debts and etc). 12k a month is difficult to allot if you're financially unstable.

[ubermensch]

Wait. what? I don't think Ateneo's tuition is that expensive. We're not talking of Harvard here. Come one, let's be real. The last time I checked, Ateneo's tuition is just about 70k per sem or 140k a year. How can that be expensive these days? That's just about 12k per month or a 15-day salary of a junior executive.

in relative terms, it may not be expensive. i'm from a middle-class family, but still, 70k per sem is too big a burden on my family. before my second year, ateneo decided to cut my scholarship to 50% because of a slight increase in our family income. we made an appeal. otherwise, i would have transferred to up. back then, the tuition wasn't even 70k per sem (i think it was 30k-40k).

[psycho_wrath]

i would say i was one of those few who turned down an Atenean full scholarship for UP.

all i can say is, decide where you think you belong. i mean, think about what type of environment would you want to be in. would you want it liberal or more of conservative? and like they say if you would want to be a full time eng'g student, go to UP. but, if you choose to major in management, go to Ateneo.

one anecdote:
yung isa palang nagconvince sa akin na mag-UP ay isang pari. ang sabi niya:
"yung scholarship mo, wag mo na munang i-consider. isipin mo kung saan mo ba talaga gusto. kasi ang pagbabayad sa tuition fee, responsibility ng magulang mo yan. wag mong tanggalin sa kanila ang saya na maipagtapos ka sa hirap at pagod nila."

then, that was it. i chose UP because that is what i wanted. sure, my parents would have been happier if i went to Ateneo with a full scholarship. pero, seeing that i really learn a lot from UP (not just academics but street smarts as well), they still am proud of me.

so iyon, i hope this experience would be helpful. i dont say na choose UP, basta, alamin mo lang kung saan mo ba talaga gusto.

[purpleheadd07]

Wait. what? I don't think Ateneo's tuition is that expensive. We're not talking of Harvard here. Come one, let's be real. The last time I checked, Ateneo's tuition is just about 70k per sem or 140k a year. How can that be expensive these days? That's just about 12k per month or a 15-day salary of a junior executive.

the fact is not everyone can afford to pay 12k a month for education plus board and lodging expenses especially for us from the province. :)

[n3X]

Ako, malaking Ateneo boy. Mga sinasabi nila na marami kang matutunan na critical thinking at kung anu ano pa, matututunan mo rin ito sa Ateneo. Matututo ka rin makisama sa Ateneo, hindi naman lahat ng Atenista mayaman.

Pareho lang matutulungan mo ang mahirap pag pinili mo Ateneo / UP. Mapupunta rin sa iba ang scholarship na inoffer mo.

Instead, look at the dilemma this way. Computer Eng vs ComTech. Take note, ComTech is DIFFERENT from ComEng. ComTech is more of com and management.

Yeah matutunan rin yun sa Ateneo and even in other schools. But to what extent? Hanggang saan mag-eexpand yung horizons mo as an individual? How diversified yung mga tao and experiences in each school? Time and again, no school in the Philippines could beat UP on both counts. ;)

I also would disagree on the second part. Wag tayo magsalita ng patapos. Choosing between courses is a poor way of deciding. Later on kasi malay natin mag-shift out or something. Mamaya Computer Science pala o baka Art Studies. Look at the total benefits/pay-offs na makukuha mo from each school not from each course. Changing fields is easy, kahit graduate ka na magagawa mo yun. Pero changing schools? Hmmm... Markado ka na. :lol:

[kiko17]

Wait. what? I don't think Ateneo's tuition is that expensive. We're not talking of Harvard here. Come one, let's be real. The last time I checked, Ateneo's tuition is just about 70k per sem or 140k a year. How can that be expensive these days? That's just about 12k per month or a 15-day salary of a junior executive.

^ sorry, i have to react to this becuase it made me cringe.

ang sagot sa tanong mo ay dahil hindi lahat ay mayaman at afford ang 12k per month. and talk about being real, more than half of the population live below poverty line. 12k per month is impossible to most. some won't even earn this much per month their entire lifetime. so yes, bali-baliktarin mo man ang mundo, kuya, mahal ang 12k per month.

at kuya, i find it disrespectful to those who work hard to earn their keep to say that 70k is "not that expensive." unless, umulan ng pera since the last time i was back in the philippines, mahirap po ang buhay dun. try to go back. see for yourself.

[tyanak_soo]

My sister had kind of the same problem as you. She passed BS IE in UPD and BS ME in Ateneo. And she was a scholar in both schools. Mababaw lang reason niya why she chose Ateneo. It was because of the ladies bathroom. Mas malinis daw yung sa Ateneo. :lol:
Actually, I think it was a very smart choice. She probably doesn't know what real engineers do and the kind of places they work in.

[physicist]

Like most reasonable people here, I think you'd be fine regardless of where you end up studying.

I was also in this confusing situation several years back. My memory is hazy on the details, but my decision was based on a couple of things:

(1) Academic program. UP-D Math versus Ateneo Physics-CE. Oblation versus Merit. This was the real dilemma for me.

During my senior year of HS, I was fairly confused about what I really wanted to study in the long haul. I knew I wanted a lot of Math, but that I also didn't want to give up "right brain" functions.

In any case, I thought both were pretty good programs with fantastic, interesting people I could learn from.

What clinched it for Ateneo in my case was its intriguing core curriculum. The prospect of being a physics student who read and spoke the language of Marcel, Husserl, Heidegger, Levinas, and Nietszche (to name a few) -- throughout one's college life -- was just too intoxicating at the time.

UP's Math curriculum just looked too dry and uninspiring to me. And at the time I hadn't met a UP science major who actually appreciated or liked their his/her classes.

I also figured there was time to get exclusively technical when I got to grad school. Ateneo basically gave me a valid excuse to "waste" time on philosophy, literature, and a lot of other fascinating subjects.

(2) People/Culture.

UP won this for me hands down. UP students, in general, were just more interesting to me. Ateneans struck me as too academic and bookish. (As always, there were exceptions). UP students appeared to have more self-confidence than the typical Atenean. And so as a result, they seemed more intellectually adventurous and fun to be around with.

Being around good people was really important to me. A teacher once told me that one of the greatest merits of studying in a selective school is that you generally surround yourself with really enthusiastic and self-motivated students. So sometimes it's not just about the professors or the facilities; it can also be about how good your classmates are.

(3) Environment.

I loved UP's campus, but didn't care so much for it's libraries. Ateneo's campus was also beautiful -- and cleaner. But it was smaller, and had none of the huge ominous structures that UP-D has. I guess this was a tie for me. (Frankly, this was the main reason why to me La Salle was only a third option.)



With all these in mind, I decided going to Ateneo; much to the chagrin of my tatay who felt that I was taking a risk in depending on a scholarship. My reasoning was roughly this: Ateneo Physics was a better program (for me). Sure there was the chance of probably having boring classmates. But then again, if I got really bored, my friends in UP were just a jeepney ride away. ;) And as for depending on a scholarship, I was just cocky enough to think there really wasn't any serious risk of losing it.

Fortunately, Ateneans didn't turn out that boring after all. There were plenty of stimulating people to keep myself busy. But that didn't stop me from spending a lot of time interacting with students and old friends in UP either.

I ended up really enjoying my stay in Ateneo. The trick, you know, is to really talk to professors -- to juice out of them more than they can provide in the classroom. Then talk to classmates who seem smarter than you. Trust me, there'll be a couple. You can learn just as much from them as the best professors. This is how you keep yourself excited about learning, which is really what college ought to be about. Luckily, that excitement might even catapult you to the craziest ride of it all -- a PhD! ;)

(Mind you, it is really easy to get distracted in college too. Just look at all the pettiness in this forum -- I've even baited to it sometimes; though perhaps not this thread. Many on this "Academe" -- big irony! -- have already "graduated" but somehow just don't get it, so you can't help but wonder where all that vaunted "quality education" went.)

Of course, every now and then I wonder if life could've been better on the other side of Katipunan. The thought is a nice intermission to my life's perennial intellectual masturbation. But then again it really doesn't matter. Ika nga ng cliche, just don't let school interfere with your education.

With a scholarship like yours, I'm guessing Ateneo will be as cheap as UP. (At least it was back in my time). I seriously doubt that you'll lose it. Ateneo's scholarship is easy to maintain. And the admissions office is quite keen at picking out the right students who can carry it til the end. Frankly, the only ones I know who've lost theirs were those who really deserved it. (Smart but lazy ********!).

I really hope this helps.

Again, I think you'll be fine wherever you go. Just remember what counts in the end.

[Ice Burn]

_ozzakii: You know, take some time to step out of your opulent life and be realistic. Not everyone can afford Ateneo's tuition. P70K a semester is still a lot of money even for middle income families.

tyanak_soo: Yeah I believe so. That's probably why my sister at her age (26), she owns 3 successful businesses which she started on her own (she raised the money herself and didn't ask my parents for capital). She credits her Ateneo ME education for equipping her with the right business knowledge and training. :)

[hacksaw]

Actually, I think it was a very smart choice. She probably doesn't know what real engineers do and the kind of places they work in.

This somehow reminds me of how dad (upd, bsie) would take a dig at my mom (admu,bsme) everytime up got creamed by ateneo during the Battle of Katipunan.:D

But in all fairness I never heard a word from any of them when the time came for me to choose between Ateneo's ME program or UPD's IE. Because I wanted to be an engineer, it really was a no-brainer. (And before some wiseguy from the UP eng'g would probably say ang I.E. indi engineer uunahan ko na.) *okay*

[KuyaDanny]

_ozzakii: You know, take some time to step out of your opulent life and be realistic. Not everyone can afford Ateneo's tuition. P70K a semester is still a lot of money even for middle income families.


Does he even have a life (opulent or whatever)?

[_ozzakii]

Does he even have a life (opulent or whatever)?

why is the moderator of this forum taking a side? :naughty:

[_ozzakii]

in relative terms, it may not be expensive. i'm from a middle-class family, but still, 70k per sem is too big a burden on my family. before my second year, ateneo decided to cut my scholarship to 50% because of a slight increase in our family income. we made an appeal. otherwise, i would have transferred to up. back then, the tuition wasn't even 70k per sem (i think it was 30k-40k).

ok. i wasn't realistic then. i stand corrected.
but my point was just this: why would you aspire to be in ateneo when you can hardly pay off some bills and education was not a priority of the family?

[chubbita]

A very close family member has a similar dilemma. She was admitted to the ateneo, b.s. m.e, director's list (but she plans to shift to her 2nd choice, a.b. meco) and upd b.s. business economics.

Her mom is a u.p. honor grad (med), her dad finished business econ at upd and her kuya is a b.s. industrial engineering junior (oblation scholar).

Any thoughts? She wants to go against the grain ...

[rabbaddal]

Japanese saying:

"If sons of concubines can gain a victory, then sons of LEGAL WIVES will find no rivals in the world."

Go for UP.

I find little to admire with the Japanese and people who want to emulate them. Unlike Ateneans, they didn’t master the cunning and opportunism that’s needed to thrive in a dog-eat-dog world.

Go for Ateneo.

[iRebirth]

A very close family member has a similar dilemma. She was admitted to the ateneo, b.s. m.e, director's list (but she plans to shift to her 2nd choice, a.b. meco) and upd b.s. business economics.

Her mom is a u.p. honor grad (med), her dad finished business econ at upd and her kuya is a b.s. industrial engineering junior (oblation scholar).

Any thoughts? She wants to go against the grain ...

UPD's School of Economics is the way to go. It is the sole center of excellence in the field as recognized by CHED.

And I find that even though the program itself MIGHT be inferior to ADMU's Eco-H, MEco, a non-honors course, is worth less than UPD's Business Economics program.

But that's just the opinion of someone who faced a similar dilemma just about a year back.

[pokemohh]

Im from UP also ComSci course pero pagdating sa computer studies magaling talaga ang Ateneo at DLSU. Tight competition ang 3 schools na yan. Pero since may scholarship ka sa ADMU its an added factor. Ang maganda sa UP kapag nag abroad ka tapos nalaman nila graduate ka ng UP hanga sila sa iyo. Ive travelled to many countries at na shocked talaga ako dahil kahit sa mga rural areas ng ibang bansa kilala ang Univ of the Philippines.

[Lady Chablis]

Like most reasonable people here, I think you'd be fine regardless of where you end up studying.

I was also in this confusing situation several years back. My memory is hazy on the details, but my decision was based on a couple of things:

(1) Academic program. UP-D Math versus Ateneo Physics-CE. Oblation versus Merit. This was the real dilemma for me.

During my senior year of HS, I was fairly confused about what I really wanted to study in the long haul. I knew I wanted a lot of Math, but that I also didn't want to give up "right brain" functions.

In any case, I thought both were pretty good programs with fantastic, interesting people I could learn from.

What clinched it for Ateneo in my case was its intriguing core curriculum. The prospect of being a physics student who read and spoke the language of Marcel, Husserl, Heidegger, Levinas, and Nietszche (to name a few) -- throughout one's college life -- was just too intoxicating at the time.

UP's Math curriculum just looked too dry and uninspiring to me. And at the time I hadn't met a UP science major who actually appreciated or liked their his/her classes.

I also figured there was time to get exclusively technical when I got to grad school. Ateneo basically gave me a valid excuse to "waste" time on philosophy, literature, and a lot of other fascinating subjects.

(2) People/Culture.

UP won this for me hands down. UP students, in general, were just more interesting to me. Ateneans struck me as too academic and bookish. (As always, there were exceptions). UP students appeared to have more self-confidence than the typical Atenean. And so as a result, they seemed more intellectually adventurous and fun to be around with.

Being around good people was really important to me. A teacher once told me that one of the greatest merits of studying in a selective school is that you generally surround yourself with really enthusiastic and self-motivated students. So sometimes it's not just about the professors or the facilities; it can also be about how good your classmates are.

(3) Environment.

I loved UP's campus, but didn't care so much for it's libraries. Ateneo's campus was also beautiful -- and cleaner. But it was smaller, and had none of the huge ominous structures that UP-D has. I guess this was a tie for me. (Frankly, this was the main reason why to me La Salle was only a third option.)



With all these in mind, I decided going to Ateneo; much to the chagrin of my tatay who felt that I was taking a risk in depending on a scholarship. My reasoning was roughly this: Ateneo Physics was a better program (for me). Sure there was the chance of probably having boring classmates. But then again, if I got really bored, my friends in UP were just a jeepney ride away. ;) And as for depending on a scholarship, I was just cocky enough to think there really wasn't any serious risk of losing it.

Fortunately, Ateneans didn't turn out that boring after all. There were plenty of stimulating people to keep myself busy. But that didn't stop me from spending a lot of time interacting with students and old friends in UP either.

I ended up really enjoying my stay in Ateneo. The trick, you know, is to really talk to professors -- to juice out of them more than they can provide in the classroom. Then talk to classmates who seem smarter than you. Trust me, there'll be a couple. You can learn just as much from them as the best professors. This is how you keep yourself excited about learning, which is really what college ought to be about. Luckily, that excitement might even catapult you to the craziest ride of it all -- a PhD! ;)

(Mind you, it is really easy to get distracted in college too. Just look at all the pettiness in this forum -- I've even baited to it sometimes; though perhaps not this thread. Many on this "Academe" -- big irony! -- have already "graduated" but somehow just don't get it, so you can't help but wonder where all that vaunted "quality education" went.)

Of course, every now and then I wonder if life could've been better on the other side of Katipunan. The thought is a nice intermission to my life's perennial intellectual masturbation. But then again it really doesn't matter. Ika nga ng cliche, just don't let school interfere with your education.

With a scholarship like yours, I'm guessing Ateneo will be as cheap as UP. (At least it was back in my time). I seriously doubt that you'll lose it. Ateneo's scholarship is easy to maintain. And the admissions office is quite keen at picking out the right students who can carry it til the end. Frankly, the only ones I know who've lost theirs were those who really deserved it. (Smart but lazy ********!).

I really hope this helps.

Again, I think you'll be fine wherever you go. Just remember what counts in the end.

You answered the thread starter's dilemma succinctly. Your clincher would be mine too if I were given the luxury of choosing between the two. To the 2nd highlighted statement, a big :)

[n3X]

A very close family member has a similar dilemma. She was admitted to the ateneo, b.s. m.e, director's list (but she plans to shift to her 2nd choice, a.b. meco) and upd b.s. business economics.

Her mom is a u.p. honor grad (med), her dad finished business econ at upd and her kuya is a b.s. industrial engineering junior (oblation scholar).

Any thoughts? She wants to go against the grain ...

Then let her. Anybody is free to choose their own destiny.

Pero kung econ talaga gusto niya (meco and BE), the best UP SE. Sole CHED center of excellence in econ and unparalleled ang research nila sa region. Candid opinion: if she really wants to go against the grain, she should have a better reason of going to Ateneo.

[tyanak_soo]

I find little to admire with the Japanese and people who want to emulate them. Unlike Ateneans, they didn’t master the cunning and opportunism that’s needed to thrive in a dog-eat-dog world.

Go for Ateneo.
Yeah? Well understand the saying just the same. It was my point by the way. I find little to admire in a people who actually brag about getting ahead of others through networking, and being interviewed in job fairs 4 months ahead of graduation. At the UP, P&G, citibank and oher multinats call for applicants months ahead of seniors' graduation. I usually tell them "I might not even plan on graduating." :glee:

[cretinous00]

Her mom is a u.p. honor grad (med), her dad finished business econ at upd and her kuya is a b.s. industrial engineering junior (oblation scholar).

Any thoughts? She wants to go against the grain ...

She's adopted. No other explanation. :glee:

[purpleheadd07]

ok. i wasn't realistic then. i stand corrected.
but my point was just this: why would you aspire to be in ateneo when you can hardly pay off some bills and education was not a priority of the family?

whatever gave you the idea that people who can't afford good education can't aspire to be in any reputable school? just because you can hardly spend for it does not mean it's not a priority.

haven't you heard of institutions who give out scholarships to poor but deserving students? :bop:

i was bent in studying in an ateneo near my place in the province but the scholarship offer of admu was way too ideal to be disregarded. we had to sacrifice much just for me to get through 4 years of staying in the school. but all the sacrifices were always worth it.

not everyone in admu is mighty rich. ours has never been an institution who closes our doors for those who can't afford to be ideal.

sorry, i just found the statement too narrow minded. i admire your other well-researched posts ozzakii but i'm afraid there are other more important things you have to open your eyes for. :)



Im from UP also ComSci course pero pagdating sa computer studies magaling talaga ang Ateneo at DLSU. Tight competition ang 3 schools na yan. Pero since may scholarship ka sa ADMU its an added factor. Ang maganda sa UP kapag nag abroad ka tapos nalaman nila graduate ka ng UP hanga sila sa iyo. Ive travelled to many countries at na shocked talaga ako dahil kahit sa mga rural areas ng ibang bansa kilala ang Univ of the Philippines.

wow, nice seein you here, miss pokemohh! *okay*

[yurat]

To the thread starter: Make use as part of the basis of your decision the quality of the responses of people coming from the two schools --- I'm sure you will spot a difference. You want to have such mentality? It's your call!

[fraytorquemada]

Rona Francia:

Just ignore those who are engaging in petty upsmanship all the time in this forum...as if the world revolves around academic competition every time. Childish indeed. Besides, those who always engage in my-school-is-better-than-your-school argument are usually losers in real life. Rona, just take your pick because the reality is, either school can take you to places...high places.
OFT: There are folks from Diliman and Loyola right now who are doing excellent work that's way beyond mundane corporate or scientific endeavors; but remain on the mum because of the type of organization they work in. They may be branded as facilitators for the "Imperialist Pigs" by some blowheads. It's slightly likely ubermensh and physicist may know some of them.
In the most powerful organization (NSA) of the US government right now, there's a bunch of UPD and ADMU brainiacs. This organization also has the most genius per capita (not NASA...really not NASA). Four computer science/engineering nerds are from UPD. One Mathematician from UPD, and six from ADM (three of the six started as H1Bs). Most of them are not even citizens of the US...but these guys are so good that they were placed on the fast track with USCIS. All of them is so good that none of them is on the General Schedule (GS) of the regular pay/ salary scale of the Office of Personnel Management.
And yes, it appears they don't bicker over the stupid minutiae on which school is the better school.:)

[paenggoy]

Make a chart containing all of the factors you want to consider for these schools, then put a weight in percent form beside each factor based on its importance for you.

Next, visit both schools and talk to faculty and staff of the home department and feel free to ask them any questions that you might have regarding some of the factors that you wrote down. You can observe other factors yourself. You can also talk to people in charge in any placement offices, international programs offices, and others or look at information found in academic bulletins and other documents such as the number of people from a particular degree who studied abroad, availability of scholarship and requirements, and so forth.

Put a score for each factor, multiply the scores by the weights, and add the numbers for each school.

I passed both the ACET and the UPCAT. Now I'm confused! I'm still undecided. I just wanted to know some of your suggestions..

I passed UP Diliman (BS Computer Engineering) and I passed Ateneo de Manila University with BS Communications Technology Management.

AdMU is offering a 100 tution, fees and dorm scholarship which is why it is so difficult for me to reject it. It is also hard for me to refuse UP.



What do you think?... I need your help!!!

[ozaidum]

Go for Ateneo! :)

[Lady Chablis]

To the thread starter: Make use as part of the basis of your decision the quality of the responses of people coming from the two schools --- I'm sure you will spot a difference. You want to have such mentality? It's your call!

Indeed! If we base it on their English proficiency and the content, presentation and civility of their responses, which I believe are reflections of each school's quality education, then ADMU is superior. The proof is in the pudding!

[simmer]

UP got the history, ateneo got the nice modern facilities

[creesh]

isipin mo rin kung saan mo kaya mag fit in...:)

[plucker_08]

go to ateneo.

Give your UP slot to deserving yet not so rich students from the provinces.

tama. bigay mo na lang yung slot sa iba.

[rabbaddal]

Yeah? Well understand the saying just the same. It was my point by the way. I find little to admire in a people who actually brag about getting ahead of others through networking, and being interviewed in job fairs 4 months ahead of graduation. At the UP, P&G, citibank and oher multinats call for applicants months ahead of seniors' graduation. I usually tell them "I might not even plan on graduating." :glee:

Same with Ateneo. The MNCs and Top 100 call months ahead. But we tell them we'll work for investment banks or put up our own companies instead. It's a faster way to have more money, not to have something to brag about.

[_ozzakii]

Let me put this the simplest way:

General reputation of the school outside of the Philippines: UP >>> AdMU
School prestige in the Philippines: UP > AdMU
School prestige in Metro Manila: UP = AdMU
Course prestige: I have no idea
Employment opportunity for undergrad: UP = AdMU
Environment: relative to your personal taste
Connections: UP > AdMU
School Selectivity: UP > AdMU
Cost: AdMU > UP (since you are a schoolar)
Facilities: UP = AdMU
Faculty: I hove no idea


Biased advice:
Go to UP because it is UP. Let's be honest. Whether fair or not fair, UP is UP. If there is one school in the country that has masterfully cultivated a transcendent national brand name as an exclusive luxury good, it is THE University of the Philippines. I personally don't think it's fair. But hey, what can I say? It's not my fault. I didn't make the rules.

Note, that's not to say that there aren't other prestigious schools in the country, Of course there are, but again, the point is UP is UP. Even the administrators of AdMU, DLSU and UA&P have all conceded that their brand names do not yet match UP's.

The other major advantage of UP is, like I said, the alumni network which is arguably the most well connected and infamously incestuous alumni network in the country. Let's face it. Most of the best jobs in the Philippines are available only through social networks. You simply can't get them if you don't have access to the right people. Alumni networks are a powerful way to get that access. In particular, UP dominates the commanding heights of high finance with a highly disproportionate share of partners in private equity, VC, hedge funds, wealth management, and so forth. And if you wish to work for the government, the more visible can you see the advantage of a UP education as the government is dominated by UP people.


Unbiased advice:
If your interest in computer is academic, both programs are great, but I would give the edge to UP since UP has a tradition of academic excellence, has the best engineering education and is the number one feeder school to graduate engineering and IT programs number-wise or per capita-wise. If your interest is professional, meaning that you only wish to work in the financial domain when you graduate, then try to remember that a degree in Engineering is not required. Attending any top school, regardless of major, can open doors for you in the financial field. The Big-3 schools (UP, AdMU and DLSU) and UA&P are all awesome at preparing students for the next level. By awesome I mean as good as any top local Business school.

[bleep01]

Marami na actually ang nag turn down ng scholarship ng Ateneo in favour to UP. I even think there were more students who turned down the scholarship offer of Ateneo (for UP) than there were students who actually availed it. Check out Ateneo's statistics. 4,800 students passed this year. Only about 2k of them would actually enrol. That's not even 50% yield rate. UPD's admitted students this year: 3,800. Expected students to enrol: 3,400 or a yield rate of 89%.

Check this out: http://peyups.com/posts.khtml?dmode=viewtopic&topic=27353&forum=10

Wow! Unibersidad ng Pilipinas!!!:rotflmao:

[n3X]

Both are good schools. Believe me, I come from a family that traditionally went to either UP or Ateneo for college. If you are inclined to pursue a career in engineering then go to UP. If you're leaning towards a career in management go to Ateneo. Walang management course ang UPD.

So san nanggagaling yung mga naggragrandslam sa FINEX, ACPACI, Stratmark and PANA compets? Anong tawag sa BA and BAA? Si kuya naman e. :lol:

Indeed! If we base it on their English proficiency and the content, presentation and civility of their responses, which I believe are reflections of each school's quality education, then ADMU is superior. The proof is in the pudding!

Non sequitur. Malaking factor ang social class (and ang pagdominate nito sa pag-define ng what is "tasteful"). Hello?! Matagal nang lumabas ang Distinction: A Social Critique of the Judgment of Taste ni Bourdieu. Around 30 years ago na po! Lets not base our idea of what is good on the hegemony. Yang response na yan, in actuality, is reflective of the ignorance and colonial mentality ng writer. Hindi ibig sabihin na proficient sa foreign language, magaling presentation and "civil" e magaling na. Wag tayo magpalinlang sa façade.

Lady_Chablis ikaw po talaga. You're hiding again behind things that you don't really understand. :rolleyes:


Just ignore those who are engaging in petty upsmanship all the time in this forum...as if the world revolves around academic competition every time. Childish indeed. Besides, those who always engage in my-school-is-better-than-your-school argument are usually losers in real life. Rona, just take your pick because the reality is, either school can take you to places...high places.

And yes, it appears they don't bicker over the stupid minutiae on which school is the better school.:)

This statement is stereotypical and condescending. It is unappreciative of the diversity of opinion and the beauty of debate on how we, as humans, put value on differing kinds of experiences (educational or otherwise). Natural lang na others wouldn't really care while some would even impose their will (like parents). This kind of answer doesn't really help at all. How could one not recognize that these "minutiae" could spell a big difference on the life of one person. E di sana nag-toss a coin na lang siya and kahit ano okay na. So ano pa ba yung dilemna? I fully respect Ateneans who defend and support their school. Tama lang yun. These debates should play out para talagang magabayan and maconvince yung thread starter sa final decision niya. Malaki ang impact ng choice of school. We should know. Itong discussions are helpful because the problem gets threshed out. Kailangan din niya mahanap yung tamang reply (sa kahit anong form) that would say, that clinches it. Kung hindi tayo open sa debate, that says na hindi tayo open sa possibilities and "minutiae" that differentiate things. The world is not black and white, and it cant just be said that both schools are just fine. One shouldn't think that just because they put themselves in the middle, they have captured the moral and logical high ground.

To the thread starter: Make use as part of the basis of your decision the quality of the responses of people coming from the two schools --- I'm sure you will spot a difference. You want to have such mentality? It's your call!

So you're saying na rin na these responses are representative of the kind of thinking from the two schools? Ang poor naman na assessment nun.

tama. bigay mo na lang yung slot sa iba.

Ano to charity? :lol: Well technically, hindi naman talaga naibibigay yung slot kasi limited din lang yung waiting lists. So negligible lang din yun. Pero kahit maibibigay yung slot, sayang naman. The student earned that slot fair and square, s/he deserves yung education and experiences na in store for him/her.

[boy_wonder]

tama. bigay mo na lang yung slot sa iba.

I don't think the UPCAT works that way. The admission slots are fixed according to the UPG of the applicants. It's either you are eligible to enter this campus or you're not. Even if she decides to abandon her UPD slot, no one can practically benefit from it.

So yes, charity won't do much, and is therefore not a good excuse.:)

[hacksaw]

So san nanggagaling yung mga naggragrandslam sa FINEX, ACPACI, Stratmark and PANA compets? Anong tawag sa BA and BAA? Si kuya naman e. :lol:


Koya, I was referring to a degree equivalent to BS Mgt and BS Mgt-H of Ateneo.

[n3X]

Koya, I was referring to a degree equivalent to BS Mgt and BS Mgt-H of Ateneo.

Ugh BS Business Administration and BS Business Administration & Accountancy? :rotflmao: Kailangan ba parehong word yung gamitin? Anyway, pero hindi honors ang BAA. Walang ganun sa UP. Ang closest na nangyari is yung quota courses, which both courses were.

[gerald_tot]

Go to ADMU way better than up =D
bias opinion nga naman

[altair]

Well
...

But I do believe networking-wise after you graduate college especially if you find yourself wanting to work in the US, Ateneo has a stronger Alumni network. I have friends who went to both Ateneo and UP in the US and they find that the Ateneo Alumni network is very strong especially in the US.
...



But with the american economy going bust, a network in the us would not be very useful in the future (say, in the next 50 years) anymore.

[_ozzakii]

Can someone explain what this honour program of AdMU is? Its usage of the word is a little bit confusing. Well, it's either that or I'm just a little "ignorant" of their course offerings.

An honour program in other countries simply means the program is an integration of baccalaureate and masters and is usually offered for 5 years. (4 years bachelors + 1 year masters) Both the Management Honours and the Economics Honours of AdMU would categorically fit in this description. But those several "honour" programs they added lately clearly won't as they are offered one year less than the required number of years for an "honour'' program. In England, an honour program means it's 2:1, or 60% - 40%. Now, this sounds even more complicated for some of you here. :D

[altair]

I passed both the ACET and the UPCAT. Now I'm confused! I'm still undecided. I just wanted to know some of your suggestions..

I passed UP Diliman (BS Computer Engineering) and I passed Ateneo de Manila University with BS Communications Technology Management.

AdMU is offering a 100 tution, fees and dorm scholarship which is why it is so difficult for me to reject it. It is also hard for me to refuse UP.



What do you think?... I need your help!!!


You need to know what you really want.

By choosing BS Computer Engineering in your UPCAT applicatioin, what did you have in mind?

If you become a computer engineer, what do you think would you be doing?

What do you think does a computer engineer do?

At UP, if you study computer engineering, you could be a hardcore computer engineer and build computers on chips. At the microcomputer lab, seniors get to design microprocessors (e.g. an ARM implementation) and have them fabricated at a foundry such as tsmc (taiwan semicon manuf).



Do you envision yourself writing papers for IEEE conferences?

UPEEE drives its students to do research that could be presented at IEEE conferences.

see: 2007 Publications (http://eee.upd.edu.ph/index.php?option=com_content&task=view&id=246&Itemid=2)


A search with the IEEE also yielded the following:


search for ateneo de manila university


http://img.photobucket.com/albums/v316/kwanghwamun/ateneo.jpg




search for university of the philippines

http://img.photobucket.com/albums/v316/kwanghwamun/UP1.jpg

http://img.photobucket.com/albums/v316/kwanghwamun/UP2.jpg

http://img.photobucket.com/albums/v316/kwanghwamun/UP3.jpg

http://img.photobucket.com/albums/v316/kwanghwamun/UP4.jpg

[hacksaw]

Ugh BS Business Administration and BS Business Administration & Accountancy? :rotflmao: Kailangan ba parehong word yung gamitin? Anyway, pero hindi honors ang BAA. Walang ganun sa UP. Ang closest na nangyari is yung quota courses, which both courses were.

Did you look at the course content of BA and Ateneo's Mgt program?:D I guess not and at this point we'll have to agree to disagree.

[Lady Chablis]

Non sequitur. Malaking factor ang social class (and ang pagdominate nito sa pag-define ng what is "tasteful"). Hello?! Matagal nang lumabas ang Distinction: A Social Critique of the Judgment of Taste ni Bourdieu. Around 30 years ago na po! Lets not base our idea of what is good on the hegemony. Yang response na yan, in actuality, is reflective of the ignorance and colonial mentality ng writer. Hindi ibig sabihin na proficient sa foreign language, magaling presentation and "civil" e magaling na. Wag tayo magpalinlang sa façade.

Lady_Chablis ikaw po talaga. You're hiding again behind things that you don't really understand. :rolleyes:

Don't put words in my mouth, sir? Nowhere did I mention the word "taste" or "distasteful" in my thread. Civility [meaning, courtesy and politeness] has nothing to do with social status and class distinction. It doesn't even take a college education to be courteous and polite. It's strange how you use social and class distinction to justify English incompetence and lack of civility, but that's beside the point.

In terms of English proficiency and overall quality of the responses to the thread starter's query, ADMU simply outclasses UP. It is evident in either side's threads. That's all there is to it.

You're cute when you roll your eyes, but you're doing it too many, too often you're getting cross-eyed.

[fraytorquemada]

This statement is stereotypical and condescending.
I have to admit it's anecdotal. Maybe it's the white strands of hair on my head or maybe I'm just being a pain in the a$$; but I have to say that the most successful people I've met do not engage in school supremacy bickerings...so I guess bato bato sa langit..oh well.

It is unappreciative of the diversity of opinion and the beauty of debate on how we, as humans, put value on differing kinds of experiences (educational or otherwise).
By no means I'm trying to end debate. And even If I were, I was quite unsuccessful. What may be construed as my "fascist" attempt to squash debate merely added to the furtherance of the discussion. You may not want the "either" position, but it's a position nonetheless. It is a subset of the bigger body that is the "diversity of opinion."
This kind of answer doesn't really help at all. How could one not recognize that these "minutiae" could spell a big difference on the life of one person. E di sana nag-toss a coin na lang siya and kahit ano okay na.
Why not? I will not pretend to know UP, and I will not let my Ateneo bias get the better of me. What I do know from experience is either diploma works and spells success. Perhaps I don't belong in that school of thought that the journey is more important than the destination. But for somebody who works for a living, I value what a person has to show for in the end...after all the college rah rah rah. For somebody who actually adjudicated L1As and H1Bs of pinoy applicants, the "minutiae" between UP and Ateneo did not matter. What mattered was the fact that most academic evaluating agencies we (now defunct INS) dealt with recognized fully most UP and Ateneo diplomas as equivalent to north american degrees.

I fully respect Ateneans who defend and support their school. Tama lang yun. These debates should play out para talagang magabayan and maconvince yung thread starter sa final decision niya. Malaki ang impact ng choice of school..
I may be an atenean, but I'm my own mind. I wouldn't say everything ateneo is great. forcing me to take liberation theology was worst than water boarding in my opinion. those who defend their school is fine and dandy but the problem is when diehards can't seem to wean out from jerkdom and underhanded put downs. I have yet to hear J. Robert Oppenheimer whether he bragged that his dear old Harvard was better than Yale. As for impact, the compendium of successful ateneans and upians just keep on piling. Rona, look to the success of the alumni and you will come to the conclusion that the minutiae is just that-- a minutiae.
and it cant just be said that both schools are just fine. One shouldn't think that just because they put themselves in the middle, they have captured the moral and logical high ground.
.
why not? saying that both schools are good is a tenable position. as for which is one is better, one school can list its achievements like there's no tomorrow. But the funny thing is, the other school can also have its counter-compendium of debating championships, academic conquests, etc...So what appears to be a middle or "either" answer is a viable option given the venomous propensity for put-downs (in the guise of sound advise) by some posters here.

[cretinous00]

Come again, UP is outclassed by ADMU in both English and math as evidenced by huaat?

[yurat]

To the thread starter: Again, if I may reiterate, appreciate the quality of the responses. Not just the facility of language exhibited, the manner of expression but the posture taken and the logic, the line of reasoning (or the lack of it). Which do you prefer? It's your call!

[M5]

Go to UP...i strongly suggest...you're fortunate of passing UPCAT and be called one of the "cream of the crops"...2,500 out of the 65,000...

just imagine you did not have the scholarship, where would you go?

in the end, it's still your final say...

[iRebirth]

An honour program in other countries simply means the program is an integration of baccalaureate and masters and is usually offered for 5 years. (4 years bachelors + 1 year masters) Both the Management Honours and the Economics Honours of AdMU would categorically fit in this description.

if that is how foreign universities would define an honors program, then Eco-H and Mgt-H do not fit the description.
i'm not too sure but I would think that these courses have been labeled "Honors" because of the more rigorous curriculum (for example, Eco-H would have Linear Algebra whereas the standard Economics program would stop at a semester of calculus). Also, students in these programs have to meet a certain QPI every semester to stay in the honors course. (not too sure how it works because i'm not an atenean hehe)

of course the "honors" label in these programs should be distinguished from the courses that only the top 15% of ACET takers are eligible to major in. furthermore, note that there are "nonquota" courses that are actually worthwhile and aren't listed as quota courses because these aren't considered in demand.

(and CommTech is NOT one of those worthwhile courses! If you are going to Ateneo, please shift to another course. I believe ADMU's Comp Engg program is not a quota course. so when you confirm your slot, inquire if you may shift to comp engg.)

P.S.
Go to UP! *okay*

[Shinobi No Kami]

If you wanna focus on the technical, UPD should be the obvious choice.

[_ozzakii]

In terms of English proficiency and overall quality of the responses to the thread starter's query, ADMU simply outclasses UP. It is evident in either side's threads.

I hate to admit this but this evidently true. and this is not only evident in several message boards that I lurked in but including in real face-to-face conversation with students of both schools. (UP Manila students are not included though.) In other words, an average Ateneo (de Manila) student is generally a better communicator than is an average UP (Diliman) student. This is not however in any way mean that there are no exceptionally talented communicators in UPd. That's far from the truth. In fact, the best UP communicators (either written or oral) IMO, are still a little bit better than the best Ateneo communicators, that is why the print and broadcast media industry are dominated by UP graduates. But since we’re talking about the aggregate student body of both schools and generalities, I would say Ateneo beats UPd in this area.

Here's how I think why:

1. The UPd student body is almost twice as big as Ateneo's. Half of UPd's student population are engineering and science students. Engineering and science geeks, though they're quite smart and extremely talented students, are not blessed with the gift of gab. Let’s admit it. Yes, they’re very smart students, but they're not exactly the type of students who would make a lasting mesmerizing impression due to their flamboyant speaking abilities.

2. UPd students are extremes. Some students are real conios and love to speak English all the time. Some of you don't exactly like them but that's their real nature and you cannot take that away from them. Let's admit it. That's who they are and what they really are. This kind of students are often found in the colleges of business, economics, home economics, arts and letters, mass communication, architecture, and particularly, the dept of Psychology. (I am excluding Law b/coz it is a professional graduate program and 30% of college's student body were former Ateneans.) The other group of UPd students are the anti-social type of students who often times don't enjoy talking to other people. This type of students may exactly be good listeners but they're exactly authentic bummer at the same time. They rarely talk to you and they let you feel that their time is better spent studying than talking to you. Oftentimes, people misjudge them as discriminating and arrogant because they rarely blend with students from other colleges. They're not dumb nor are they conceited. They’re just silent students but they’re often a real bummer to the socially outgoing type of students.






Nevertheless, the training of communication is best done on high school level, thus I seriously hope that the TS is not stupid enough to base his decision solely on which school could better drill him with the proper tools to becoming a better communicator (in English or whatever language) as he is majoring in IT/engineering, which is by itself, is a highly and specialized technical oriented course. Otherwise, he should major AB Communication or something with similar course content.

[_ozzakii]

Same with Ateneo. The MNCs and Top 100 call months ahead. But we tell them we'll work for investment banks or put up our own companies instead. It's a faster way to have more money, not to have something to brag about.



Let me ask our friend rabbddal here how many Ateneans do actually end up in IB every year. I know UPd is quite a target school for top bulge bracket firms but even UPd does not send as many grads to IB in a year. For example, McKinsey, the most notorious IB firm when in comes to recruitment, has invited only 3 grads with undergrad qualification last year. I heard one of the three successful applicants was an Atenean grad but the other 2 were UPd grads (1 BAA and 1 Computer Science). Over at JPMorgan, I'm quite certain that the ratio of UPd to Ateneo is 2:1. But there are only 12 UP grads at JPMorgan, so that should tell you how many Ateneans are there at JPMorgan. look, I'm not saying you're just baloney. But I'm hoping you can tell us an IB firm where there's a huge congregation of Ateneans so that UPd grads can break through it in the future.

[cretinous00]

Here in the academe it's easy to see what a person's really made of. Base your decision on forumers' ability to write and turn a phrase...

:rolleyes:

[hahahaok]

With the scholarship, go to AdMU.

I haven't heard enough news about UP's restructured STFAP ( Socialized Tuition and Financial Assistance Program) but before, there were issues of unfair bracketing, etc.. (I think they are more generous now). However, there are other scholarships available for freshmen, just go to the office of scholarships. (Some sort of hassles.. but if you're early enough to apply, that will be a lot better!)

I don't know much of AdMU's CMT.
If you really wanted to be an engineer, then go to UP. Enrolling at UP's EEE (the department that offers the CoE program) opens you to different opportunities. You are not just limited to topics covering CoE (networking, microprocessors, etc.). You could even specialize with wireless communications, instrumentation, robotics or industrial automation. Take your pick.

FYI, this early, around 15~20 graduating CoE's are invited by SMART Telco to apply to the company. Also, UPD is a member of AUN/SEEd. Do good and you can apply for a scholarship for your graduate studies abroad (ASEAN host university, NUS or a university in Japan).
But I think, this one is for faculty development; you must be planning a carrer in the academe.

Why not visit the department.>>
http://eee.upd.edu.ph/

and the research labs>>
http://eee.upd.edu.ph/index.php?option=com_content&task=view&id=26&Itemid=35#rlabs

[n3X]

Did you look at the course content of BA and Ateneo's Mgt program?:D I guess not and at this point we'll have to agree to disagree.

Ugh yeah? They are counterparts. I'm from BA.

Don't put words in my mouth, sir? Nowhere did I mention the word "taste" or "distasteful" in my thread. Civility [meaning, courtesy and politeness] has nothing to do with social status and class distinction. It doesn't even take a college education to be courteous and polite. It's strange how you use social and class distinction to justify English incompetence and lack of civility, but that's beside the point.

In terms of English proficiency and overall quality of the responses to the thread starter's query, ADMU simply outclasses UP. It is evident in either side's threads. That's all there is to it.

Obviously you didnt get my point. Should everything be stated literally? :rolleyes:

I would never justify english "incompetence" through using social and class distinction. You're the one putting words in my mouth. Napag-usapan na yan sa isang thread dito and I was quick to point out the same thing. What I'm saying is malaking role ang social class (source of stylistics or saying things in a way that could be said as elegant/tasteful) sa "proficiency" sa english or kahit anong language. That was one of the major points sa work ni Bordieu.

Finally, I am fully conscious dun sa civility, I wasn't attacking that part. Kaya nga I put quotation marks dun sa civil. Read again.

[batangmarikit]

eto n lang, may balak k bang mag aral pa sa abroad? like harvard or MIT after ng undergrad? kung oo, mag UP ka na.

[math_techie]

if you plan to pursue graduate studies in computer engineering, then it should definitely be UP. But if you plan to work right after, then go to Ateneo, simply because of the scholarship.

[letsgo]

I came from UP and it is a tough good school. There are also so many smart people. Some professors I didn't like as they hardly taught and left you on your own. Facilities in UP need improvement when I was there. The students are from all levels of society and not just the elite. I imagine the environment in Ateneo would be more calm and controlled.

[n3X]

I have to admit it's anecdotal. Maybe it's the white strands of hair on my head or maybe I'm just being a pain in the a$$; but I have to say that the most successful people I've met do not engage in school supremacy bickerings...so I guess bato bato sa langit..oh well.

I'll just assume then that you've not met a lot of graduates from UP. For I have encountered alumni who don't bicker over trivial things, but do something much worse. They just dismiss non-graduates of the university as lesser beings--which, for me, is quite unfair. I would rather quarrel over these things because I think it's necessary for us to regard each other as equals. Egalité, as the French would say.

By no means I'm trying to end debate. And even If I were, I was quite unsuccessful. What may be construed as my "fascist" attempt to squash debate merely added to the furtherance of the discussion. You may not want the "either" position, but it's a position nonetheless. It is a subset of the bigger body that is the "diversity of opinion."

That is true and I fully respect your opinion. I, however, never mentioned anything about you trying to end the debate. What I said was, your statement was unappreciative.

Why not? I will not pretend to know UP, and I will not let my Ateneo bias get the better of me. What I do know from experience is either diploma works and spells success. Perhaps I don't belong in that school of thought that the journey is more important than the destination. But for somebody who works for a living, I value what a person has to show for in the end...after all the college rah rah rah. For somebody who actually adjudicated L1As and H1Bs of pinoy applicants, the "minutiae" between UP and Ateneo did not matter. What mattered was the fact that most academic evaluating agencies we (now defunct INS) dealt with recognized fully most UP and Ateneo diplomas as equivalent to north american degrees.

Ganun lang ba yun? Work output? Level of accomplishment? Equivalency of recognition? I know where you're coming from. It's part of the universe of considerations the thread starter must mull over. What I would like to point out are the other things that are rarely realized and stated. Katulad ng kamulatan, among other things. Sino bang high school senior ang nag-isip ng, "saang school ba ako ma-eemancipate sa conventional and/or superficial thinking?" Most of us look at prestige, the major or the cost. I'm not trying to bash or put down any schools here. I'm sure students from UP also missed out on a plethora of wonderful experiences in other schools. Trade-offs lang lahat yan diba? From a very personal point of view, the thread starter is now given a chance to participate in an experience that I, among other people, was greatly affected by. Na nung mag-UP Naming Mahal nung kickoff e marami sa amin halos maiyak, not because we were proud or so happy, it was this coalescence of memories and concepts, this grand idea that moved us and changed us forever. And as any proud alumnus of any school would do, I would convince the thread starter to go to my university. Diba? Natural lang yun. Lahat tayo iba-iba yung pananaw talaga dito. Natural lang nag magtalo-talo.

But anyway parang naging senti na ako dun. In any case, I would like to attack those "minutiae." I should've done this in the first place. So yun nga, in the first place, I dont think one could consider the differences between UP and Ateneo as "minutiae."

Furthermore, to attack din the equivalency between the degrees, I would give you yung immigration thing, but why is it then na UP lang yung recognized internationally na nagbibigay ng full college degree? I have encountered UP alumni who are graduate students in foreign institutions of higher learning, na kapag hindi raw UP undergrad mo, they will require you to take master units pa before admission.

Lastly, sorry mahaba talaga ako sumagot, why? Because the conclusion is no frivolous matter. The same debate must also rage inside the thread starter's mind for him or her to arrive at a sound, final decision.

I may be an atenean, but I'm my own mind. I wouldn't say everything ateneo is great. forcing me to take liberation theology was worst than water boarding in my opinion. those who defend their school is fine and dandy but the problem is when diehards can't seem to wean out from jerkdom and underhanded put downs. I have yet to hear J. Robert Oppenheimer whether he bragged that his dear old Harvard was better than Yale. As for impact, the compendium of successful ateneans and upians just keep on piling. Rona, look to the success of the alumni and you will come to the conclusion that the minutiae is just that-- a minutiae.

Alumni lang pala labanan e. hehehe *kidding*

And plural noun ang minutiae.

why not? saying that both schools are good is a tenable position. as for which is one is better, one school can list its achievements like there's no tomorrow. But the funny thing is, the other school can also have its counter-compendium of debating championships, academic conquests, etc...So what appears to be a middle or "either" answer is a viable option given the venomous propensity for put-downs (in the guise of sound advise) by some posters here.

Doesn't that make you a poor judge of compendia of evidence? (rhetorical) How about conviction (in both senses of the word)?

Last hirit na to for this post. So ano ngayon kung maraming put-downs. Ganun talaga ang mundo. E di lumaban ka rin diba. :rotflmao:

[la_flash]

Let me ask our friend rabbddal here how many Ateneans do actually end up in IB every year. I know UPd is quite a target school for top bulge bracket firms but even UPd does not send as many grads to IB in a year. For example, McKinsey, the most notorious IB firm when in comes to recruitment, has invited only 3 grads with undergrad qualification last year. I heard one of the three successful applicants was an Atenean grad but the other 2 were UPd grads (1 BAA and 1 Computer Science). Over at JPMorgan, I'm quite certain that the ratio of UPd to Ateneo is 2:1. But there are only 12 UP grads at JPMorgan, so that should tell you how many Ateneans are there at JPMorgan. look, I'm not saying you're just baloney. But I'm hoping you can tell us an IB firm where there's a huge congregation of Ateneans so that UPd grads can break through it in the future.

You know too much about these schools and their graduates (not just graduates but with latin honors) that you're becoming unbelievable.

It's either you really know these things or the search engine you're using is marvelous. :lol:

[_ozzakii]

You know too much about these schools and their graduates (not just graduates but with latin honors) that you're becoming unbelievable.

It's either you really know these things or the search engine you're using is marvelous.

Or to just somebody who knows how to access the data, right? UP staff employees and faculty have access to the database. Or maybe I'm married or related to somebody on the staff? Who knows, right? Have you asked me what my first job was? Couldn't someone from Warwick get into IB? The possibilities are endless. Hmnnn... :naughty:

Anyway, feel free to correct/refute the data -- if you think they're not accurate.

[purpleheadd07]

ayan nawala na si rona francia, ang gulo nyo kse..malamang mag college na lang sya sa bayan nila :p

:glee:

[bluecross]

This is not entirely true. There are far more UP grads going abroad to study postgrad than are Ateneans. The Fulbright and Chevening scholarship grants are dominated by UP grads. Even private sponsored scholarship grants are dominated by UP grads --from Shell to Ayala. And on top of that, Banatao sponsors UP grads who wish to take up postgrad studies in IT/science and Engineering at either UC Berkeley or Stanford. Such privilege is not extended to Ateneans. Most Ateneans entering schools abroad are in business schools, which is understandable given many undergrad courses in Ateneo are business-oriented. But if the TS is sure that IT is what she wants to do after college life, UP is the best place for her to go. If she wants to go into Investment Banking, UP IT grads are also core schools for IB jobs. For example, 5 UP IT grads have joined McKinsey in the past 5 years. 11 have joined JPMorgan during the same number of years. And UP is a core school for recruitment for HSBC, Citigroup and Standard Chartered. Join peyups.com if you wish to know more about how marketable UP grads are. In fact, they’re so marketable that even a mere Library Science grad can get into HSBC, Citi and the like.

About two weeks ago, a friend of mine who’s a Harvard Business School grad emailed me the number of Filipinos who are alumni of Harvard Business School. HBS is the best business school in the world. Here are the numbers:

UP - 46 (+ 3 currently enrolled. 5 made got an offer but only 3 enrolled)
AdMU - 30
DLSU - 18
UE - 8
UST - 1
MSU-Iligan Institute of Technology - 2
University of San Carlos – 1

Sure, there are many Ateneo alumni in the US. But in what way can they be of help to you when you decide to study abroad later on? Will they pay your tuition? Well, I have not heard any Atenan done that yet. Maybe it happened in the past. But I personally have never heard of it. I do, however, know UP alumni do that to UP grads. In fact, a number of fraternities have done that several times in the past. I personally know someone who went to the University of Cambridge in England to study epidemiology for 3 years as a recipient of his fraternity. Is there something like that in Ateneo? I don’t know. I haven’t heard of any yet.

How can you prove that there are more UP alumnus who go to graduate school than Ateneans? With the number of Chevening and Full Bright scholars awarded? Ateneans are richer,.. WE CAN PAY FOR OUR TUITION FEES.

UP students are also greater in number. You have to take that into consideration.

There are also other ways of going graduate school. Remember, Ateneans are generally richer than UP students. We have the means to pay for CAT prep materials, applications fees, etc. I'm not saying we're smarter, I'm saying that our few extra bucks will put us in a better position to go to graduate schools.

There are also a lot more business schools and graduate schools than HBS. HBS isn't even the best business school in the world. There's Wharton, Kellog, CGSB, Standford BS, etc.

May mga iba rin graduate/prof schools, medicine, education etc. Ang bilis mo mag generalize. HBS lang ang data mo, remember.

And maybe someday when your fraternities can finally stop killing their own neophytes, we can give them am *okay*

Mahiya ka sana sa sarilii mo. You always brag about your money, but you go to a school where tax payers pay for your tuition. Worst, wala nang lumalabas sa bunganga mo kung hindi "abroad". Mahiya ka sa sarili mo pare..

[chubbita]

the close relative i mentioned in an earlier post has finally decided to go to u.p. she will be graduating as valedictorian in a super expensive exclusive opus dei girl's school in alabang this april. hats off to her for mustering enough courage to leave her comfort zone and slug it out with the best of the best. she is in the top 2% of ateneo passers but she's also in the top 50 of upcat passers nationwide.

i hope rona has the guts to choose u.p. too

p.s. i graduated summa cum laude from u.p. diliman in 1982, hehe

[physicist]

but why is it then na UP lang yung recognized internationally na nagbibigay ng full college degree? I have encountered UP alumni who are graduate students in foreign institutions of higher learning, na kapag hindi raw UP undergrad mo, they will require you to take master units pa before admission.


Just a question borne out of genuine curiosity: Which institutions are these? And in what fields were these graduate studies?

Thanks.

[fraytorquemada]

I'll just assume then that you've not met a lot of graduates from UP. For I have encountered alumni who don't bicker over trivial things, but do something much worse. They just dismiss non-graduates of the university as lesser beings--which, for me, is quite unfair. I would rather quarrel over these things because I think it's necessary for us to regard each other as equals. Egalité, as the French would say.:
Never assume. Assumption is the mother of all f-ups (just a common expression at my workplace). A great number of my friends are from UP. They used to hang out at cervini residence hall and even ask for assistance in some of their homework; or pick our brains on whatever research or position papers they're doing...and it worked vice versa. Five of my first cousins are from UP as well and not once the issue of supremacy was ever raised. Whether with my UP friends or with my cousins, the whole UP-Ateneo relationship was one of mutual admiration--unless the mutual admiration was disingenuous, then I wouldn't have had any control over it. I guess I come from a different perspective and looks at the whole UPD-ADMU issue through a rosier prism where we debated if Heidegger was a hardened NAZI, or if Marcos was a necessary evil, or if democratic socialism is just another code word for communism. We had fun--that's the bottomline. Believe you me, I'm no Mr. Kumbaya-lets-all-be-friends for those who know me. In my line of work, I sometimes have to snuff out people's lives. I may be living in a different world, but I've never experienced such hostility (usually UP on Ateneo) until I started combing through this site. So, have you ever had the pleasure (or displeasure) of meeting an Atenean in flesh and bone? Was it such a horrid experience?!



Ganun lang ba yun? Work output? Level of accomplishment? Equivalency of recognition? I know where you're coming from. It's part of the universe of considerations the thread starter must mull over. What I would like to point out are the other things that are rarely realized and stated. Katulad ng kamulatan, among other things. Sino bang high school senior ang nag-isip ng, "saang school ba ako ma-eemancipate sa conventional and/or superficial thinking?" Most of us look at prestige, the major or the cost. I'm not trying to bash or put down any schools here. I'm sure students from UP also missed out on a plethora of wonderful experiences in other schools. Trade-offs lang lahat yan diba? From a very personal point of view, the thread starter is now given a chance to participate in an experience that I, among other people, was greatly affected by. Na nung mag-UP Naming Mahal nung kickoff e marami sa amin halos maiyak, not because we were proud or so happy, it was this coalescence of memories and concepts, this grand idea that moved us and changed us forever. And as any proud alumnus of any school would do, I would convince the thread starter to go to my university. Diba? Natural lang yun. Lahat tayo iba-iba yung pananaw talaga dito. Natural lang nag magtalo-talo.

God, you sound just like some Ateneans I know brimming with pride and idealism. Talagang feel na feel. Hey nothing wrong with that. But you are implying that UP has cornered the market on "kamalayan" and "kamulatan." One thing I'll give to UP is the advantage in the diversity of its student body. But Ateneo's history (distant and in the making) has been all about standing at the forefront of social change and social justice (for which i'm leary). This whole kamulatan enterprise will still depend on the student--no amount of diverse experiences an environment offers or no matter how solid the core curriculum is. In the end (after graduation), the realist in all of us will want to break free and tackle real "survival" issues. Perhaps our more strident left-wing fantasies will linger after graduation; but when the dust truly settles, it's all about making a "killing" or a good living....and yes, it goes the same for our commie and anarchist brothers.


but why is it then na UP lang yung recognized internationally na nagbibigay ng full college degree? I have encountered UP alumni who are graduate students in foreign institutions of higher learning, na kapag hindi raw UP undergrad mo, they will require you to take master units pa before admission.
well, I and many more (our resident math and physics wizards) in this forum have just debunked what you said. i was admitted at the prestigious National War College in DC for my grad school without having to "upgrade" any of my undergrad courses. All that was needed was my GRE score, and the evaluation from the World Education Service.


Lastly, sorry mahaba talaga ako sumagot, why? Because the conclusion is no frivolous matter. The same debate must also rage inside the thread starter's mind for him or her to arrive at a sound, final decision.
I'll make it easy on the thread starter. Pick UP for the obvious reason -- it's UP. But you will NEVER regret picking Ateneo. If you love to learn--then Ateneo's core curriculum is for you where you can be a math wiz with a flair for Chaucer and a sensitive existentialism of a Gabriel Marcel. Choose Ateneo because you can also have that strong sense of "kamulatan" and "kamalayan" but perhaps in a more tempered, discerning, and sometimes contemplative manner (but it's still a choice). Choose Ateneo because we are not just talking about the ateneo network of alumni around the world but also the more powerful Jesuit network. A few times I've heard some of my American job interviewers comment-- "so you went to a Jesuit school." And in those few times, the interview worked in my favor. Choose Ateneo for its loud and thunderous "one big fight" and "halikinu" cheers during uaap games...it's a great feeling especially when you sing heartily the Song for Mary. Some Ateneans construe these as a sense of supremacy...not for me. For me, it's just an awesome experience equal to none. Pero kung UP ang pipiliin mo, hindi ka rin dehado.



And plural noun ang minutiae.
I'm gracious even in error. I just hope this won't be Rona's sole determinant for dropping admu.



Doesn't that make you a poor judge of compendia of evidence? (rhetorical) How about conviction (in both senses of the word)? .
Ateneo's glorious past, influential present need not be listed (so is UP's). As much as I love Ateneo, my sense of basic fairness is intact. Based on whatever great experiences I had with UP and it's minions, it is just simply unfair for me dismiss the latter just because Ateneo is a great school. Thus, my conviction lies in my homage to free will-- in this case, the thread starter's free will.


Last hirit na to for this post. So ano ngayon kung maraming put-downs. Ganun talaga ang mundo. E di lumaban ka rin diba. :rotflmao:
You love to complicate (which has a function in human dynamics). But I love to simplify. The putdowns are fine. I just want the thread starter to get past them...and see the more salient and positive points of the two schools. I still suspect though that those who love to prop their respective schools by stepping on the other school underhandedly or overtly are true "winners" in life. And as far as conflict is concerned, whatever conflict is going on in this forum is not giving justice to the word conflict that I know. None of the posters here have experienced what conflict really is...which is constant blood and guts...and not empty words. There is no debate is Waziristan.

I really hope Rona is learning from these exchanges. Don't forget to respond when you made your selection. :)

[KuyaDanny]

How can you prove that there are more UP alumnus who go to graduate school than Ateneans?

Not trying to prove anything, but consider that this is highly probable for the simple reason that there are more UP graduates than Ateneo (college) graduates. So if there are more of them around, there might also be more of them in the graduate schools.

[Ice Burn]

TS, if you can do it, study abroad. I'm sure you are pretty smart. Apply for scholarships. Are you a guy or a girl? If you are a girl, you have more openings for scholarships especially since you are from a developing country.

here's a link to help you find scholarships abroad http://www.fastweb.com

You can research the ASEAN University Network Scholarship and try studying in NUS.

Aside from US universities, check out universities from Japan, Singapore, Europe, Australia etc as you'll have top notch facilities and full hands on experience whether you focus on Computer Engineering or Communications Technology.

In the long run you'll have received a more valuable learning experience (access to better facilities, multiculturalism, independence, exposure to various experts in the field and so forth...)

Both Ateneo and UP are good but if you look some of those who studied in these schools most especially some of those who post here, would you really want to end up like some of the people who bicker here? Their crowning glory is merely graduating from either schools hence they need to brag about their school alumni's achievements because they have none to speak of.

Good Luck

[cretinous00]

I probably agree that the more successful a person is, the less he or she will worry about his/her school's image, However there are notable exceptions.

Ferdinand Marcos, arguably the most influential alumni of UP (and some say the only great leader the Philippines ever had), was a rabid pro-UP and anti-all-others bastige. His hiring policy during the dictatorship years was so that his (UP) cohorts exert influence over the country to this day.

Miriam's "lesser-beings" stand is trivial by comparison but it still says a lot considering her stature in the country. Only the death of her son softened her attitude.

And how many summa cum laudes from UP have you met working in Makati? That place was never a hot prospect for most of them. Also says a lot about how much they value their working time.

Oh by the way, TS, if you're really smart, you'll stop visiting this site. :glee:

[bluecross]

Not trying to prove anything, but consider that this is highly probable for the simple reason that there are more UP graduates than Ateneo (college) graduates. So if there are more of them around, there might also be more of them in the graduate schools.

Yes, I mentioned that in my post :)

[n3X]

Just a question borne out of genuine curiosity: Which institutions are these? And in what fields were these graduate studies?

Thanks.

Well wala pa akong friend na kakilala talaga, I just graduated last summer. Mostly friends ng friends tapos matatanda. From what I remember, yung isang nakausap ko, a top school in the UK (not Oxbridge). Na-memention lang in passing, kasi di rin alam kung bakit. . I have read some din sa peyups.com, there are several posts there that mention it. You could ask those posters directly. ;) Sorry cant be of much help.

[_ozzakii]

I admire your tenacity and strong self will not to mention your oozing school pride, but clearly, you are an awfully misinformed guy.




How can you prove that there are more UP alumnus who go to graduate school than Ateneans? With the number of Chevening and Full Bright scholars awarded? Ateneans are richer,.. WE CAN PAY FOR OUR TUITION FEES.
Then tell if you know of an Atenean who went to Harvard, Stanford, Berkeley or any top foreign school and shouldered the fees all by himself. For your information, one of the 30 Ateneans who have gone to HBS is actually a family friend of ours. His father can't even afford to buy a brand new car. Check your PM box. I will send you his name momentarily.

The propaganda that the Ateneans are richer than the UPD and UPM students would no longer hold today. Maybe that was true several eras ago, but today only 7% of the UPD student body came from public high school and more than half of the student population are paying the FULL fees. A Bracket-A student means the student’s parents earn not less than 1M a year. On the contrary, 27% of the student body of AdMU are banking on a scholarship grant. If Ateneo has 7.5k students, then a little over 2k of the Ateneo student population of Ateneo is not exactly that wealthy. And maybe, YOU are one of those students. But I don't care.



WE CAN PAY FOR OUR TUITION FEES.
You mean the tuition fees abroad? Stop kidding yourself. Let me be frank with you. Most Ateneans cannot afford to go to schools abroad. Yes, there are a few who can, but most cannot. This is a plain and simple fact.

Do you have any idea how expensive the tuition at top foreign school? Do you have any idea how costly to live abroad – for 3 years? Warwick’s tuition, for example, is 1.2M a year and Warwick in not even in London where everything in London is expensive. Maybe that has gone down now that the peso has gain significantly against the British Pounds, but still, how many Ateneans can afford to pay 1.2M a year for tuition alone for 3 consecutive years? Add to that – how many Ateneans can afford to live in the UK for 3 years? Did you know that a bottle of mineral water in the UK would already cost one hundred pesos? Studying and staying in a foreign country is very expensive. And aside from tuition fees and living cost associated with studying in a foreign school, there’s additional expenses needed for travel such as airfare plus an additional funding for the European–ERASMUS program, which is an almost a must activity to participate in for any British university student. I guess not a lot. So stop kidding yourself and stop saying that Ateneans, in general, can afford to study abroad. Look, I am not even talking about a top US school here and or the tuition charges for postgrad progams at a top US school like an MBA at Harvard, a Law at Yale, an MS in Engineering at MIT or a PhD in Chemistry at UC Berkeley. These programs, though shorter than undergrad, are way more expensive.




[quoe]We have the means to pay for CAT prep materials, applications fees, etc. [/quote]And are you trying to tell me that UP grads can't afford to pay for grad school applications abroad? LoL...




HBS isn't even the best business school in the world. There's Wharton, Kellog, CGSB, Standford BS, etc.
Let's leave this out from the discussion. Neither of us is a student or alumnus of Harvard anyway. LoL...




Mahiya ka sana sa sarilii mo. You always brag about your money, but you go to a school where tax payers pay for your tuition. Worst, wala nang lumalabas sa bunganga mo kung hindi "abroad". Mahiya ka sa sarili mo pare..
Once again, playing the straw man game. Did I SAY that I am rich? Please point to the quote where I specifically said that I am a rich guy. Can't do it, can you? That's because I never said it. Read my posts more carefully.

[n3X]

Never assume. Assumption is the mother of all f-ups (just a common expression at my workplace). A great number of my friends are from UP. They used to hang out at cervini residence hall and even ask for assistance in some of their homework; or pick our brains on whatever research or position papers they're doing...and it worked vice versa. Five of my first cousins are from UP as well and not once the issue of supremacy was ever raised. Whether with my UP friends or with my cousins, the whole UP-Ateneo relationship was one of mutual admiration--unless the mutual admiration was disingenuous, then I wouldn't have had any control over it. I guess I come from a different perspective and looks at the whole UPD-ADMU issue through a rosier prism where we debated if Heidegger was a hardened NAZI, or if Marcos was a necessary evil, or if democratic socialism is just another code word for communism. We had fun--that's the bottomline. Believe you me, I'm no Mr. Kumbaya-lets-all-be-friends for those who know me. In my line of work, I sometimes have to snuff out people's lives. I may be living in a different world, but I've never experienced such hostility (usually UP on Ateneo) until I started combing through this site. So, have you ever had the pleasure (or displeasure) of meeting an Atenean in flesh and bone? Was it such a horrid experience?!

Never assume? Hahaha Goodluck sa taong di nag-aassume, even sa proverbial maling akala.

Iba yun e. Those are your contemporaries. Plus they're your friends and family. How about strangers? How about yung 7-10 years older? Or next generation na siguro. ;)

And iba rin itong pex. Different ang behavior and interaction ng mga tao sa online fora. Obvious naman diba? Makikipag-usap ka ba sa tao sa kanto tapos magdedebate kayo? On the other hand, the same is true din. Sa "totoong" buhay, di ganun ka-open yung mga remarks na ganun (against "others"). Siyempre isa siyang inside na hirit. Masama siya, because it could be considered as intellectual snobbery. :bop:

Marami akong friends na Ateneans. Dont worry, chill naman kami. ;)


God, you sound just like some Ateneans I know brimming with pride and idealism. Talagang feel na feel. Hey nothing wrong with that. But you are implying that UP has cornered the market on "kamalayan" and "kamulatan." One thing I'll give to UP is the advantage in the diversity of its student body. But Ateneo's history (distant and in the making) has been all about standing at the forefront of social change and social justice (for which i'm leary). This whole kamulatan enterprise will still depend on the student--no amount of diverse experiences an environment offers or no matter how solid the core curriculum is. In the end (after graduation), the realist in all of us will want to break free and tackle real "survival" issues. Perhaps our more strident left-wing fantasies will linger after graduation; but when the dust truly settles, it's all about making a "killing" or a good living....and yes, it goes the same for our commie and anarchist brothers.

Haha Yeah, siguro ganun nga. Hehe

I never implied anything about UP having a monopoly on kamulatan. Do I think people in UP could be mulat? Mostly, if not only some. Kahit medyo sad siya, ganun talaga ka-diverse dun. Yung kamalayan and kamulatan di kailangan ng education naman nun e. Pero I would have to assert na yung diversity of experiences really keeps an open mind. And that is key.

Then dun naman sa "realist"--sounds more like a sellout. You mentioned communists and anarchists pero from your post, it's obvious that you don't really understand the underpinnings of the SYSTEM and its circumstances (economic,social, cultural and political). Duh! Malamang subjugated sila dahil neoliberalism nga ang dominant ideology sa world systems ngayon! Siyempre they would still need to follow yung present "rules" to survive diba. Pero, lets not forget, yung iba namundok na rin at humawak ng baril, establishing another "government?" Lets not be naive. Mula Martial Law, marami nang tibak ang nag-alay ng buhay nila. Yes, it PAYS to be practical. Kailangan balanced din yung idealism natin with practicality. That's why yung "commie and anarchist brothers" e buhay pa rin ngayon. Concurrently, that's also why they really shine din. Because of their vibrant idealism, they see that how we live is really flawed and, instead of living just for themselves, they persistently seek to change it!

So san nangyari naman itong asa forefront ang Ateneo sa social change and social justice sa distant past? Sumilao? Tanong lang naman. Hehe :D

well, I and many more (our resident math and physics wizards) in this forum have just debunked what you said. i was admitted at the prestigious National War College in DC for my grad school without having to "upgrade" any of my undergrad courses. All that was needed was my GRE score, and the evaluation from the World Education Service.

Yeah that's true. Marami na nga ang naka-graduate school na hindi na pinakuha ng extra units. Hmmm Bakit parang it doesnt make sense tuloy.

My fault. I try to recall but I cant remember the specific details. Its like schools in the UK and/or if you dont have work experience, or something like that. Not really sure. But I remember talking about it with two or three friends of friends, then online in peyups.com. Sorry labo. My bad.


I'll make it easy on the thread starter. Pick UP for the obvious reason -- it's UP. But you will NEVER regret picking Ateneo. If you love to learn--then Ateneo's core curriculum is for you where you can be a math wiz with a flair for Chaucer and a sensitive existentialism of a Gabriel Marcel. Choose Ateneo because you can also have that strong sense of "kamulatan" and "kamalayan" but perhaps in a more tempered, discerning, and sometimes contemplative manner (but it's still a choice). Choose Ateneo because we are not just talking about the ateneo network of alumni around the world but also the more powerful Jesuit network. A few times I've heard some of my American job interviewers comment-- "so you went to a Jesuit school." And in those few times, the interview worked in my favor. Choose Ateneo for its loud and thunderous "one big fight" and "halikinu" cheers during uaap games...it's a great feeling especially when you sing heartily the Song for Mary. Some Ateneans construe these as a sense of supremacy...not for me. For me, it's just an awesome experience equal to none. Pero kung UP ang pipiliin mo, hindi ka rin dehado.

And of course, no regrets din sa UP. haha Hirit talaga e. Hehe *peace*

Good suggestion nung iba dito na spend time in the campus din. Pero wag yung bagot na sit-in ka lang sa classes (unless full participation ka rin hehe), like talk to a lot of professors naman, or hang-out with the students, look at the list of orgs you could join or campus activities, chillax ka lang sa isang corner, watch a play, interview people, find out where you could grab a beer at 4pm, ikaw bahala ka what you want to do. Or kung anong mga bagay yung magsasabi sa iyo ng which school. Online you could start na sa websites ng both schools, or sa online communities/discussion boards din nila like pex: atenista.net and peyups.com.


Ateneo's glorious past, influential present need not be listed (so is UP's). As much as I love Ateneo, my sense of basic fairness is intact. Based on whatever great experiences I had with UP and it's minions, it is just simply unfair for me dismiss the latter just because Ateneo is a great school. Thus, my conviction lies in my homage to free will-- in this case, the thread starter's free will.

(Plain) Rhetoric.


You love to complicate (which has a function in human dynamics). But I love to simplify. The putdowns are fine. I just want the thread starter to get past them...and see the more salient and positive points of the two schools. I still suspect though that those who love to prop their respective schools by stepping on the other school underhandedly or overtly are true "winners" in life. And as far as conflict is concerned, whatever conflict is going on in this forum is not giving justice to the word conflict that I know. None of the posters here have experienced what conflict really is...which is constant blood and guts...and not empty words. There is no debate is Waziristan.

I really hope Rona is learning from these exchanges. Don't forget to respond when you made your selection. :)

Ang feeling mo naman. Demonstrate mo nga kung bakit may dichotomy between us na nagkokomplicate ako tapos nagsisimplify ka naman. Ano to black and white? Hehehe

"There is no debate is Waziristan." Ano raw? Bin laden conflict daw? :lol:

[_ozzakii]

TS, if you can do it, study abroad. I'm sure you are pretty smart. Apply for scholarships. Are you a guy or a girl? If you are a girl, you have more openings for scholarships especially since you are from a developing country.

here's a link to help you find scholarships abroad http://www.fastweb.com

You can research the ASEAN University Network Scholarship and try studying in NUS.

Aside from US universities, check out universities from Japan, Singapore, Europe, Australia etc as you'll have top notch facilities and full hands on experience whether you focus on Computer Engineering or Communications Technology.

In the long run you'll have received a more valuable learning experience (access to better facilities, multiculturalism, independence, exposure to various experts in the field and so forth...)

WRONG advice. It is too late to apply to a top foreign school for the fall semester (application deadline was Dec 31). It is also too late to take the SAT in time to apply to any prestigious college for the fall semester (the registration deadline for the Jan SAT has passed, and the next test date after that is in March). She could technically still take the ACT (an alternative test to the SAT) in February if she signed up for it TODAY (01/24 --for inernational applicants) but many prestigious colleges won't accept February test scores either. To complicate things further the ACT in February does not have the optional writing section which means that it won't be accepted by some good colleges.

If she wants to study in the UK, it's impossible for her to do that now as well since she did not study A-Levels. The A-Levels program can be taken for 2 years. The best alternative for her to do now if she really wants to study in a top British uni is to study in UP Diliman or UP Manila and transfer to any top UK uni after 2 years. With a UP credits, she can be admitted to any top UK uni like LSE, Imperial College, Warwick, UCL, Bath or St Andrews.

[KuyaDanny]

It might be too late to apply for Fall 2008, but if she's willing to wait until Fall 2009, she has plenty of time. She can take a gap year and engage in activities that help her mature personally.

[n3X]

Did a search sa peyups. Read the thread. Eto nakuha ko:

http://www.peyups.com/posts.khtml?mode=viewtopic&topic=33113&forum=4&start=0

"Sabi nya, mas maraming UP guys ang nag-aaral sa "TOP WORLD universities" na galing UP. Siguro, wala pa sa kalahati yung galing sa ibang schools. Kung mapapansin nyo, halos lahat ng nananalo sa Fulbright (US) at Chevening (UK) ay galing UP. Meron pa-ilanilan galing ng DLSU/AdMU pero they do not count as many as those from UP.

Here are the reasons why:

1. Only the UP undergad qualification is acceptable or recognised as a full bachelor’s degree at TOP WORLD universities. Meaning, the BS in Political Science, for example, in UPD is recognised as a degree qualification identical to that of the BS PolSci degree at top foreign schools like Harvard, Berkeley, Cambridge or Oxford. A bachelor's degree earned from, say, AdMU, is not recognised as a full bachelor's degree. A PolSci grad of Ateneo is required to finish a Master's degree in PolSci in the Philippine before he can be accepted as a grad student in a top foreign school."
>>> fernando

"This may not be true if you're applying in S&T courses. Kasi pah engg or science ang requirement nila for all Philippine graduates ay 5 years of baccalaureate studies and sometimes an additional year of graduate work."
>>> Brix

"randomly checkd some UK universities' rule about recognition and acceptance issues of Philippine undergrad qualification and the rule that only a UP undergrad diploma is recognised still stand. You just have to emphasize that your degree was acquired from UP Diliman/Manila."
>>> fernando

If you guys have questions, ask them na lang. Wala akong alam about this. Sorry.

[orange18]

waahh...nakakainggit **** ang taong toh.ang galing.kung *** iba (tulad ko) pinoproblema kung pano papasa sa entrance exam, sya ang problema eh *** school na papasukan kasi pareho syang nakapasa..waah.



mas pipiliin ko ang UP (yeah). *okay*

[physicist]

OFF-TOPIC. Sorry Rona.

Did a search sa peyups. Read the thread. Eto nakuha ko:

http://www.peyups.com/posts.khtml?mode=viewtopic&topic=33113&forum=4&start=0

"Sabi nya, mas maraming UP guys ang nag-aaral sa "TOP WORLD universities" na galing UP. Siguro, wala pa sa kalahati yung galing sa ibang schools. Kung mapapansin nyo, halos lahat ng nananalo sa Fulbright (US) at Chevening (UK) ay galing UP. Meron pa-ilanilan galing ng DLSU/AdMU pero they do not count as many as those from UP.

Here are the reasons why:

1. Only the UP undergad qualification is acceptable or recognised as a full bachelor’s degree at TOP WORLD universities. Meaning, the BS in Political Science, for example, in UPD is recognised as a degree qualification identical to that of the BS PolSci degree at top foreign schools like Harvard, Berkeley, Cambridge or Oxford. A bachelor's degree earned from, say, AdMU, is not recognised as a full bachelor's degree. A PolSci grad of Ateneo is required to finish a Master's degree in PolSci in the Philippine before he can be accepted as a grad student in a top foreign school."
>>> fernando

"This may not be true if you're applying in S&T courses. Kasi pah engg or science ang requirement nila for all Philippine graduates ay 5 years of baccalaureate studies and sometimes an additional year of graduate work."
>>> Brix

"randomly checkd some UK universities' rule about recognition and acceptance issues of Philippine undergrad qualification and the rule that only a UP undergrad diploma is recognised still stand. You just have to emphasize that your degree was acquired from UP Diliman/Manila."
>>> fernando

If you guys have questions, ask them na lang. Wala akong alam about this. Sorry.

Well thanks for digging this up.

I was just curious about this because I have a lot of friends from both Ateneo and UP scattered in grad programs all over the US. Not once has the Ateneo diploma been turned down simply because it wasn't UP. It struck me as odd that certain grad programs would recognize a UP diploma and not one from Ateneo. This is especially true in math and the sciences, where a standardized specialty GRE test (one for each field) is generally required anyway. Maybe it's different in the UK. But I have friends there I can ask as well, so don't bother digging up some more. I just assumed you knew these things personally, as you sounded categorically certain about it.

My housemate now is a senior PhD student in Political Science who finished college at UPD. He had a master's degree from Japan before coming here.

Here's what he says verbatim (and he's right behind me as I write this): "Hindi rin naman kilala ang UP sa PolSci. OA lang yan." Needless to say, I believe he thinks these claims are quite far-fetched. Though he does say that it's quite right that in polsci, philo, sociology, etc., PhD funding is extremely hard to find. One generally has to compete for fellowships, which are scarcer than the assistantships that are quite common in the hard sciences, so it helps significantly if one already has a Master's degree when applying. But this is true for all, regardless of the undergrad diploma.

Ok, enough of this. I just wanted to clarify something.

Back to regular programming. :)

[ubermensch]

^physicist, offtopic dude. tapos na ako sa quals, yey!

fraytorquemada mentioned resident physics and math wizards. si physicist nung physics wizard. gusto kong makilala nung math wizard, hahaha. :glee:

I read through the posts here quickly, and I felt I have to say something about one fellow Atenean's post, regarding the claim that Ateneans are richer, and so most can pay for their tuition fees. Whether this is true or not, it just left a bad taste using this as justification.

orange18, good luck with entrance exams. UPD is a very good choice.

I have my personal opinions (some strong) regarding some of the posts here, but they are irrelevant. I don't know if the TS is still visiting this thread. Probably not. Anyway, good luck na lang Rona Francia. Just keep in mind that whether or not you end up going to the school that is best for you, it is how you take advantage of the learning opportunities available in that school that will matter a lot. I might get accepted to Sooper Dooper World University, but if I just take exams to pass, don't participate much in discussions, don't try to dig deeper to cultivate my interests, I could just as well have gone to Number 10 Slightly Less Than Best University.

[bleep01]

the close relative i mentioned in an earlier post has finally decided to go to u.p. she will be graduating as valedictorian in a super expensive exclusive opus dei girl's school in alabang this april. hats off to her for mustering enough courage to leave her comfort zone and slug it out with the best of the best. she is in the top 2% of ateneo passers but she's also in the top 50 of upcat passers nationwide.

i hope rona has the guts to choose u.p. too

p.s. i graduated summa cum laude from u.p. diliman in 1982, hehe


Woodrose? Welcome to UP!:rotflmao:

[_ozzakii]

The salutatorian of Woodrose in 2000 was a classmate of mine in UPD. She's very cute, friendly and is now in UP med school. Magagaling talaga ang mga taga Woodrose.

[physicist]

Off-topic again. Pasensya na.

^physicist, offtopic dude. tapos na ako sa quals, yey!

Congrats sa quals! Makakahinga ka na din ng konti. *okay*

Lumabas na din yung publication na sinusulat ko over the Christmas break. Pero di pa din tapos. Two more papers, plus a dissertation, then I might just be off.

fraytorquemada mentioned resident physics and math wizards. si physicist yung physics wizard. gusto kong makilala nung math wizard, hahaha. :glee:

Sino kaya yun?! ;)

Pero daya ka naman. :) With your specialty, you're likely to end up being one of those filthy rich analysts who sell their skills (and souls) to Wall Street for 6-fig starting salaries. Samantalang ako'y magiging dukhang postdoc, still hopelessly romanticizing the charms of a universe that might not quite be so beautiful after all. Makes me wonder... maybe I should jump ship while I still can. ;)

[cretinous00]

prove cosmologically that God doesn't exist.

[physicist]

Even more off-topic.

prove cosmologically that God doesn't exist.

Around here, that's usually taken as a first principle.

[cretinous00]

first principle. had to look that one up. so now? :D

[paenggoy]

First, select your course(s). After that, look at any prospectus and websites for each school. Visit each campus (or attend any orientation, etc.) and ask questions to various faculty and staff members about tuition, housing, employment opportunities, facilities, etc. Create a chart containing all of these factors with a weight for each. For each school, give a score for each factor based on your observations. Get the weighted scores and add them up; you can probably select the school based on the total scores.

[cosmoPinoy]

Okay. I guess Rona had more than enough suggestions for her to decide which school she really wants to get into.

I hope you guys read my about my dilemma, too.

Same as Rona, I passed both UPCAT and ACET. But unlike her, I didn't get any scholarship from either one of the schools. So speaking financially, UP has an advantage over Ateneo.

For ADMU, I got in ME (That's Management Eng'g, for those who're unfamiliar with the abbrev.). Actually, it wasn't really a serious choice - that's ME I'm talking about. I was expecting to land in Economics, whether honors or not, or in some other management course. But after reading the brochure the SOM folks we're giving away, I told myself I might give ME a try. And so I put it in my application as my first choice course. And I passed. I'm not really keen on it at first, but after going to the open house, now I find the course really attractive.

In UP, I got in Economics. I didn't really occur to me that I would pass ANY course in UP. But then I did. And I like Economics too. It's my first choice. Or at least I think I like it.

So here's a list of factors I'm looking at that I think will help me (or you) choose a college for myself.

For Ateneo:
1) I'm an Atenean since Prep. You know, it's really hard to get detached from the whole idea that you won't be coming to Ateneo anymore.
2) I guess I'm not ready to face the more 'liberal' world.
3) My friends are going there. (Baah! Stupid one.)
4) UAAP - I'm sure you wouldn't want to miss the thrill. (UP is kulelat kasi eh.)
5) Errr, Catholic Jesuit education? I guess that counts.
6) ME is like one of the most prestigious course Ateneo can offer
7) Ateneo helps you DAW with getting yourself employed. (If true, really a defining factor for me.)

For UP
1) Cheap
2) Family pressure (But I know they'd still let me choose)
3) Although I said I'm not ready to face UP's 'liberal' environment, I'd contradict this by saying I WANT to feel that so-called liberal education in UP.
4) UP's more famous abroad, considering the fact that it bears the country's name
5) No UAAP experience. Damn. It's like one of my most awaited seasons of the year.
6) Less work DAW. Ateneo loads their students with more work.
7) It's just that it's a new place for me so I don't really know what to expect so I tend to believe in common stereotypes about UP. Please, enlighten me.

So there, I hope you get a picture of who I am and what I really care about. Maybe with that, you can help me choose.

[boy_wonder]

UP na.

Mas masarap maging Iskolar ng Bayan.:)

[LT]

Hi Cosmo,

Choose UP. For the simple reason that Economics is really your first choice, or 'first love' haha. ME, though may be attractive for you at this point, should just be treated as a distraction or at best, second option. Especially if it's not really something that you've always liked. Because, trust me: you will always go back to your 'first love' hahaha

In terms of academic experience and eventual career/employment: the departments with which the courses can be found are both designated COEs by the CHED (UP SE and Ateneo JGSOM). So I guess they're pretty much even there. But to a certain extent, I think we can give this to UP as well. Because our country's top economists normally come from State U. Including Ateneo's Dr. Cieleto Habito. In the same breath, I don't think Ateneo is the lone producer of our country's top business leaders/managers. You have La Salle, again UP, and a host of others crowding Ateneo there at the top.

But for me, a very good reason for choosing UP is that you will be coming from not just one, buttwo, of the country's top universities. In terms of over-all academic experience, prestige and future network/connections, I think that would be hard to beat. Imagine, hindi ka lang Atenista, taga-UP ka pa. O di ba? hehe. It will open more doors, I'm telling you.

In terms of the UAAP, don't worry. UP is a perennial contender for the over-all championship plum. So, mas exciting ang sports program nila. Sa MBT lang naman mejo sabit eh. But if you believe some of the insiders here, then I guess UP will eventually make it back to the Top 4 maybe in the next two to three years. Nasa college ka pa naman nun di ba?:)

On UP being 'cheap,' and Ateneo, 'expensive,' some people here have already debunked this 'theory.' My take here is very simple. I don't think money should be an issue as far as a person's future is concerned. Education is a must. So if you have to spend for it, then go ahead and spend. And besides, if your parents were able to send you to Ateneo since Prep, then they can very well still afford to send you to Ateneo college if you guys think that's what's best for you. What's another four years, right?

So good luck with your decision. And congrats. Because yours is actually a very 'happy' problem: not too many people are accorded the same choices as you now have*okay*

[LT]

oh btw, another bonus for choosing UP: you'll be part of their Centennial batch. At kung ayaw mo na, go back to Ateneo the following year and be part naman of their Sesquicentennial (150 years) batch. o di ba? hahaha:D

[shock0]

@CosmoPinoy

I was exactly in the same situation eons ago. Most of the factors you mentioned were also applicable to me at that time except for the family pressure. I had been studying in Ateneo since prep and had to make a decision where to go for college. My choices then were either Ateneo's ME or UP's IE.

It did not take me a long time to decide to stay in Ateneo. The many opportunities I had immediately after graduating from Loyola only showed I made the right choice.

[iRebirth]

Okay. I guess Rona had more than enough suggestions for her to decide which school she really wants to get into.

I hope you guys read my about my dilemma, too.

Same as Rona, I passed both UPCAT and ACET. But unlike her, I didn't get any scholarship from either one of the schools. So speaking financially, UP has an advantage over Ateneo.

For ADMU, I got in ME (That's Management Eng'g, for those who're unfamiliar with the abbrev.). Actually, it wasn't really a serious choice - that's ME I'm talking about. I was expecting to land in Economics, whether honors or not, or in some other management course. But after reading the brochure the SOM folks we're giving away, I told myself I might give ME a try. And so I put it in my application as my first choice course. And I passed. I'm not really keen on it at first, but after going to the open house, now I find the course really attractive.

In UP, I got in Economics. I didn't really occur to me that I would pass ANY course in UP. But then I did. And I like Economics too. It's my first choice. Or at least I think I like it.

So here's a list of factors I'm looking at that I think will help me (or you) choose a college for myself.

For Ateneo:
1) I'm an Atenean since Prep. You know, it's really hard to get detached from the whole idea that you won't be coming to Ateneo anymore.
2) I guess I'm not ready to face the more 'liberal' world.
3) My friends are going there. (Baah! Stupid one.)
4) UAAP - I'm sure you wouldn't want to miss the thrill. (UP is kulelat kasi eh.)
5) Errr, Catholic Jesuit education? I guess that counts.
6) ME is like one of the most prestigious course Ateneo can offer
7) Ateneo helps you DAW with getting yourself employed. (If true, really a defining factor for me.)

For UP
1) Cheap
2) Family pressure (But I know they'd still let me choose)
3) Although I said I'm not ready to face UP's 'liberal' environment, I'd contradict this by saying I WANT to feel that so-called liberal education in UP.
4) UP's more famous abroad, considering the fact that it bears the country's name
5) No UAAP experience. Damn. It's like one of my most awaited seasons of the year.
6) Less work DAW. Ateneo loads their students with more work.
7) It's just that it's a new place for me so I don't really know what to expect so I tend to believe in common stereotypes about UP. Please, enlighten me.

So there, I hope you get a picture of who I am and what I really care about. Maybe with that, you can help me choose.

If you think your 12 or so years in Ateneo has molded you into a fine individual both spritually and academically, go to UP.

[skylights]

Others' experiences from their stay at their school may differ from yours. Opportunities may come and may not. By luck yan minsan. They're both good schools anyway. You could choose the one which you think you would fit in.

[hacksaw]

In my case it was the Jesuits who gave up on me after 12 years of trying to make me into a man for others. And so I sought asylum in Diliman.:D

My advice:If you cant leave your comfort zone ...DONT

[gerald_tot]

go to admu =) i think they can offer more
just like what you said
theyll help you DAW in employment which is good

[_ozzakii]

@CosmoPinoy


It did not take me a long time to decide to stay in Ateneo. The many opportunities I had immediately after graduating from Loyola only showed I made the right choice.

That would have been a valid argument if that was an AdMU vs UST/FEU/UE case. But in a situation such as CosmoPinoy’s (or this one), issues pertaining to opportunities are entirely irrelevant. UPSE grads are as marketable, if not even more so, as those ME grads. Some of the best economists, bankers, bank managers, CEOs, COOs and even politicians are UPSE products. Three (3) of the 11 Baker Scholars of Harvard Business School are UPSE graduates. On the contrary, I have not heard or known any ME grad who got into Harvard Business School and eventually graduated as Baker Scholar. Also, four (4) of the current Filipinos enrolled at the London School of Economics & Political Science (LSE) are all UPSE grads. And I’m convinced that that wasn’t just a coincidence as the LSE records would show that there are way more UP grads that have gone to LSE than there were Ateneo grads.

Bottom line, UPSE grads are as marketable if not even more so that Ateneo ME grads and there is very little argument to support otherwise. Although I would presume that many of those ME grads that did very well back in college must be doing very well after college as well.

[hunter_alchemst]

I thought the academe is moderated?

[KuyaDanny]

You think correctly.

[_SCUD_]

That would have been a valid argument if that was an AdMU vs UST/FEU/UE case.

Ah, excuse me Mr. UP-educated ozzakii. May kinalaman ba ito sa topic ?

Saan kaya ang punta ng argumento mo? Strike, spare o kanal?

[Viva La Tigresa]

UP o Ateneo?

Aba, kailangan pa ba itanong yun?

Ateneo na siyempre. :)

[n3X]

So here's a list of factors I'm looking at that I think will help me (or you) choose a college for myself.

For Ateneo:
1) I'm an Atenean since Prep. You know, it's really hard to get detached from the whole idea that you won't be coming to Ateneo anymore.
2) I guess I'm not ready to face the more 'liberal' world.
3) My friends are going there. (Baah! Stupid one.)
4) UAAP - I'm sure you wouldn't want to miss the thrill. (UP is kulelat kasi eh.)
5) Errr, Catholic Jesuit education? I guess that counts.
6) ME is like one of the most prestigious course Ateneo can offer
7) Ateneo helps you DAW with getting yourself employed. (If true, really a defining factor for me.)

For UP
1) Cheap
2) Family pressure (But I know they'd still let me choose)
3) Although I said I'm not ready to face UP's 'liberal' environment, I'd contradict this by saying I WANT to feel that so-called liberal education in UP.
4) UP's more famous abroad, considering the fact that it bears the country's name
5) No UAAP experience. Damn. It's like one of my most awaited seasons of the year.
6) Less work DAW. Ateneo loads their students with more work.
7) It's just that it's a new place for me so I don't really know what to expect so I tend to believe in common stereotypes about UP. Please, enlighten me.


Ako talaga go for the liberal education in UP. Iba talaga e. You would realize a lot of things. Mag iiba yung pagtingin mo sa mundo. Like, guguho yung employment priority mo (although goal pa rin siya talaga), na life is not about working or earning lang, na there are far more important things in life. UP has programs with helping you get employment or jumpstarting your career, but I think the more important thing is the quality of education. Kahit ma-land mo first job mo, paano ka mag-aadvance or magiging leader sa field mo.

Then extensive ang UAAP experience ng UP. Siyempre ang sikat lang naman sa atin yung men's basketball pero nangunguna ang UP sa maraming ibang sports. Im sure mamimiss mo yung tension between ateneo and la salle. Pero believe me, marereplace naman yan ng UP vs. Others (although harsh talaga.) hehehe

And saan mo narinig yung less work sa UP? Dahil full load na yung 18 units sa UP and more sa ibang schools, e comparable na yun? E halos laging merong idrodrop mga estudyante kasi haggard na talaga din yung 18 units. E mga top students na to ha. Okay din yung ME ng Ateneo, prestigious talaga. Magaling din yung mga graduates. Pero malayong mas prestigious ang Econ. Kahit sa management, yung major national compets talo ng UP ang Ateneo.

And finally, yung common stereotypes about UP. Di na natin maaalis yun. Karamihan naman ng major schools merong stereotypes. In any case, UP is really about diversity. Merong mga hard core tibak, meron din mga reactionary, conservative liberals. Merong mga super dasal dasal na lordy-lordy, meron ding mga atheists. Merong mga anak ng farmers na kahit binenta na yung kalabaw nila kulang pa rin sa tuition, and meron ding mga naka-Range Rover sa campus na mga anak ng tycoons. To be honest, you'll meet all kinds of people, merong mga baliw, merong bland, mga kalog, at mga bagot, et cetera. But theyre all characters and bright ones at that. And make new friends, asa college ka na no. Di ganun kalaki ang growth mo as a person kung pareho lang friends mo forever.

And to attack naman yung reasons for Ateneo (hahaha sorry talaga), kailangan pa bang tanungin kung ano mas pipiliin: catholic jesuit education or the best educational experience in the country that emancipates and empowers you as an individual?

So there, if you cant leave your comfort zone, e di goodluck na lang talaga. Ang laki ng mundo, di ka ba na-eexcite harapin lahat ng puedeng i-offer nito? Goodluck with choosing which school.

[rainmaker5821]

to CosmoP

if you really want economics, go to econ. there's pretty much no other place better to train to be an economist in the Phils (i think 99.9% of the profs there have doctorates and it's the center of excellence as awarded by some academic body). tho some insights on their curriculum, i think 50% of the classes you would take are "electives" which means you could go to extremes as art appreciation, language-expert, science/engineering to business, statistics and the like. now, if you want to take charge of you're "development" and is the type who would like to explore and learn a LOT of stuff, that would be the best place to be. if you want to just follow a proven formula and don't really have the time to plan out what to do with your career, then don't go eco.

as for ME, theirs is a really good good course. if it is just course-wise, id say go for Ateneo. i would say that in terms of management / business opportunities after grad they're number one and second only to UP's BAA in terms of academic training.

btw, Econ is NOT a "liberated" college. parang CBA lang din yan, mostly they have their own worlds more like the private schools than UP itself. although you'll get to feel the "liberated-ness" in the early years which for me is really an eye-opener and a great thing to experience even just for a short time in life.

[tantararantaran]

That would have been a valid argument if that was an AdMU vs UST/FEU/UE case. But in a situation such as CosmoPinoy’s (or this one), issues pertaining to opportunities are entirely irrelevant. UPSE grads are as marketable, if not even more so, as those ME grads. Some of the best economists, bankers, bank managers, CEOs, COOs and even politicians are UPSE products. Three (3) of the 11 Baker Scholars of Harvard Business School are UPSE graduates. On the contrary, I have not heard or known any ME grad who got into Harvard Business School and eventually graduated as Baker Scholar. Also, four (4) of the current Filipinos enrolled at the London School of Economics & Political Science (LSE) are all UPSE grads. And I’m convinced that that wasn’t just a coincidence as the LSE records would show that there are way more UP grads that have gone to LSE than there were Ateneo grads.

Bottom line, UPSE grads are as marketable if not even more so that Ateneo ME grads and there is very little argument to support otherwise. Although I would presume that many of those ME grads that did very well back in college must be doing very well after college as well.

I think the comparison made by the poster is between Ateneo ME and UP IE, not UP SE. I'm a UP student and I don't undermine our IE, but things should just be set straight and arguments and counterarguments should be well-grounded. ;)

[_ozzakii]

Okay. I guess Rona had more than enough suggestions for her to decide which school she really wants to get into.

I hope you guys read my about my dilemma, too.

Same as Rona, I passed both UPCAT and ACET. But unlike her, I didn't get any scholarship from either one of the schools. So speaking financially, UP has an advantage over Ateneo.

For ADMU, I got in ME (That's Management Eng'g, for those who're unfamiliar with the abbrev.). Actually, it wasn't really a serious choice - that's ME I'm talking about. I was expecting to land in Economics, whether honors or not, or in some other management course. But after reading the brochure the SOM folks we're giving away, I told myself I might give ME a try. And so I put it in my application as my first choice course. And I passed. I'm not really keen on it at first, but after going to the open house, now I find the course really attractive.

In UP, I got in Economics. I didn't really occur to me that I would pass ANY course in UP. But then I did. And I like Economics too. It's my first choice. Or at least I think I like it.

So here's a list of factors I'm looking at that I think will help me (or you) choose a college for myself.




7) Ateneo helps you DAW with getting yourself employed. (If true, really a defining factor for me.)

For UP
1) Cheap
2) Family pressure (But I know they'd still let me choose)
3) Although I said I'm not ready to face UP's 'liberal' environment, I'd contradict this by saying I WANT to feel that so-called liberal education in UP.
4) UP's more famous abroad, considering the fact that it bears the country's name
5) No UAAP experience. Damn. It's like one of my most awaited seasons of the year.
6) Less work DAW. Ateneo loads their students with more work.
7) It's just that it's a new place for me so I don't really know what to expect so I tend to believe in common stereotypes about UP. Please, enlighten me.

So there, I hope you get a picture of who I am and what I really care about. Maybe with that, you can help me choose.




Actually, deciding where to go for college between UP and AdMU is like deciding between Harvard and Yale, or something like that. Both are great schools with enormous academic resources and superb student body. The only difference is that, one has more brand recognition and perhaps better research opportunities (Harvard) than the other (Yale), but both offer almost identical undergrad quality education and opportunities after graduation. Therefore, in my opinion, your case is an incredibly classic case. Classic in the sense that, while other students are worrying about getting into either of these two renowned schools, you, however, is worrying which between these two schools would you rather turn down. Another interpretation is that, you're like choosing which car to buy between a Ferrari and a Lamborghini. Both are amazingly expensive cars made to a selected customer. Hence, neither car is really better than the other. They just differ in features and designs, but both are top of the line cars made for customers with extraordinary stature in the society – the super elite. So, if someone here would tell you to buy a Ferrari because it runs fast and the other doesn't, that's crap. Both cars are fast cars. Period.




4) UAAP - I'm sure you wouldn't want to miss the thrill. (UP is kulelat kasi eh.)

Well, I honestly don't see how this would become a problem for you if you're not intending to become an Ateneo cheerleader or pep squad member. If you're talking about just being an intense spectator or bench supporter, well, anyone at UP is free to support whichever sport team he wants to support. For example, I have always been a Green Archer supporter when I was at UP and no one has discouraged me or prohibited me from supporting a team other than my own. Same goes for my former Atenean classmates who have always shown more intensity in supporting the Blue Eagles than the Fighting Maroons. And that's the beauty of being in a "liberal" atmosphere. You're free to grow through your own freewill. No one will tell you what or what not to do as long as you don't cause any trouble to anybody. Being in a liberal atmosphere is not exactly a bad thing. On the contrary, it would help you mature faster because you’re often left to decide on your own. That may not be an attractive atmosphere for those who are weedy and weak, but for those who do not fear challenges; it would be an excellent training ground for you to mature because it is real world experience out there.







5) Errr, Catholic Jesuit education? I guess that counts.

A substantial number of UP students are catholic and many of them attend mass in Ateneo. If you're so concern about your religion, particularly Jesuit Catholicism (or whatever is that called), you can attend church in Ateneo on Sundays (or even everyday if your schedule permits) as the Ateneo campus is not that far away from the UP campus. But I personally don't think a Jesuit education offers a different point or higher level of education in terms of moral perspective as the school continues to produce wicked graduates. In fact, some of the most apathetic and corrupt officials of the land today are products of a Jesuit education.




6) ME is like one of the most prestigious course Ateneo can offer

I agree that ME is one of the most prestigious if not the most prestigious program in Ateneo. But the question is: do like it? If you do like it, you might excel on this program and you might be one of those very successful ME graduates who are now very successful in their career. But what happens if you don’t?

UP Economics is a tough program, but the UPSE environment is very student friendly and its very low drop out rate would justify this claim. On the other hand, the ME at Ateneo has a very high drop out rate. Meaning, many of those who started as an ME major weren’t able to graduate from the program and have to settle with a program that they may not even like. For example, my friend started as an ME major when he entered in Ateneo. When I met him in one of our reunions, I was surprised when he told me that he finished BS Economics instead and he finished it in 6 years. He said he was removed from the ME program due to poor grades. Now why am I surprised? Well, this guy I was talking about is a very smart guy. He was our top 7 in LSGH. He passed in all the schools he applied to including BS Business Economics at UPd and BS Accountancy at DLSU. His combined SAT scores were 1,470 (over 1,600 at that time), enough to get him into a top tier school in the US, but he chose to go to Ateneo because he was awarded with a Merit Scholar. So, clearly the guy wasn’t a slacker yet he has not survived ME as he expected. So what’s wrong? Or, the more relevant question is: whose fault was it? Was it his or his department? Now, if this guy had gone to UPSe instead, he would have graduated on time, and very likely, with good grades. Why? Because UPSE has a very student friendly environment. The instructors and professors, though tough as examiners, are gracious as mentors. These instructors usually extend support to undergrad students, despite their very busy schedules outside of the academe. They see to it that they pay attention to their students’ needs. They provide mentorship even it’s already outside of class hours. This is a very common feedback amongst the UPSE students and alumni. They feel they are one big family and they get individual attention by their favorite professor. I’m not sure of the ME of Ateneo offers the same kind of arrangement. But looking at its high drop out rate, it appears that student support is still something to be desired.

[_ozzakii]

I think the comparison made by the poster is between Ateneo ME and UP IE, not UP SE. I'm a UP student and I don't undermine our IE, but things should just be set straight and arguments and counterarguments should be well-grounded.


I admit I misread his post. Sorry about that. But even then, I'm not convinced that UP's B.S. IE is seen inferior to Ateneo's ME in the employment market. Although I would admit that many ME grads do prefer to work in financial services as opposed to IE grads that are usually seen in the manufacturing services. But the bottom line here is, no one can actually make a convincing claim that his course is better than the other, or his course is a more preferred course than the other in the employment world (not even the BAA of UPd), unless the job requires specific coursework such as QA/QC for IE grads, software development for ComSci grads, actuarial for actuaries, accounting jobs for accountants and so on.

[_ozzakii]

go to admu =) i think they can offer more
just like what you said
theyll help you DAW in employment which is good



The institution can't do so much, your personal aggressiveness and determination to succeed can.

Both schools (along with DLSU) can actually help their grads with the application process for big corps, blue chips, top bulge bracket firms..., but only up to there. Beyond that, the grads are left on their own.

Also, there are many orgs at UPd with objectives that would make the members highly employable. Examples are JPIA, JMA and UPEntre group (not sure of its correct name). These are just a few of the many student run orgs at UPd that enhance the members' personal development and promote a solid environment for the members’ excellent preparation for their future career goals.

I’m sure, however, that Ateneo has lots of orgs with similar objectives but the ones at UP are undoubtedly more active and better structured.




http://www.upcapbase.org/sip.php
http://www.upcapbase.org/home.php

http://www.econ.upd.edu.ph/~ecosoc/achievements.htm

http://upjma.org/committee/publicity

http://upjpia.multiply.com/photos

http://beachbaby.multiply.com/photos/album/115/JMA_Isaw_Day

[_ozzakii]

Ah, excuse me Mr. UP-educated ozzakii. May kinalaman ba ito sa topic ?

Saan kaya ang punta ng argumento mo? Strike, spare o kanal?

I'm not sure what you mean, but I was trying to support my argument that Ateneo grads could not make a rightful claim as are more employable /marketable than as are UP grads. The Ateneans, however, can make a claim that they are generally regarded as more marketable than as UST, FEU, UE grads are. Fair or not fair, that's how things are in the Philippine employment game. The Big-3 schools are more regarded than the rest of all the schools in the country. And because of that, their graduates are obviously more sought after and are better paid than those grads from other schools, including your beloved UST. You may not like what I said, but that's the plain and simple reality is in the Philippines.

[_ozzakii]

UP o Ateneo?

Aba, kailangan pa ba itanong yun?

Ateneo na siyempre.

Can you make a solid argument why would CosmoPinoy must choose Ateneo over UP? He needs some valid points to make a decision and prestige factor alone won't be enough reason to convince him to go to Ateneo becuase clearly, UP is more famous than is Ateneo, and even the kid himself agrees to that. Read again what he wrote in post #139, he stated some factors there.

[lebron_paul]

Fit is the most important criterion when choosing a university. It is pointless to attend a university if you are going to hate it there. That said, assuming you fit in at either school, I would recommend UP Diliman. I like Ateneo and, as everybody knows, respect it a great deal. However, UP is the premier Economics school in the country. If one has the opportunity to study at UPSE, I say grab it and run!

[cosmoPinoy]

Thanks for those informative (and rather, convincing) answers. I'll take everything you said into account when I decide later on.

I really like the idea of being from two of the best schools. That makes me an Atenean and iskolar ng bayan, as well. Haha.

Thanks again. I hope you'll keep those answers coming. They're really helping me a lot.

But I personally don't think a Jesuit education offers a different point or higher level of education in terms of moral perspective as the school continues to produce wicked graduates. In fact, some of the most apathetic and corrupt officials of the land today are products of a Jesuit education.


^^Please don't generalize. If there's something wrong with Ateneo's educational system, it's definitely not the Jesuit perspective. Nevertheless, I admit there is a flaw. What I see wrong is that the culture of the elite still perseveres, and even enriches, especially or rather exclusively, with those who belong to the 'privileged' members of the Ateneo's student body. Sans Erap, most allegedly corrupt Ateneo graduates consistently belong to a specific sector of the student body. Ask any ordinary Atenean from the high school, I'm sure they know who these people are.

On the other hand, thanks for your point by point answers. They're really some of the most illuminating. :)

-------------------------------------

Just to point out, I don't find it uneasy to mix with other social classes. I may be the typical bourgeois, but some of my closest relatives are down under the line, and some of my friends are those who are literally drowning in cash. So I guess that won't be a factor.

[ubermensch]

For Ateneo:
1) I'm an Atenean since Prep. You know, it's really hard to get detached from the whole idea that you won't be coming to Ateneo anymore.
2) I guess I'm not ready to face the more 'liberal' world.

Sorry, this excuse doesn't fly, I think. You're not really doing your Jesuit upbringing any justice if you make it appear that you're afraid to jump out of your comfort zone.


3) My friends are going there. (Baah! Stupid one.)
4) UAAP - I'm sure you wouldn't want to miss the thrill. (UP is kulelat kasi eh.)
5) Errr, Catholic Jesuit education? I guess that counts.
6) ME is like one of the most prestigious course Ateneo can offer
7) Ateneo helps you DAW with getting yourself employed. (If true, really a defining factor for me.)

I agree there's nothing wrong with trying to look forward to prepare yourself. But in the end, placement offices can only do so much. Your prospects would depend more on your capabilities.


For UP
1) Cheap
2) Family pressure (But I know they'd still let me choose)
3) Although I said I'm not ready to face UP's 'liberal' environment, I'd contradict this by saying I WANT to feel that so-called liberal education in UP.
4) UP's more famous abroad, considering the fact that it bears the country's name
5) No UAAP experience. Damn. It's like one of my most awaited seasons of the year.
6) Less work DAW. Ateneo loads their students with more work.

This is one of those instances where I would stick to stereotypes. I always thought it was the opposite.


7) It's just that it's a new place for me so I don't really know what to expect so I tend to believe in common stereotypes about UP. Please, enlighten me.


Maybe it's just me. The diverse environment in UP is actually what attracted me to it in the first place. I always wondered why people wanted to stay away from UP because of its "liberal" atmosphere, when I actually thought that was a good thing.

I eventually ended up in Ateneo, but this was because of different reasons, which had more to do with the course I really wanted.

[_ozzakii]

^^Please don't generalize. If there's something wrong with Ateneo's educational system, it's definitely not the Jesuit perspective. Nevertheless, I admit there is a flaw. What I see wrong is that the culture of the elite still perseveres, and even enriches, especially or rather exclusively, with those who belong to the 'privileged' members of the Ateneo's student body. Sans Erap, most allegedly corrupt Ateneo graduates consistently belong to a specific sector of the student body. Ask any ordinary Atenean from the high school, I'm sure they know who these people are.

Oh, I'm sorry if I sounded a bit insulting. Believe me, I did not mean to appear that way.

When I said, I personally don't think a Jesuit education offers a different point or higher level of education in terms of moral perspective, I wasn't actually "generalizing". I was merely trying to say that no amount of religious school training can make one's education substantially better than an education that has no speck of religion in it. I believe that when people tell me that the true advantage of an Ateneo education to a UP education is its holistic approach, I don’t find it convincingly true. In my opinion, UP’s education is as holistic as Ateneo’s if not even more so, as the liberal atmosphere at UP rally round the students’ high maturity level.

I also said that Ateneo's curricula as the bible of holistic formation are inconclusive. If it was, then the school would not have produced wicked graduates. And it's perfectly alright to say Ateneo's curricula are not perfect. Heck, not even Harvard's curricula are perfect. Not even Georgetown's, which is the highest ranked Jesuit school in the US, or probably in the world. In short, religion does have very little bearing in academic quality as well as in personal and spiritual development when taught at the college level.

Well, this is just me sharing what my opinion is regarding about this matter and I could be wrong. :)

[cretinous00]

if you're conscious about status and job prospects, go to you-know-where. if you really want to learn, go to it's-always-been-there.

[rn8]

I have a similar problem as Rona. I passed the UPCAT(BS IE) and the ACET(BS ME). I received 50% scholarship at Admu. I researched about the curriculum of bs me and i think i would have a less strenuous college life if i take that over bs ie, simply because i incline more towards a MANAGEMENT course. but believe it or not, i'm leaning towards up now. i love the people there and i really want the up experience. i want to interact with a more diverse population. i found the flowchart for BS IE in UpD. And the truth is, I don't think I am really made for thos courses. I need more info about both courses talaga. And deadline of confirmation is nearing. Where should I enroll?

[bkaibigan08]

Definitely, I prefer UP. It has way more centers of excellence (recognized by CHED) compared to other schools. Any rankings (PRC, CHED, AsiaWeek, etc) will show that UP will always be on top.

[Feodore_Knox]

I have a similar problem as Rona. I passed the UPCAT(BS IE) and the ACET(BS ME). I received 50% scholarship at Admu. I researched about the curriculum of bs me and i think i would have a less strenuous college life if i take that over bs ie, simply because i incline more towards a MANAGEMENT course. but believe it or not, i'm leaning towards up now. i love the people there and i really want the up experience. i want to interact with a more diverse population. i found the flowchart for BS IE in UpD. And the truth is, I don't think I am really made for thos courses. I need more info about both courses talaga. And deadline of confirmation is nearing. Where should I enroll?
I think you've pretty much solved your own dilemma.
It's really a matter of FIT.
You know you're more for management than for engineering.
So, BS ME should be it.
But then again, if you go to UP, you can always shift to Econ or BA.

[_ozzakii]

^ Alternatively, she can take BSIE at UPd and consume all her electives with business subjects. There are a lot of entrepreneurial subjects as electives too. I know someone who did that and he now works at P&G.

Sometime in 2004 or 2005, UP-CBA increased their course offerings to accommodate engineering students. Many of those who responded were from EEE, IE, CS and ME. You can ask your department head about that.

[Rona Francia]

Hello Pexers. I just want to thank you for your suggestions, opinions, etc. I've finally decided to go to Ateneo. I hope that cosmoPinoy will also be able to choose what his heart truly desires.. hehe..

[iRebirth]

@ Rona Francia

Just some final words.
SHIFT OUT IMMEDIATELY.
Get to a better course if you can. There have already been talks about phasing out ComTech as a program and you wouldn't want to find yourself holding a degree in a field that has already been phased out some 4 or so years from today. And even this were not so, CommTech is really a half-baked program and you would be better off spending an extra year in ADMU completing a degree in BS Communications and BS Management instead of your current course.

[jtff7]

I have a similar problem as Rona. I passed the UPCAT(BS IE) and the ACET(BS ME). I received 50% scholarship at Admu. I researched about the curriculum of bs me and i think i would have a less strenuous college life if i take that over bs ie, simply because i incline more towards a MANAGEMENT course. but believe it or not, i'm leaning towards up now. i love the people there and i really want the up experience. i want to interact with a more diverse population. i found the flowchart for BS IE in UpD. And the truth is, I don't think I am really made for thos courses. I need more info about both courses talaga. And deadline of confirmation is nearing. Where should I enroll?

Hi there,

Let me give you a breakdown of the differences of Ateneo ME and UP IE. Btw, I am a graduating IE student from UP.

Basically, the main difference between ME and IE is that ME is more focused on hardcore number-crunching. They have more accounting and finance subjects, which is why most ME students I know end up in banking / finance related jobs. Also, AFAIK, ME is not that much into the core IE subjects, except Operations Research, since they don't participate in the PIIE (Philippine Institute of Industrial Engineers) annual congress. I know for a fact that they only cover Ergonomics, Methods Engineering, etc very lightly, and they lack sufficient engineering electives (such as Statics & Dynamics of Rigid bodies [ES 11 & 12], Fluid mechanics [ES 15], metallurgical engineering [MetE 143], unit operations [ChE 2], etc all of which are required in the UP IE curriculum).

IE on the other hand, only has 2 accounting subjects (Accounting 1 and BA 115 - Managerial Accounting). The thing I like about IE however, is the amount of projects which you will be doing during your undergraduate years (at least 5 comprehensive company studies / projects). These projects help prepare you for the challenges waiting in the corporate world. So if you are looking to pursue a job in the corporate world, I suggest you go to UP IE. It is basically BA, with technical skills combined.

I'd also like to correct what Mr. _ozzakii said. You can not take business subjects as electives (although you can take them without credit). Electives for IE are already defined in the curriculum (MetE 143, ChE 2, ME 63, Acctg 1, BA 115, Econ 100.1 did I forget anything else?). The only elective where you will be free to choose is IE 197/198 - Special Topics in IE (he is right in pointing out that there are a number of entrepreneurial subjects which can be taken in place of IE 197/198, such as Techno-preneurship). Other examples of Special Topics include iSCM, SAP MM and S&D module and Six-Sigma training.

[jtff7]

Also, I'd like to add that UP IE has one of the best (if not THE best) faculty when it comes to IE education in the Philippines. Most of the professors have advanced degrees (MS & PhD) in foreign schools (US, Japan, etc).

[Rona Francia]

@ Rona Francia

Just some final words.
SHIFT OUT IMMEDIATELY.
Get to a better course if you can. There have already been talks about phasing out ComTech as a program and you wouldn't want to find yourself holding a degree in a field that has already been phased out some 4 or so years from today. And even this were not so, CommTech is really a half-baked program and you would be better off spending an extra year in ADMU completing a degree in BS Communications and BS Management instead of your current course.

I'm planning nga po, eh. But, are they still accepting letter of request for the change of course? I thought Comtech's ok since marami yung kumukuha. I'm planning din po kasi to pursue law after. Thanks for your suggestion anyway.

[hacksaw]

Also, I'd like to add that UP IE has one of the best (if not THE best) faculty when it comes to IE education in the Philippines. Most of the professors have advanced degrees (MS & PhD) in foreign schools (US, Japan, etc).

And if im not mistaken the only Center of Excellence in IE as per the CHED. :)

[iRebirth]

I'm planning nga po, eh. But, are they still accepting letter of request for the change of course? I thought Comtech's ok since marami yung kumukuha. I'm planning din po kasi to pursue law after. Thanks for your suggestion anyway.

I think the last day for slot confirmation is also the same deadline for the request for course change. better hurry though. i believe admu follows a first-come-first-served system, and slots for courses like BS Communication and BS Management attract a lot of students apart from those that have already been accepted. good luck!

[rn8]

Hi there,

Let me give you a breakdown of the differences of Ateneo ME and UP IE. Btw, I am a graduating IE student from UP.

Basically, the main difference between ME and IE is that ME is more focused on hardcore number-crunching. They have more accounting and finance subjects, which is why most ME students I know end up in banking / finance related jobs. Also, AFAIK, ME is not that much into the core IE subjects, except Operations Research, since they don't participate in the PIIE (Philippine Institute of Industrial Engineers) annual congress. I know for a fact that they only cover Ergonomics, Methods Engineering, etc very lightly, and they lack sufficient engineering electives (such as Statics & Dynamics of Rigid bodies [ES 11 & 12], Fluid mechanics [ES 15], metallurgical engineering [MetE 143], unit operations [ChE 2], etc all of which are required in the UP IE curriculum).

IE on the other hand, only has 2 accounting subjects (Accounting 1 and BA 115 - Managerial Accounting). The thing I like about IE however, is the amount of projects which you will be doing during your undergraduate years (at least 5 comprehensive company studies / projects). These projects help prepare you for the challenges waiting in the corporate world. So if you are looking to pursue a job in the corporate world, I suggest you go to UP IE. It is basically BA, with technical skills combined.

I'd also like to correct what Mr. _ozzakii said. You can not take business subjects as electives (although you can take them without credit). Electives for IE are already defined in the curriculum (MetE 143, ChE 2, ME 63, Acctg 1, BA 115, Econ 100.1 did I forget anything else?). The only elective where you will be free to choose is IE 197/198 - Special Topics in IE (he is right in pointing out that there are a number of entrepreneurial subjects which can be taken in place of IE 197/198, such as Techno-preneurship). Other examples of Special Topics include iSCM, SAP MM and S&D module and Six-Sigma training.

Thank You for that! It really helped a lot. Anyway, I already confirmed. IE in UP. I am planning to shift to BS BA after my first year. Would it be really hard to do that? I read somewhere that GWA required is at least 2.25 and a minimum of 30 units. Under normal circumstances, can I really complete 30 units w/c can be credited by CBA? But hey, if I don't, I don't think IE is a bad choice either. :)

[iRebirth]

^ sayang naman kung BA ka "lang" sa UP. IE is a very good and if I may say so, underrated course. But that's your decision to make.

The 2.25 GWA requirement for shifting is only the minimum. Since many want to shift to BA, you probably need 1.75 or higher to be competitive. As for the required number of units, you should have no problem as long as you follow the curriculum. If you really plan to shift to BA, take Math 100 instead of 53 during your 2nd sem. Of course, I'd really ask you to mull over this decision.

[n3X]

IE is a good choice naman and if you have good grades in your first year in UP then it wouldnt be difficult for you to shift into the college. Tama si iRebirth you would need a grade higher than 1.75 to be sure, competitive talaga yung slots. Napakacompetitive kasi sa CBA. Pero di ko gets yung sayang ka kung nag-BA ka "lang." BA and IE are incomparable. BA is also a very good course, actually wala naman akong maisip na olats na course sa UP. Wala naman sa course talaga yan e, asa tao. Kung hindi ka match for the course, e sayang ka talaga.

[_ozzakii]

IE > BA anyday.

[purpleheadd07]

Hello Pexers. I just want to thank you for your suggestions, opinions, etc. I've finally decided to go to Ateneo. I hope that cosmoPinoy will also be able to choose what his heart truly desires.. hehe..

welcome to admu :wave:

[n3X]

^^ Tell us reasons.

[_ozzakii]

Honestly, I was betting on its technicality in nature, that's one. IE grads can fulfill BA jobs easily, but not the other way around, unfortunately. That's two. IE is still an engineering course, though some would argue that it's "half baked" engineering, but that's beside the point. Engineering, whichever field it is, is generally more prestigious than BA. A BA degree only becomes significantly a worthy degree to have when it is earned from a very prestigious school such as UP Diliman, Ateneo de Manila and De La Salle University. A BA degree earned from a so-so school does not "wow" anybody.

The only downside of taking up IE at UP is that it is rigorous. Heard it's not like that at other schools.

In short, Engineering > BA. And since IE is an engineering course, IE > BA. :)

[_ozzakii]

Hello Pexers. I just want to thank you for your suggestions, opinions, etc. I've finally decided to go to Ateneo. I hope that cosmoPinoy will also be able to choose what his heart truly desires.. hehe..


I think you made the right choice in choosing Ateneo over UP Diliman. A full ride at Ateneo is really hard to beat especially if cost is an issue for you and your family. Trust me; going to UP Diliman is not entirely cheaper than going to Ateneo (or DLSU) as what many students think it is. The social life of being a UP student is very costly, and you have to consider that on your decision as well, which I think you did.

But I think CosmoPinoy is better off going to UP Diliman. Honestly, I would pay a 100k per sem for a UPSE degree. It's such a fantastic college with topnotch professors and an amazing student body. Some of the best of the best high school students of the best high schools in the country are there and it’s hard to say you wouldn’t want to be around them.

[LT]

Pwede ba mag-poll?

Ateneo - 1 (Rona Francia)
UPD - 1 (rn8)

So CosmpoP, what's it gonna be?

Just kidding haha :D


But seriously, and this is definitely off-topic, I've always wondered why there are more UP/Ateneo or UP/UST 'dilemmas' than there are UP/La Salle ones. You're from LS, right _ozzakii? Can you or any of your fellows enlighten us (or the very least, me)?

And to those who will say that Ateneo (or UST) is way superior to DLSU, unahan ko na kayo: I don't buy that crap hahaha*peace*

[tantararantaran]

In short, Engineering > BA. And since IE is an engineering course, IE > BA. :)

Comparing Engineering with BA is apples and oranges. They have entirely different specializations. In the workplace, the fresh grad from one course cannot do the task of the other basically because neither doesn't have the background necessary to fulfill the other's duties. While it may be true that Engineers may in the long run get to have the BA skills, most of them undergo MBA as their postgraduate degree, which, in all its entirety, is a BA degree.

As to whether IE>BA, there is no empirical evidence to prove the claim, if I may say so. IE is specialized in operations. BA may also specialize in operations, but it also can do Finance, or Marketing.

Just my 2 cents.

[_ozzakii]

Yeah, I know they're "apple and orange". But, of course, we can always compare an apple to an orange, if we need to. But that's just plain moot.

For example, a kid comes to you and asks "which is a more prestigious profession between a doctor and a nurse." What would you do, or what would you tell the kid? Would you tell the kid, I wouldn't say anything because they're entirely different courses?

[tantararantaran]

Of course, I'd say it's the doctor. Because the medical profession has so long ago established that nurses are at the doctors' disposal most of the time. But IE and BA? I don't think so. They are by any means different in many respects, not so much with doctors and nurses who usually do their jobs hand in hand.

Besides, I know too many BA people who get jobs everyone else will just envy, with only an undergrad diploma under their belt and little to no work experience. I don't say that IE people cannot do the same, what I'm trying to say is that when it comes to prestige (from the employers' perspective) BA does not lag behind any other course. Not once have I ever thought that the additional "A" in my degree (I'm a BSBAA by the way) doesn't do what I thought it was supposed to do, as my BA counterparts deliver as well. But we already have digressed to much.

I agree with the posters who say that FIT is very critical. Whether it be in ateneo or in UP, you are in good hands as long as you fit well.

[cosmoPinoy]

And still, the pressure persists in me. I've decided to confirm BOTH in UP and Ateneo. Wow, what a move, no? And Ateneo charges this 4000 peso fee. Good job. They even had my picture taken for the ID. I guess that's their way of safekeeping incoming freshies. Praning eh.

Anyway, I still have a few more weeks to go to decide.

Wait. Can you like go to two schools at the same time? I mean, people can do multiple degrees anyway, so why not do that too? Gaah! Hahahaha.

[rn8]

i have a friend taking up IE in UP and he told me it won't be a smart move to shift from IE to BA. But as you said, FIT is very critical. I think I am more FIT for BA but IE impresses/challenges me more. And I love challenges. I guess I'll see after I finish my first semester if I'll shift or not. But continue the BA vs. IE arguments coming. It really helps me a lot.

[tantararantaran]

Haha, borrow Hermione's time-turner and you can get through both UP and Ateneo during the first year. Unfortunately, when you get your majors, you will curse yourself at why you ever considered the idea of studying in 2 schools at the same time. :smash:

[n3X]

tama si tantararantaran.

anyway in the first place rn8 ano ba gusto mong maging o plano sa buhay? instead of comparing the two programs, mas magandang reference yung plans mo.

[_ozzakii]

i have a friend taking up IE in UP and he told me it won't be a smart move to shift from IE to BA. But as you said, FIT is very critical. I think I am more FIT for BA but IE impresses/challenges me more. And I love challenges. I guess I'll see after I finish my first semester if I'll shift or not. But continue the BA vs. IE arguments coming. It really helps me a lot.

I also don't see any solid reason to shift to BA if you're already OK with IE and you can spare that extra year that IE requires. Perhaps the only reason you should shift out from the program is when you don't like the program and you hate the subjects or your classmates. I would, however, admit that there are more "socially active" students taking up BA than there are those taking up IE.

[_ozzakii]

tama si tantararantaran.

anyway in the first place rn8 ano ba gusto mong maging o plano sa buhay? instead of comparing the two programs, mas magandang reference yung plans mo.

This is where UP becomes a much better place for CosmoPinoy than Ateneo because he hasn't made up his mind yet on what field to major in college. And mind you, there are a lot of students that are just like him -- still undecided on what to major.

I've also read an article that says, 1 of every 3 Filipino college students have been found to have changed courses before they finally graduated from college. I don't have the link to that article now, but it surely exists.

UPSE is a student friendly school. It has a very low drop out rate and very high graduation rate. Those who shifted out were easily absorbed by other UP colleges and institutes. For example, a UPSE student can easily shift to PolSci, MassCom or any pre-law or premed course so long as he does not have any failing mark. This is an almost guaranteed thing at UP. And even if he would have a lousy GPA, there are still a lot of courses that are willing to accommodate him if he decides to transfer due to poor grades.

On the other hand, the ME at Ateneo is very rigorous and it's a trap for those who later found it tough. It has a very high drop out rate and very low graduation rate. Some of those who did poorly at Ateneo ME wouldn't even be absorbed in other colleges, so the likeliness that they wouldn't graduate with an Ateneo degree is very high.

[rn8]

actually, ngayon i just thought of taking up an MBA after my IE degree (if I survive, which I am crossing my fingers i will). I'd love to do a more managerial work and I guess both IE and BA prepares you for that. Maybe you can enlighten me more on the difference. But as of now, I guess I'll stay with IE.

[yoroshikuonegai]

UP

i dont see why you should think twice getting into UP. I have dreamed of being a UP graduate but I passed just ADMU and DLSU. Tuloy , life destroyed T_T

Iba kasi talaga UP , the only university na kilala sa ibang bansa. Nung pmnta ako singapore may nagtanong na student what school are u from? I said my school and he replied oohh , well I'm not familiar with the school , I only heard of UP XD

[LT]

tama si tantararantaran.

anyway in the first place rn8 ano ba gusto mong maging o plano sa buhay? instead of comparing the two programs, mas magandang reference yung plans mo.

Dude, let the kid enjoy muna. You make 'plans' only after you're bored with life hahaha:D

[yoroshikuonegai]

UP is the most renowned Philippine university abroad so I dont see why you shouldnt go there. Most people wanted to get into UP but passed only admu and dlsu (like me) so consider yourself really lucky :D Pinsan ko nagaral sa UP ingit na ingit ako kasi rugged talaga ang dating , hardcore studying with freedom. Sa school ko , wala mayayaman na sosy. Madugo lang talaga yung drop out rate pero sa tingin ko kaya mo naman yan

"Any course in the philippines , you name it , UP is the best , period" Prof ko pa nagsabi nun ah XD

[LT]

UP

i dont see why you should think twice getting into UP. I have dreamed of being a UP graduate but I passed just ADMU and DLSU. Tuloy , life destroyed T_T

Iba kasi talaga UP , the only university na kilala sa ibang bansa. Nung pmnta ako singapore may nagtanong na student what school are u from? I said my school and he replied oohh , well I'm not familiar with the school , I only heard of UP XD

This year's BAR TOPNOTCHER from Ateneo failed the LAE despite the fact that she's an honors grad from UP. So don't fret. You come from a good school. And besides, it's the person, not the school hehe*okay*

[_ozzakii]

This year's BAR TOPNOTCHER from Ateneo failed the LAE despite the fact that she's an honors grad from UP. So don't fret. You come from a good school. And besides, it's the person, not the school hehe

Neither one of those 3 Ateneans has actually passed UP-LAE but the top 2 acquired her pre-law at ateneo. :D

[n3X]

Dude, let the kid enjoy muna. You make 'plans' only after you're bored with life hahaha:D

:rolleyes:
Enjoy today but look forward to the future. Put together your plans now. Balance idealism with practicality.

Anyway yung top 2 na Ateneans, undergrad nila UP.

[tyler_sci]

Pwede ba mag-poll?

Ateneo - 1 (Rona Francia)
UPD - 1 (rn8)

So CosmpoP, what's it gonna be?

Just kidding haha :D


But seriously, and this is definitely off-topic, I've always wondered why there are more UP/Ateneo or UP/UST 'dilemmas' than there are UP/La Salle ones. You're from LS, right _ozzakii? Can you or any of your fellows enlighten us (or the very least, me)?

And to those who will say that Ateneo (or UST) is way superior to DLSU, unahan ko na kayo: I don't buy that crap hahaha*peace*

I have a probable answer...ü less ang nagdedecide between up/dlsu rather than up/admu or up/ust because of the trimestral system...ü some might think that that system may be too "rushed" although its obviously arguable...ü ..and some want to enjoy 4 years of college life compared to three... hehe... you can't really compare apples with oranges, kaya less ang gumagawa ng comparison na yon...ü ..just a theory...ü

[sPiKeR14]

.,hi...i was reading through the threads when i found this one...

.,i kinda have the same dilemma as the person who started this thread...the difference is,I am choosing bet. UPM or AdMU and that i didn't acquire a scholarship from AdMU...

.,i got into UPM with the course D Dental Medicine...
.,i got into AdMU with the course BS Psychology...

.,AdMU is my dream school and BS Psychology is my course of choice but my parents/friends are urging me to go to UP well basically beacause the tuition fee is much3 lower compared to AdMU's,,and also because they know that i want to take up medicine in the future...

i never really imagined myself going to UP ever...i never thought of it as my dream school,<i'm not like the other students>,i always thought of AdMU as my future school...but of course,,i don't want to burden my parents w/ the very high AdMU tution fee...i'm soooo confused...

.,its my dream school vs. the school my parent's choose...

.,can anyone enlighten me on this...i would gladly appreciate opinions and comments....thanks!

[Kirkegaard]

Chose UP... again.

You can't go wrong either way.

[albert16]

^ganyan din dilemma ko dati. akin namin DLSU-m at UPm. Sa DLSU-m ang choice ko apat ay accountancy, both dream school at dream course. nakakuha ako ng slot sa UPm, social sciences ang course. financial din ang problem ko, kaya naman kaso medyo mahirap ng dahil sobrang laki ng differene ng tuition ko dapat sa DLSU-m at UPm, unlike ngayon na tumaas ang tuition sa UP kaya medyo mas malaki ang panghihinayang noong time ko. Sa UPm ako natuloy, I'm happy with my choice although my panghihinayang until now (kahit graduate na ako) hehehehe.

Ikaw pa rin ang bahala, it's your own decision, nasa huli lagi ang pagsisisi. ang inisip ko nalang, kung saan masaya ako at masaya parents ko dun nalang ako. Naging masaya naman ako at parents ko kaya ok na.

If you have other questions, just pm me. *peace*

[Churbs]

.,hi...i was reading through the threads when i found this one...

.,i kinda have the same dilemma as the person who started this thread...the difference is,I am choosing bet. UPM or AdMU and that i didn't acquire a scholarship from AdMU...

.,i got into UPM with the course D Dental Medicine...
.,i got into AdMU with the course BS Psychology...

.,AdMU is my dream school and BS Psychology is my course of choice but my parents/friends are urging me to go to UP well basically beacause the tuition fee is much3 lower compared to AdMU's,,and also because they know that i want to take up medicine in the future...

i never really imagined myself going to UP ever...i never thought of it as my dream school,<i'm not like the other students>,i always thought of AdMU as my future school...but of course,,i don't want to burden my parents w/ the very high AdMU tution fee...i'm soooo confused...

.,its my dream school vs. the school my parent's choose...

.,can anyone enlighten me on this...i would gladly appreciate opinions and comments....thanks!

Then if Ateneo's your dream school, go there. You should decide for your own future. :)

[LT]

Talk to your parents. Tell them what's truly in your heart. If it's Ateneo, then go to Ateneo. As some people have pointed out, there are scholarships available there. Although I don't know if you can still qualify even if you're not a scholar now.

I really wouldn't wanna be in your shoes because it's a tough decision. But then again, bata ka pa lang, pero hinuhubog ka na. So your situation, however tough it may seem, is actually a good learning and growth experience.

Good luck with your choice. As people have also said, you couldn't go wrong with either school.

One question though, you wanna be a dentist or a doctor? Because that could be factor to consider as well.

So.. follow your heart or obey your parents? Tough choice. But I'm sure the answer lies somewhere in between;) Good luck kiddo!

[n3X]

This year's BAR TOPNOTCHER from Ateneo failed the LAE despite the fact that she's an honors grad from UP. So don't fret. You come from a good school. And besides, it's the person, not the school hehe*okay*

ang tanong, kung yung tao ba na yun natanggap nga sa UP Law, siya pa kaya topnotcher? hindi simple ang realidad at katotohanan ng mga bagay-bagay.

[purpleheadd07]

sPiKeR14, you can always proceed to med at UPM after graduating in BS Psy at ADMU, at least you'll have the best of both worlds. *okay*

[LT]

ang tanong, kung yung tao ba na yun natanggap nga sa UP Law, siya pa kaya topnotcher? hindi simple ang realidad at katotohanan ng mga bagay-bagay.

Dude, wala naman kume-question niyan eh. Hear hear? hehe

But sPiKeR14 has some questions. Maybe you can help answer hehe:D

[Kirkegaard]

sPiKeR14, you can always proceed to med at UPM after graduating in BS Psy at ADMU, at least you'll have the best of both worlds. *okay*

If it's any indication, our 2008 graduating class in UPM only had TWO MDs who took their undergrad in Ateneo.

[n3X]

Dude, wala naman kume-question niyan eh. Hear hear? hehe

But sPiKeR14 has some questions. Maybe you can help answer hehe:D

Actually isa yun sa point ko, dapat we question those assumptions din. Cuz I honestly think iba magiging scenario kung natanggap nga yung topnotcher sa UP Law. Diba? People tend to think na magandang twist yun. Reject ng UP Law nag-top. Pero kung iisipin natin talaga, it doesnt necessarily follow. Maraming factors. Hindi nga simple ang katotohanan.

As with spiker14, kebs. hehehe Joke! Anyway, same crap: Question yung assumptions. What makes a dream school for you? Why is Ateneo your dream school? Ganun.

Remember lang na things change. Malay mo pagpasok mo sa UP, mahalin mo rin siya and ma-appreciate yung UP experience. Well malaking factor din ang costs, sa panahon ngayon kailangan practical pero I would always advice you to follow what you want.

[albert16]

^getting to UP Med is not that easy, as far as I know. You need to get a whooping 95+ grade in your NMAT (correct me if I'm wrong), also you need to get an overall average of 2.0, for male, or 1.75, for female (correct me if I'm wrong, also) and the interview consists of relevant social issues. So I think having your undergrad in UP will give you an edge over other applicants. Kirkegaard was right, you can actually count on your fingers the number of med graduates that received their undergraduate degrees from universities other than UP.

But still, as I said earlier, it's you choice, it is not also easy to survive in the dent program of UPm. Many of my dent batchmates shifted courses before they even tried the dexterity exam.

Off the topic: Kirkegaard... sino ikaw? kilala mo ako pero *** di kita kilala... hehehehehe

[cosmoPinoy]

Hey Spiker person. Go to Ateneo! That's what you want anyway, so quit asking!

MY TURN. :))

Hey, I just threw off my BS ME slot in Ateneo for my BS Eco in UP-D. I think I made a sound decision so far. I mean, UP's gonna be even better with the new charter so I guess the good stuff are adding up on UP.

Anyway, just a few more questions.

It's May 5 [12mn]. My registration is May 6. I have not gone through the required medical check-up yet. Will I make it if I do it today?

Also, my High School report card is with Ateneo. They're holding it since I confirmed in their school. Can I just give a photocopy of it?

[albert16]

UP needs your original report card. You must get it from the Ateneo. Ako nga nasa DLSU na iyong report card ko tapos nagbayad na rin ako ng confirmation pero iyon kinuha ko iyong report card ko tapos di ko na nabawi iyong confirmation fee. Try going to UP Infirmary / Health Service and inquire about the physical exam as soon as possible. The medical clearance from UPHS is needed for you to register. If you can't get a medical clearance from UPHS today, try going to OUR or to your college secretary and tell your case. You can start your registration after you obtain your clearance, probably next week, but you need to enlist your subjects as soon as possible, so finish all the requirement asap.

[Prof. Umbridge]

IE is a good choice naman and if you have good grades in your first year in UP then it wouldnt be difficult for you to shift into the college. Tama si iRebirth you would need a grade higher than 1.75 to be sure, competitive talaga yung slots. Napakacompetitive kasi sa CBA. Pero di ko gets yung sayang ka kung nag-BA ka "lang." BA and IE are incomparable. BA is also a very good course, actually wala naman akong maisip na olats na course sa UP. Wala naman sa course talaga yan e, asa tao. Kung hindi ka match for the course, e sayang ka talaga.

BA is sometimes called 'BA lang' to differentiate from BAA (without the extra 'A'). I know.. silly .. :bop:

[dm_gty88]

spiker14.... Don't choose UP Manila Dent! Don't! Choose Ateneo! Would you trade a 4 year course for a 6 year course as a pre-med? Since UP has a tuition fee HIIIIKKKEEE (300x kasi eh... so yeah), it's almost like you studied in Ateneo for 4 years. I think.

[ayaraine]

to spiker14: if you're planning to go med anyway, sana nagtry kasa intarmed ba yun? na pwedeng mas maikli ang pre-med mo (i think two years lang yata... then diretso na med...) anyway, kung magmemed ka naman anyway, choose ateneo psych na lang.magUP Dent ka lang kung gusto mo talaga magdent. sobrang magastos ang dent course sa UP, dahil sa mga gamit. a friend of mine had to shift out during her pre-dent years (plus she really hated organic chemistry... hehe...). she ended up finishing BS Communications Research sa diliman instead.

[n3X]

ako I suggest to spiker14: go to UP Manila, then shift out ka after your first year to another course in Manila or Diliman. puede naman yun diba? cuz if you want to pursue med in UPM, its best if you take your undergrad degree in UP. Super kunti lang taga-ibang schools pumapasok ng UP Med.

Tapos wag po tayong maniwala sa mga taong kahit simple computations di magawa. So lets say you took up Dent sa UP, 20k per sem times 12 semesters = 240,000. Ateneo 8 semesters times 60k = 480,000. Pero kung shift out ka ng first year to a 4 yr course sa UP, 20k times 8 semesters = 160,000.

[sweet_ryan]

spiker14, got to UP Manila and take Dent sa first year mo...then transfer kas sa Public Health or Behavioral Science sa UPM...kasi parang nakikita ko ang daming galing ng Public Health and BehSci na nakakapasok sa UP Med.

[ayaraine]

hmm... onga no. di ko naisip yun... magshift ka na lang out of dent spiker... ang alam ko madali nga makapasok sa public health... di kasi mataas ang demand for that course... also make sure to get the course subjects sa lilipatan mo para pag mag-enroll ka during your first year eh credited lahat ng subjects mo at walang masasayang...

[albert16]

hmm... onga no. di ko naisip yun... magshift ka na lang out of dent spiker... ang alam ko madali nga makapasok sa public health... di kasi mataas ang demand for that course... also make sure to get the course subjects sa lilipatan mo para pag mag-enroll ka during your first year eh credited lahat ng subjects mo at walang masasayang...

Marami rin naman kasing umaalis sa Dent eh.

teka ano na kaya ang naging desisyon niya? reg na ng 1st yr.

[Prof. Umbridge]

spiker14, got to UP Manila and take Dent sa first year mo...then transfer kas sa Public Health or Behavioral Science sa UPM...kasi parang nakikita ko ang daming galing ng Public Health and BehSci na nakakapasok sa UP Med.

Or, better yet, shift to BS Psychology at Diliman. UP Med is very competitive in its admission. There are only few slots open every year because the Intarmed folks get priority. So, aim to get a high NMAT score and a high undergrad GWA. *okay*

[lebron_paul]

.,hi...i was reading through the threads when i found this one...

.,i kinda have the same dilemma as the person who started this thread...the difference is,I am choosing bet. UPM or AdMU and that i didn't acquire a scholarship from AdMU...

.,i got into UPM with the course D Dental Medicine...
.,i got into AdMU with the course BS Psychology...

.,AdMU is my dream school and BS Psychology is my course of choice but my parents/friends are urging me to go to UP well basically beacause the tuition fee is much3 lower compared to AdMU's,,and also because they know that i want to take up medicine in the future...

i never really imagined myself going to UP ever...i never thought of it as my dream school,<i'm not like the other students>,i always thought of AdMU as my future school...but of course,,i don't want to burden my parents w/ the very high AdMU tution fee...i'm soooo confused...

.,its my dream school vs. the school my parent's choose...

.,can anyone enlighten me on this...i would gladly appreciate opinions and comments....thanks!



Go to AdMU as it is your dream school and you got offers from them. I would have advise you to go to UP, but it's obvious that UP is not your type of school to go to, so don't force yourself to go there because you might just regret that decision later on.

[lebron_paul]

If it's any indication, our 2008 graduating class in UPM only had TWO MDs who took their undergrad in Ateneo.

Yes, from anecdotal experiences, UP professional schools (Med, Law, Business and Eng'g) heavily practices in-breeding. UP prefers to admit one of its own to an outsider (Atenean, La Sallite and others.) Call it bias, but that's what reality is at most elitist institutions such as UPD and UPM. UP professional schools (and UP graduate schools) have very high standard to maintain. UP considers those who has an undergrad education from its own undergrad colleges superior to those who graduated from other schools/universities.

[lebron_paul]

spiker14.... Don't choose UP Manila Dent! Don't! Choose Ateneo! Would you trade a 4 year course for a 6 year course as a pre-med? Since UP has a tuition fee HIIIIKKKEEE (300x kasi eh... so yeah), it's almost like you studied in Ateneo for 4 years. I think.


But without biases, UPM is better than is Ateneo for premed. It's the number one feeder school to UP College of Medicine. Anyone who graduates from UPM can get into a med school that he wants if he does not get into UPCM.

UPM is also more popular than is Ateneo as evidenced by its low admission rate and high enrolment yield.

A dental medicine is also a much desirable profession than is Psychology(Psychologist), given the student has the ability to pass any school he wants to get into and the talent to finish the program. time to finish the program and money to pay the tuition and all the costs associated to studying the program.

[paralusi]

Yes, from anecdotal experiences, UP professional schools (Med, Law, Business and Eng'g) heavily practices in-breeding. UP prefers to admit one of its own to an outsider (Atenean, La Sallite and others.) Call it bias, but that's what reality is at most elitist institutions such as UPD and UPM. UP professional schools (and UP graduate schools) have very high standard to maintain. UP considers those who has an undergrad education from its own undergrad colleges superior to those who graduated from other schools/universities.

medicine, perhaps. but, this is not true in the case of UP law.

[albert16]

gusto ko malaman kung ano ang naging pasya ni spiker14 at ng thread starter.

[KuyaDanny]

Thread starter decided to attend ADMU (Post #168). Spiker hasn't gotten back to us yet.

[n3X]

Yes, from anecdotal experiences, UP professional schools (Med, Law, Business and Eng'g) heavily practices in-breeding. UP prefers to admit one of its own to an outsider (Atenean, La Sallite and others.) Call it bias, but that's what reality is at most elitist institutions such as UPD and UPM. UP professional schools (and UP graduate schools) have very high standard to maintain. UP considers those who has an undergrad education from its own undergrad colleges superior to those who graduated from other schools/universities.

Yeah, meron ganung view but your post suggests na severe yung discrimination sa colleges you mentioned. Its not that sobrang maka-UP yung mga colleges, its just, like what you said, they maintain high standards and part of this is recruiting the best students. Yung main admission criterion pa rin are objective tests like yung NMAT, LAE, GPAT, etc. E kahit some faculty naman ng schools na yan came from different schools. Look at UP Law, halos kalahati lang daw UP undergrad dun. We disregard din the fact na there are some UP students who get rejected din pero these colleges get from other schools. Yes, its true that UP prefers to admit its own but it does so with reason. We might not understand how. Nakakaloka nga diba, yung bar topnotcher na magna ng BAA, hindi tinanggap ng Law. :lol: And we also know cumlaudes ng biology, hindi tinatanggap ng Med. So ganun, its more about the individual and yung fit niya dun sa college.

[lebron_paul]

medicine, perhaps. but, this is not true in the case of UP law.

Uhhh, how is that not true when 70% of UP Law student body is composed of UP alumni?

Whether we like it or not, UP Law practices in-breeding as are those elitist institutions in other countries such as Yale Law, Havard Law and Stanford Law.

[lebron_paul]

n3X,

If you'll look at the stats, you'd know right away that both UP professional schools and UP posgrad schools do prefer UP undergrads. We can only speculate about the reasons for such practice but the fact is, they do practice in-breeding. period.

Now, as to whether that is a good thing or not, I don't know. but, at least, i know that UP has a certain standard to maintain and a solid reputation to uphold.

BTW, saw the law student body data and it's not 50% but 70%. That despite only 276 of the more than 1,700 UP Law applicants come from UP colleges.

[paralusi]

Uhhh, how is that not true when 70% of UP Law student body is composed of UP alumni?

Whether we like it or not, UP Law practices in-breeding as are those elitist institutions in other countries such as Yale Law, Havard Law and Stanford Law.

firstly, i AM from UP law.

secondly, you have to look at the number of applicants coming from the different schools. if there are more passers from UP (all campuses?), know that there were more applicants from UP in the first place.

lastly, if there is "in-breeding," don't you think this year's bar topnotcher (UP BSBAA, graduated with honors) should have had no problems getting into UP law?

[n3X]

n3X,

If you'll look at the stats, you'd know right away that both UP professional schools and UP posgrad schools do prefer UP undergrads. We can only speculate about the reasons for such practice but the fact is, they do practice in-breeding. period.

Now, as to whether that is a good thing or not, I don't know. but, at least, i know that UP has a certain standard to maintain and a solid reputation to uphold.

BTW, saw the law student body data and it's not 50% but 70%. That despite only 276 of the more than 1,700 UP Law applicants come from UP colleges.

Relax. Sabi ko diba, meron ngang ganung view, I didnt dispute kung meron o wala. Relax ka lang. What I was saying, again, was that meron ngang inbreeding, pero meron siya because these people have a reason for it. Period. Hindi lang siya dahil sobrang maka-UP lang, although I also think there are some good students na naiiwan din.

And BTW, could u share these figures or stats that you speak of?

[sPiKeR14]

.,hi po...im back...

.,sorry medyo natagalan po ako mag-update,,di ako nakareply kaagad,, but i've constantly been reading the posts and replies regarding my query....
.,i appreciate every comment,opinion,suggestion made regarding my question,,thank you po sa lahat...

.,well anyway,,as for the verdict.......

.,i finally chose to go to UP Manila...<mainly because i want to take up medicine in the future...as stated above,,several of the people whom i asked(UP grads as well) also said that it would be harder to get into UPCM if your not a UP undergrad,,so that was my main reason....>

.,[sigh....]i chose to give up the ateneo dream but with a heavy heart....i thought about it for like a million times...

.,i had to let go of the ateneo dream in order to go for my other dream which is to be a doctor someday...

.,i really hope and pray that i made the right decision...[sigh...]

.,thanks again!!!=)

[sPiKeR14]

^oh yeah,regarding the pre-med argument...

i'm just gonna take dent during my 1st year, but i plan to shift to a better pre-med for my 2nd year <either BS Public health in UPM or BS Psychology in UPD>...which one do you think is better???=)

[n3X]

^oh yeah,regarding the pre-med argument...

i'm just gonna take dent during my 1st year, but i plan to shift to a better pre-med for my 2nd year <either BS Public health in UPM or BS Psychology in UPD>...which one do you think is better???=)

BS Psych definitely. Pero dapat work hard din sa grades mo sa 1st year.

Anyway bakit ba dream school mo ateneo? Or ano kwento ng ateneo dream? Hehe Wala lang. Wanna know, nabanggit mo na rin. Nakakarinig ako ng ateneo dream, minsan UP dream, pero parang wala ng iba after that? I'm just wondering what makes. E parang sa reality, mas bangungot minsan. hehehe :lol:

[albert16]

^oh yeah,regarding the pre-med argument...

i'm just gonna take dent during my 1st year, but i plan to shift to a better pre-med for my 2nd year <either BS Public health in UPM or BS Psychology in UPD>...which one do you think is better???=)

ok naman parehas. marami rin nakakapasa sa med galing ng bio at biochem ng UP Manila. sa 2nd sem mo nalang pag-isipan. hehehehe

[lebron_paul]

firstly, i AM from UP law.

secondly, you have to look at the number of applicants coming from the different schools. if there are more passers from UP (all campuses?), know that there were more applicants from UP in the first place.


averages are irrelevent in giving us a better picture of the nature of the school's admission's preferences. Last year, one successful applicant came fresh from MSU Iligan. That would register a hundred % passing rate for his alma mater school. But is MSU-Iligan a better feeder school to UP Law than is Ateneo undergrad when only about 20%-25% get into UP Law from Ateneo undergrad?


lastly, if there is "in-breeding," don't you think this year's bar topnotcher (UP BSBAA, graduated with honors) should have had no problems getting into UP law?

I didn't say it's easy to get into UP Law. Getting into UP Law is extremely hard. I'm sure you know that being a UP Law student yourself. And I'm also sure that your example was not the first case. I have already heard several magnas from UP undergrad that were unsuccessful to UP Law. But I have also heard several summas from other schools that weren't successful either. Look at it this way -- if there wasn't in-breeding at UP law then why is it that about 70% of the student body of UP Law are UP alumni when only about 20%-25% of the applicants are? I'm sure strong academic stats are solid factors for admission but so are school and product preferences.

[lebron_paul]

Period.

Uhhh... what a copycat! :hmm:

anyway, what makes you think i wasn't relaxed? Was that b/coz of your long history of being a provocative poster? Hehehe! :lol: Seriously, i was quite relaxed when i responded your post. You did not touch my nerve, at least, not yet.




And BTW, could u share these figures or stats that you speak of?

That's not actually a hidden information. You can always go to UP Law to ask for their enrolment profile and enrollment statistics. I have done that many times in the past. Many UP Law aspirants have done that in the past as well. We never had any problem getting that data from them. I'm sure you too wouldn't encounter any problem should you wish to do the same, provided you have reasons for acquiring them. ;)

[n3X]

anyway, what makes you think i wasn't relaxed? Was that b/coz of your long history of being a provocative poster? Hehehe! :lol: Seriously, i was quite relaxed when i responded your post. You did not touch my nerve, at least, not yet.

Haha Honestly, when I write I dont intend to provoke people. But I guess thats the effect. :bashful:


That's not actually a hidden information. You can always go to UP Law to ask for their enrolment profile and enrollment statistics. I have done that many times in the past. Many UP Law aspirants have done that in the past as well. We never had any problem getting that data from them. I'm sure you too wouldn't encounter any problem should you wish to do the same, provided you have reasons for acquiring them. ;)

Teka lang, e bakit parang sa previous posts mo meron kang access pati dun sa info kung san galing yung applicants, like yung percentage ng UP applicants. And you talked about other UP colleges. UP Law is only one of several colleges that offer professional and postgraduate education. You say, if (we) look at the stats, but wheres your data now?

Your statement could be found below >


If you'll look at the stats, you'd know right away that both UP professional schools and UP posgrad schools do prefer UP undergrads. We can only speculate about the reasons for such practice but the fact is, they do practice in-breeding. period.

You were the first one to say these things so it falls on you to supply the data. First sinabi mo, anecdotal evidence, and thats fine cuz we've all heard that. But support your statement above.

[green_overcomer]

Just by looking at the thread's question (UPD vs. ADMU), I would have to say choose UP or even any UP campus in the system. This is based on the fact that an Ateneo education has gotten very expensive through the years that being schooled there has become more of a privilege than a right. Given the Philippines' deteriorating economy and standard of education, lugi ka kung sa Ateneo ka mag-aaral when in fact, a UP diploma still has more weight if you plan to work abroad. Based from my experience here in Saudia, most Saudis and fellow expats do not know Ateneo, but they definitely know UP. So pragmatically, UP is the better choice.

[lebron_paul]

n3X,

I am saying that I personally saw the data and at the time I was looking for them, they were not hard to find. Of course, I did not memorize the numbers so I cannot post them here. But I saw that there's a glaring preferences for UP Diliman undergrads at UP Law as evidence by their high admission rate at UP Law. The anecdotal circumstances I was telling you before were another stories.

[lebron_paul]

and n3X, someone said that you're from UP Baguio -- a relatively unknown school. I guess you need to look at the thread again coz it says: UP Diliman vs Ateneo de Manila.

I guess you need to accept it the UP Baguio is not the same as UP Diliman and there's no way any ACET passer would dream of going to that school. You're not in-touched with the reality if you believe you know a lot about UP Diliman when you even haven't studied there for undergrad.

[n3X]

Haha Well first of all, it doesnt mean that one didn't study in UP Diliman that one couldn't know these things or get "in-touched with the reality." That doesnt necessarily follow. Second, there are some ACET passers who went to UP Baguio just to get a UP education. Third, coming from three campuses, I could testify that it's not really the campus, but the faculty and students that matter. And finally, I passed Diliman but my parents didn't let me go until after my freshie year so I went to Baguio first. I also think you should know and please tell that someone that I graduated from UP Diliman, BS Business Administration.

Next time lebron_paul, better get your story straight. So are you telling us you went to BA, Law, Med and other colleges and looked at the data, which contained where their admitted students came from? If these aren't hard to find, why dont you get them again and post them here. So we could finally "look at the stats" as you stated before.

BTW, its not that I am resorting to ad hominems but I've revealed where I've studied. How about you lebron_paul, whats your undergrad and are you studying in UP as a postgrad student?

[Kirkegaard]

and n3X, someone said that you're from UP Baguio -- a relatively unknown school. I guess you need to look at the thread again coz it says: UP Diliman vs Ateneo de Manila.

I guess you need to accept it the UP Baguio is not the same as UP Diliman and there's no way any ACET passer would dream of going to that school. You're not in-touched with the reality if you believe you know a lot about UP Diliman when you even haven't studied there for undergrad.

Shame at the ad hominem and generalization.

And I don't buy in-breeding, too. This assumes, among other things, that UP Law applicants from different schools have the same (level of) intellect. Arguably, there are more bright students in UP than in any other schools. Thus, more of them are accepted into UP Law. No in-breeding.

PS: I would not have minded going to UP Baguio instead.

[n3X]

O asan na si lebron_paul?

I hope he's getting those stats for us.

[maroon_spinoza]

i think i can share my personal dilemma on the UP or Ateneo thing, just to look at this issue from another angle =)

i got in at ADMU's chemistry-materials science engineering program. and i received a 100% scholarship. coming from a public high school in a really poor province [albay], surely, ADMU is the waaay to go with regards to my tertiary education.i seriously thought i was going to ADMU. although i had some anxieties because math was never my best subject, and i had to maintain a particular GWA to retain my scholarship.

on the other hand, i got in at UPD, BA Psychology. i flunked intarmed so i settled for my pseudo-1st choice. most people thought that between ADMU chem-mse and UP Psych, 'common' sense says that ADMU it is. really, it was a very difficult decision to make. i spent nights lying awake thinking about this [naks!].

eventually due to my intarmed frustrations, i was really thinking of going to ADMU, and so i went to the School of Science and Engineering Open House, and everything changed from then on =)

they gave us the curriculum outline for Chem-MSE, and horror of [my] horrors, i saw courses like 'Marriage, Sexuality and Family in the Catholic Perspective' squeezed in between Chem labs and math courses. i was like, oh-my-[own]God, why am i taking these things if i do not even conform to something i have ambivalent feelings towards [roman catholicism].

and so when we had a forum with the SOSE Dean, i asked him if we were 'compelled' to take those Catholic-esque courses, and he said yes, even Muslim students take those things. and in my minds I said: what the hell, NO WAY. and my parents never knew about my reason behing turning down ADMU.

eventually i enrolled in UP Psych and I am just, err, happy that I am in a university that respects diversity so much that it puts faith in each student's capacity and sense of judgment to choose to learn what he believes in and what he loves. not that ADMU is the opposite, but seriously, why would I pay money just to know what the jesuits think about OUR lives. hehe.

so, UP na. =)

[dagitab24]

Actually, everyone in Ateneo takes subjects like 'Marriage, Sexuality and Family in the Catholic Perspective'. It's a part of the core curriculum, along with English, History, etc. There are some instructors (a slight majority, in fact) who are actually open-minded about the said topic. One of them even tells his students, "If you can't be good, be safe!" :lol: Another professor who teaches Philosophy of Religion (not to be confused with Theology) is a proud atheist.

That was actually my dilemma at first -- I was choosing between Chem at Ateneo and Biochem at UP Manila, and ended up going to Ateneo. I did take those subjects, even when I shifted to BS MIS, but taking those subjects only made my belief system (which, I believe, is the same as yours) stronger and more cogent.

[cheezy828]

Actually, everyone in Ateneo takes subjects like 'Marriage, Sexuality and Family in the Catholic Perspective'. It's a part of the core curriculum, along with English, History, etc. There are some instructors (a slight majority, in fact) who are actually open-minded about the said topic. One of them even tells his students, "If you can't be good, be safe!" :lol: Another professor who teaches Philosophy of Religion (not to be confused with Theology) is a proud atheist.

That was actually my dilemma at first -- I was choosing between Chem at Ateneo and Biochem at UP Manila, and ended up going to Ateneo. I did take those subjects, even when I shifted to BS MIS, but taking those subjects only made my belief system (which, I believe, is the same as yours) stronger and more cogent.

OT: who is the 103 prof? :)

[maroon_spinoza]

^ yep. i am aware of that, i remember the dean saying that the core curriculum thing was for every ADMU student to take.

pero personally i thought that in something as supposedly liberating and maturing as a tertiary environment, there must be a considerable amount of weight [and faith] given to a student's capacity to choose. kasi it's not as if throughout our whole lives there is a curriculum or a list of things that will dictate to us what we should learn and what we shouldn't.=)

[math_techie]

^ pero for GE kids like me. Mas OK pa rin kung may common core ang lahat ng students. Sadly the UP - RGEP has helped in deterioting the standards of what a UP student should be.

A UP student can now graduate from UP, without taking english courses, without taking math courses, without taking history courses, without taking social science courses. Parang nawawala ata yung well roundedness ng isang UP student because everything was left to choice.