ADMU - AB courses lang ang kayang i-offer?

[karadon]

Ateneans please explain.

Why can't Ateneo offer Medicine, Engineering, Accounting, Pharmacy, Nursing, Physical Therapy, Statistics, Architecture, Music, Fine Arts, Dentistry, etc.

Frankly, an AB course is just a repetition of High School.

[jontyboy]

A.D.M.U. - Another Di Makalusot sa UPCAT

Well it figures - Ateneans can only absorb easy AB college courses.

Medicine, Engineering, Accounting, etc. are way too hard for them to comprehend.

[bughaw]

:) whatever.

[claptonn]

Frankly because Ateneo's educational expertise is very limited.

[bugsbunny]

Originally posted by karadon:

Why can't Ateneo offer Medicine, Engineering, Accounting, Pharmacy, Nursing, Physical Therapy, Statistics, Architecture, Music, Fine Arts, Dentistry, etc.



well siguro kasi Ateneo is a school of Arts and Sciences at dagdagan mo na rin ng business... but for your information, merong Fine Arts Dept ang Ateneo, although walang Department of Music...ok? :)

[atenistangatenista]

for your info, a lot of the top universities in this world - like Harvard and Oxford - dont offer science courses at the undergrad level. they just mainly offer what you call AB courses. and their grads are awfully great! although they dont learn everything in college, its a great background for their masters degree. and even without a masters degree, any AB course would be good enough for them to get hired! there is NO college business and engineering course in Harvard!!! maybe just a few subjects, but deffinitely not a major! :p :p :p :p :p :p :p :p :p

[atenistangatenista]

just to clarify what i said above: they do have science courses... as in bio, physics, math.. those things. but they dont have engineering and business.

[§ínned™]

atenistangatenista,

For your information, Harvard has Business, Medicine, Dental, Design (where Architecture is) school.

§inned™

[tr|n|ty]

in fairness to Ateneo, liberal arts education AKA AB courses are the root of a lot of studies...Most Ivy League schools are purely liberal arts schools when it comes to their undergrad level. Most liberal arts majors are highly encouraged to pursue graduate school.

and Mr.atenistangatenista, you are right to say that there is no business undergrad majors in Harvard but for your information, Harvard has an Engineering Sciences school which offers both the AB and SB in engineering: Biomedical Sciences and Engineering; Electrical, Computer and Systems Engineering; Environmental Sciences and Engineering; and Mechanical and Materials Sciences and Engineering. In fact, my best friend got accepted to their ELectriacl Engineering program but she turned it down for Stanford. For more info, go to their website http://www.deas.harvard.edu/undergraduate/engineering_sciences/index.html

As much as I have a high regard for the Ateneo and the jesuit education (i do go to a jesuit university), your defense for your school and its courses lack research and fact.


[This message has been edited by tr|n|ty (edited 04-23-2000).]

[atenistangatenista]

sinned and trinity: yung business and medicine niya are just in in the graduate school level. walang business course ang harvard for college studentts

[tr|n|ty]

Originally posted by atenistangatenista:
sinned and trinity: yung business and medicine niya are just in in the graduate school level. walang business course ang harvard for college studentts

i did not question the business degree of harvard only given to graduate students. Case in point:
Originally posted by tr|n|ty:
and Mr.atenistangatenista, you are right to say that there is no business undergrad majors in Harvard

i was partaining to the engineering argument.
check this out:
Originally posted by atenistangatenista:
there is NO college business and engineering course in Harvard!!! maybe just a few subjects, but deffinitely not a major!

And my retort to that part was in my last post.


[This message has been edited by tr|n|ty (edited 04-23-2000).]

[tr|n|ty]

Originally posted by atenistangatenista:
sinned and trinity: yung business and medicine niya are just in in the graduate school level.

and tell me, where in the world and what university has a med school for undergrad level? I may not have heard of any but i am quite sure that even if Ateneo had one, it would also be on the graduate level just like any other university that i know of. Even UP Manila's Intarmed has a two-year undergrad course before entering PGH.

[zyxw]

What the hell are you talking about???
Ateneo has...
BS biology
BS Management Engineering
BS Computer Science
BS management
BS commtech
BS MIS
BS physics
BS MAC
BS physics with computer engineering
BS etc... dami pa

Before you guys start writing things, better make sure you know what you are talking about

[lorenzo]

AB courses to me are just a repetition of High School.

I agree that those with no aptitude for Math or Science end up taking the easiest college course an AB course.

[neth_row]

nde ah....may BS courses din ang ateneo....

[hard_guy00]

may bs courses nga naman. may "engineering" pa nga daw, eh. pero and pagturo ay hindi kasing hirap ng pagturo ng science sa up, mapua at ust. bukod doon, talagang iwas ang ateneo sa pag-turo ng kursong nangangailangan ng board exam (law nga lang ang pinag-hihirapan nila). nakakahiya ang isang atenistang bagsak sa board ng ce o cpa!!

[unified_theory]

Excuse me, but Ateneo spend alot of money in buying several chemistry facilities, actually three to four of their buildings are just for Chemistry alone... one for Physics and two for Biology....

[hard_guy00]

unified,

so what if they have buildings? up already has too many buildings for the sciences. it even has its own rainforest for pete's sake (the dominant fauna is homo sapiens transciens --squatters).

[unified_theory]

hard_guy>> I understand if you are that sooooo proud of your school... pero please lang kung gusto mong ipagmalaki ang paaralan mo, go ahead and make a thread, o kaya doon ka na lang magpost sa "Up is the only university..." whatsoever. PARE, WALA KA NANG GINAWA KUNDI IPAGMALAKI ANG PAARALAN MO ...UP TO EXTENT THAT YOU ARE OFF-TOPIC ALREADY, nakakairita na. Ang pinag-uusapan dito ay kung totoong puro AB course lang ang ino-offer ng Ateneo. Sa mga oras na narito kami sa thread na ito, Ateno ang concern namin at WALA KAMING PAKIALAM KUNG ANO ANG MERON O WALA SA U.P.

[hard_guy00]

unified,

dahil sa sobrong bagal ng mga utak ninyo, hindi parin ninyo napupulot ang sagot hangang ngayon. oo may bs courses nga sa ateneo.

o, mayroon pa bang dapat pag-usapan sa napakagaling na thread na ito?

[LaTtE`M]

unified_theory,

Huwag mo nang sayangin ang panahon mo kung aawayin mo lang si hardguy00. Ireserba mo na lang yan para sa quantum mech 2 natin next term. Mas magaling ka namang magsolve ng Schrodinger equation problems kaysa sa amin eh. Better yet, si Bornilla na lang ang iharap natin kay hardguy... wahehehe.

[l'ange]

I don't want to get into the school wars happening here. But, I just have to react on the way this thread's subject was worded:

ADMU - AB courses lang ang kayang i-offer?

Bakit ba kailangang i-lang-lang ang mga AB courses? AB and BS... they are two different disciplines. BS may be harder in the sense that it's technical. But, AB has its own character and difficulty quite different from BS courses. That BS courses people comment that it's not has hard as their subjects is to miss the point: precisely that's their course. AB has another pedagogy.

Sige na, I'm an AB Philosophy major graduate. I have friends who were in BS courses of varied fields... and I do respect their discipline of trying to be accurate, scientific, precise, etc. But, they do also respect my course's attempt at a wholistic understanding of the world. Can't we just keep it that way?

[hard_guy00]

latteM,

since when was a lasallite considered equal to a up-grad?

[unified_theory]

Yeah latteM you're correct, thiss guy isn't worth of my, so is anyone else's attention.... but do you have any idea where are these "lasallites" he is talking about studying.

[hard_guy00]

...lasallian or lasallite or crocodillians...

geez, they're dumber than i thought. they can't even find their own school campus.

[Lek-Lek]

i really don't understand why some people here hate ateneo and la salle very much. when in fact, these two great educational institutions have done so much in contribution to nation-building as well as the uplifting of the status of the Philippine educational system. hmmmmmm, i guess, some peeps here are just plain pathetic psychos...*sigh*

[hard_guy00]

lek-lek,

your first statement was the most definitive: "I CANNOT UNDERSTAND..." no those two schools have not done anything to uplift the country's educational system, other than to unleash a bunch of mediocre professionals in makati. no private school can have an impact on philippine education.

when the psycho with the knife sneaks up on you while you're in the shower, we'll see who's pathetic. you must really be hung up on that lasallian, aren't you?

[Lek-Lek]

O really? well, to tell you, only one Philippine University won first place at that contest sponsored by Hewlett-Packard in Singapore: Ateneo de Manila University.
Well, have you done that? And why do you claim that we're mediocres? Look at what happened in those business competitions like FINEX Finance Competition and PANA Marketing Communications Contest, Ateneo won it. In FINEX, UP only placed third. DLSU even beat your schoolmates! Now, who's mediocre??? You pathetic idiot! Loser!

[LaTtE`M]

Originally posted by hard_guy00
latteM,

since when was a lasallite considered equal to a up-grad?

When the person got his BS, MS, and PhD in Physics form UP Diliman. Simple answer for a stupid question.

[unified_theory]

LaTtE`M at Lek-Lek>> Huwag na nating pansin ang nilalang iyan sapagkat mas mababang uri siya sa atin. He derives his pleasure from catching the attentions of being superior to him.

l'ange>> Sa palagay ko, hindi pangmamaliit ang ibig sabihin ng "lang". Kasi yung ibang school, may BS at may AB, ngayon nung sinabing AB lang, ibig sabihin "isa klase lang" ng mga courses ang meron. It's due to quantity and not because BS is considered higher level that AB, or the other way around.

------

But I am certain UP have B.S. courses, I've seen their facilities since I was in Grade 3.

[f@de]

to jontyboy:

*** do u mean about Another Di Makalusot sa UPCAT?! for your info, i took UPCAT and ACET. i passed both exams and, for me, ACET was even more challenging than UPCAT! passing both exams placed me in the position to choose bet ateneo and up. i chose ateneo because it's a highly better school than up!
baka sinasabi mong Another Di Makalusot sa UPCAT kasi frustrated ka dahil UPCAT lang ang napasa mo!

[hard_guy00]

to the girl with the cute name,

stay cute because that's all you'll ever be. about that contest in singapore, ONLY ONE CONTESTANT CAN WIN FIRST PLACE, unless you allow ties.

the trouble with people who don't know how to analyze is, they argue nevertheless. you won one or a couple of contests in one year. SO??? you're still mediocre. your archaic system is bent on maintaining the concept of an elite population with the sole purpose of governing and educating the "natives". just how relevant is your theology and all those other subjects through which your school continues to purvey the christian stupidity?

contribution to philippine education indeed. your brand of education is poor reason to squander one's hard-earned money. you know what makes me sad? it's the quality of private school grads who work in makati. no change in sight there. you're scheduled to graduate in a few years. it'll be your turn to mess up our economy.

[Lek-Lek]

Hard guy: I've long been wanting to say this. I suggest, that before treating schools like DLSU and ADMU, you better research about your own UP first! You talk like as if UP is the best, that it can stand on its own feet, that other schools are merely inferior to your beloved Alma Mater. Now here is what I have to say.

UP's Institute of Chemistry schedules its students at the Ateneo's Philippine Institute of Pure and Applied Chemistry just to use our Nuclear Magnetic Resonance which your school cannot afford! Well, if you think that you're totally good, better think twice, coz definitely, UP also depends on the Ateneo when it comes to Chemistry. What do you think will happen to your Chem majors if ever Ateneo's PIPAC refuses to let them use our NMR? With the way you talk about Ateneo, it seems like you are overlooking some facts which you do not know about your own school. =)

Secondly, your thesis about that mining site in Benguet is so cheap! It's totally inferior to the thesis which some of my dorm mates are working on right now. How much was the budget of your thesis? My dorm mates totally just can't help it but laugh at your thesis. Now, who's mediocre? Wait till you hear from Acolyte. He's a science major, and he has a lot of things more to say about your Alma Mater.

I really am not so inclined to say these things coz I have a lot of respect for my friends in UP. But it seems like, its time for UP people like you to start waking up from your dreams!!!

To LaTtE`M and unified_theory, never succumb to this guy. He needs a lesson. He seems to be in a delusion regarding his school, that's why I took the initiative of waking him up.

[pyket]

what the?

[Edited by pyket on 12-18-2000 at 04:42 PM]

[pyket]

leklek: honestly hindi ko maintindihan kung bakit ka na-offend sa thread ko. Is it because I touched a nerve? "If you are indeed an Atenean, like what you're claiming in your post..." What makes me so suspicious? The fact that no Atenean will dare question the education he or she is receiving? Binasa mo ba talaga yung post ko? I-conceded to the fact that there are people that claim that Th121, 131, 141, 151 and the other Philo subjects made their mark when they left college. Sorry kung na-o-offend ka sa "ignorance" ko as a sophomore nga "lang". Hindi pa po ako nag Theo of Lib kay Ma'am Astorga, oo. Hindi ko pa linulundag si Fr. Ferriols, bebe. Hindi pa ako sinasarhan ng pintuan ni Fr. Dacanay pag nag-bell. I never claimed my statements as the absolute truth. I believe that every student has a right to question the education he or she is receiving. And so, I do mine.

Okay sana ang Theo at Philo eh. I was looking forward to Philo pa naman. Pero ang lagay nawawalan na ng focus which one should supposedly receive sa college. Para lang yang floodlights eh. Malawak nga ang radius ng ilaw mo, pero wide nga. Kulang ng focus. (Again, sasabihin kong para sa akin.) I am not getting the training and the focus I want in my discipline because I'm too busy studying for a multitude of other subjects. Out of my 60 subjects, 17 lang ang devoted to psychology at 27 ang core ko (I included my Ma11 and 12). Hindi naman 'ata fair, di ba? I want direction in my education. Although again, I will concede that the Ateneo does have advantages with its focus in the humanities. For people like me who know what they want to do, and where they want to go --- especially in psychology --- I think the Ateneo lags behind. Sorry if I offended you with my thoughts regarding MY education and MY direction in my discipline.

at btw, wala akong nakikitang handouts ng PIPAC at all. And I have talked to Ateneo graduates (been surrounded by them all my life: grade school, high school) and some of them do agree with you na doon nga raw "bumabawi" ang Ateneo --- sa Theo at Philo. But then again, there are some people who honestly feel that wala silang napala sa Theo at Philo. To each his own naman, di ba? The personalities of the holistic thrust and the actual student just may or may not jive. Simple lang naman, right? To each his own pare...

[hard_guy00]

ek ek,

nuclear magnetic resonance____ what? imaging? a spectrophotometer? or a nanometer perhaps? are you sure you know what you're describing? i'm not going to list the material, equipment and research programs in up-dil that are holotypic within the philippines. maybe you like to split hairs but that's not my style. i'll toss you this much: there are only two working supercomputers in the philippines. one is with the phil. gov't. the other is in up-diliman.

good, you bothered to read the thesis thread. i'm pretty sure you and your room-mates don't know what enargite is. i'm pretty sure neither you nor anyone else in your god-loving school knows a whit about the earth sciences. anyway, i was paid Php 750K for that study (way back in 1992). your laughter sounds like blissful ignorance to me.

why don't you teach me something new? somehting closer to your specialty? what's the best way to blond one's hair? which one's better, globe or smart? how many of your friends and relative watch national geographic on cable (this could be a null question since you'remost likely to dwell in cinemax, hallmark and cnns)?

want a real initiating action? study your basic algebra and statistics. they're a lot more relevant than theology of reading the american state papers.

[pyket]

several points:

To answer one of the original questions about fine arts: he Fine Arts Department of the Ateneo has one of the newest (obviously most dynamic) Theatre Arts Programs aside from their Creative Writing program. They have some of the best teachers in the country: Ricardo Abad, Badong Bernal, Shoko Matsumoto, Olga Natividad (tama ba yon?), and the famed Batoktoy (tama rin ba yung spelling non?). I'm sure marami pang idedevelop si Dr. Abad sa program nila sa Theatre, Writing at malamang dance/movement.

The Ateneo in cooperation with Meralco and the Medical City is gearing up for to build The New Medical City sa tapat ng Valle Verde 6 at Meralco. This will be the home of the new medical programs (medtech, medicine, among others), as well as research bases for the university.


I don't make it a habit of bringing my school up, or over-emphasizing whatever edge we have over other schools. The Ateneo is far from perfect, I must admit. There are slackers, there are people who got in for their money. There are worthless graduates. There are people who you hoped would never graduate, but did LIKE ANY OTHER SCHOOL be it UP, La Salle, UST, or whatever. I think any person who refuses to realize this simple fact and insists on highlighting the "walang kwenta graduates" of other schools without realizing his own alma mater's is downright self-righteous and naivette.

My honest opinion: if UP had the Ateneo's resources at hindi cinut ng pangulo ang budget, UP would be able to offer so much more, undoubtably. If Ateneo had UP's drive to enter research, undoubtably ang laking ganda rin ng Ateneo. But both schools (as well as others) need to realize that they must remain dynamic. They must consistently update and renew their programs in light of current trends.

I am a sophomore BS Psychology major at the Ateneo. Although I love my Alma Mater, I am not entirely pleased with the rather "holistic" psychology program of the Ateneo. I agree that some people find the need for Theology and Philosophy (some really do). But I agree that this thrust does not work for people like me who know what they want to do. It's a waste of time and money for me. (Again, I reiterate, for people LIKE ME; this is not true for the entire populace.) But UP's program isn't as good as well. It's just a known fact that psychology isn't really that good a course in the Philippines. (I'm moving to Australia to pursue my degree there.)

The Sciences at the Ateneo (I mean Biology, Chemistry and Physics) need a lot more improvement and investment. I have no right to talk about the Chem and Physics Depts. because I haven't really seen that much of the Physics Dept. I haven't been permitted to see other facilities sa Chem Dept. since lower chem pa lang ako --- pero as mentioned earlier, PIPAC (which is merely housed in Ateneo; it's not Ateneo's, I think) is there for the Ateneo Chem Majors, so medyo feel ko na okay ang status ng chem. Sa Bio naman, kulang na kulang ata ng facilities available for the undergrads. Balita ko yung electron microscope ay hindi pa raw pwede gamitin ng undergrads.

The Ateneo lacks equipment and facilities for such courses --- in spite of the money we have. I will admit that. And most every Atenean will yield to that. Pero the problem really is the system, not the students. We have quality graduates, of course. EVERY SCHOOL HAS THEM. Hindi sa hindi kaya ng mga studyante, hindi lang pinapapasok sa sistema. (At please, hindi dahil alam ng administration na hindi kaya ng mga studyante.)

UP I know has it's own faults. The endless bureaucracy, the freeloading students, the dropouts, the slackers. My brother is a BS Bio graduate of UP and I'm privilege to know about the stories that go on about the students, faculty and administrators. So I definitely think that (though it may be falacious to state such) any one in UP is not in a position to make a comparison. As is true with anyone from Ateneo.

1) It's off-topic talaga dahil hindi ito pagalingan ng unibersidad; at

2) Tinatanong lang kung bakit hindi nag-o-offer ng med and the like ang Ateneo.

[hard_guy00]

pyket,

very good. in one entry you settled the basic conflict in this mind-boggling thread. as for those who can't even stick to the topic, pay them no heed. i suppose a person needs to reach out and be heard. there's an underlying force that drives people to argue endlessly in such a benign medium as the internet. that force is sex. hope a budding psychologist like you will appreciate that.

and to my beloved cutie who has given my life new meaning these past few weeks, heed the youngster's words. your laboratories have the same problems as up's. the phenomenon of non-usable lab equipment in supposedly well-appointed schools like admu has been around since rizal's day (i think it's described in the "fili" in the chapter describing placido penitente).

[pyket]

leklek: honestly hindi ko maintindihan kung bakit ka na-offend sa thread ko. Is it because I touched a nerve? "If you are indeed an Atenean, like what you're claiming in your post..." What makes me so suspicious? The fact that no Atenean will dare question the education he or she is receiving? Binasa mo ba talaga yung post ko? I-conceded to the fact that there are people that claim that Th121, 131, 141, 151 and the other Philo subjects made their mark when they left college. Sorry kung na-o-offend ka sa "ignorance" ko as a sophomore nga "lang". Hindi pa po ako nag Theo of Lib kay Ma'am Astorga, oo. Hindi ko pa linulundag si Fr. Ferriols, bebe. Hindi pa ako sinasarhan ng pintuan ni Fr. Dacanay pag nag-bell. I never claimed my statements as the absolute truth. I believe that every student has a right to question the education he or she is receiving. And so, I do mine.

Okay sana ang Theo at Philo eh. I was looking forward to Philo pa naman. Pero ang lagay nawawalan na ng focus which one should supposedly receive sa college. Para lang yang floodlights eh. Malawak nga ang radius ng ilaw mo, pero wide nga. Kulang ng focus. (Again, sasabihin kong para sa akin.) I am not getting the training and the focus I want in my discipline because I'm too busy studying for a multitude of other subjects. Out of my 60 subjects, 17 lang ang devoted to psychology at 27 ang core ko (I included my Ma11 and 12). Hindi naman 'ata fair, di ba? I want direction in my education. Although again, I will concede that the Ateneo does have advantages with its focus in the humanities. For people like me who know what they want to do, and where they want to go --- especially in psychology --- I think the Ateneo lags behind. Sorry if I offended you with my thoughts regarding MY education and MY direction in my discipline.

at btw, wala akong nakikitang handouts ng PIPAC at all. And I have talked to Ateneo graduates (been surrounded by them all my life: grade school, high school) and some of them do agree with you na doon nga raw "bumabawi" ang Ateneo --- sa Theo at Philo. But then again, there are some people who honestly feel that wala silang napala sa Theo at Philo. To each his own naman, di ba? The personalities of the holistic thrust and the actual student just may or may not jive. Simple lang naman, right? To each his own pare...

[Lek-Lek]

Hard_guy: Yeah, you heard me right. Nuclear Magnetic Resonance, used mainly by Chemistry majors. And that is precisely what your co-UPians are running after. They schedule themselves at PIPAC in order to use it. Even if I am not a science major, I know it since my teacher in NatSci told us in class(by the way, that teacher is a Phd in Chemistry degree holder from Princeton University) that UP borrows our NMR. There is no fourth word. It is just nuclear magnetic resonance, seems like your scientifically inclined mind does't not recognize such a word, right? Well, better yet, ponder on reading those volumes of encyclopedia which you claim to have read twice! Seems like they are inadequate, aren't they?

Second point, why the heck will you have to say about those two super computers being with the Phil gov't and UP? Don't you think that its useless for you to make a distinction between UP and the Phil gov't? It is precisely because UP is ALSO the gov't! Running because of the taxes paid by the Filipinos, including those whom you are accusing of sending their children to Ateneo and La Salle.

To pyket: The PIPAC is owned by the Ateneo. If you noticed, the handouts from PIPAC insdicate so. Thus, PIPAC's act of placing "Ateneo de Manila University" below "Philippine Institute of Pure and Applied Sciences", is an indication that Ateneo owns it. My teacher in Chemistry also said so in class as well as other Chem majors.
As for you not liking Ateneo's core curriculum, then you should have transferred to other schools already. You're just a sophomore, so you should have done it right after finishing freshman year since whether you like it or not, you will have to take 12 units of Theology and 12 units of Philosophy. And since you're just a sophomore, perhaps you haven't felt the impact of Ateneo's Humanities thrust, but then, talk to Ateneo graduates and ask them what has influenced them a lot in their college life and they will only say :Theology and Philosophy.

If you are indeed an Atenean, like what you're claiming in your post, then, I believe that once teachers like Fr. Roque Ferriols, Dr. Manuel Dy, Dr. Leovino Ma. Garcia, Dr. Christina Astorga, Fr. Adolfo Dacanay and all the other Pedagogues of the School of Humanities, you will realize the value of Ateneo's core curriculum. But then, like what I have said, if you don't appreciate it, then transfer since you have no reason to stay any longer in Ateneo, after all, as you've said, you're moving to Australia.

[hard_guy00]

you know what makes this thing boring? it's when we go into details as to what's the hottest new machine around, where it's at, etc. so much for holistic thought. well, admu students go to up-nsri just to peek through the 40-inch reflecting telescope even though admu has it's own observatory. they even requested to have certain specimens thin-sectioned for our polarizing microscopes. turns out admu doesn't have enough of those. anything else?

the next time you talk to that princeton guy, ask him to distinguish between a state university and a department of the national government. if it takes the tax money of 20 million filipinos to buy a couple of supercomputers, then there must be something wrong with the private sector. three possibilities: not enough funds, not enough demand or de-emphasis (the third is the most probable). so, the centuries-old rantings of bacon, more, aquinas and magnus are more important than increased computing power. i'll allow that.

bravo to your list of selected pedagogues. they were finally enlightened on a subject that has been settled, in large part, one century before vatican 2. entering the ateneo must be quite an experience. you go back to the 15th century each time.

[blue babe]

:lol: buhay pa ba tong thread na to?

funny... no matter how smart some people think they are, they're just missing the whole point. there is no "best" university. each one has its strength and corresponding weak point. its just up to the student to figure out which school is best for him or her, depending on the course he or she wants to take, or how he or she is as a person.


someone was describing the ateneo education as lacking focus. maybe, for somebody like you, the atenean education comes up short. siguro nga, di mo kailangan lumangoy sa mga katanungan ng pagmemeron. o siguro, kapag dumating ang panahon na bagsakan ka ng pinto ni fr. dacs matapos tumunog ang bell, walang malaking pagbabagong mangyayari sa iyo. siguro, hindi rin angkop ang lib theo at ang hangaring pagmumulat mata sa atenista na ibig iparating nito. i.e., maybe the ateneo education isn't for you. it isn't made for everyone.

like someone else here mentioned already, there are people like me who have taken the upcat and the acet, and passed both (thank god for that) and ended up with the ateneo. no regrets here. i also took the lae and the ateneo law school entrance exam. passed both too. even up's freaky interview. but i ended up in the ateneo law school. not because one is better than the other (although, in the recent years, the bar passing average can speak for itself), but because i've learned that the ateneo education is for me, with the photomegaspectrometer in PIPAC or without it.

point is, there is no point in discussing which school is better. kasi wala namang kasagutan yan eh.

hard: question lang, pinasa mo ba ang acet?

[of_fire_and_ice]

okay lang namang maging proud sa school mo, pero kailangan bang laitin ang ibang school?!?!?!

[rao]

Originally posted by Lek-Lek
Hard_guy: Yeah, you heard me right. Nuclear Magnetic Resonance, used mainly by Chemistry majors. And that is precisely what your co-UPians are running after. They schedule themselves at PIPAC in order to use it.

Lek-lek, Ateneo doesn't own the NMR housed at PIPAC. The Philippine government does. Ateneo is just taking care of it. Anyway, Chemistry is dead. It died when quantum mechanics explained it.

[LaTtE`M]

Originally posted by rao
Originally posted by Lek-Lek
Hard_guy: Yeah, you heard me right. Nuclear Magnetic Resonance, used mainly by Chemistry majors. And that is precisely what your co-UPians are running after. They schedule themselves at PIPAC in order to use it.

Lek-lek, Ateneo doesn't own the NMR housed at PIPAC. The Philippine government does. Ateneo is just taking care of it. Anyway, Chemistry is dead. It died when quantum mechanics explained it.

Umm rao... Chemistry isn't dead yet:

1> It's easier to understand than quantum mechanics, and so easier to learn

2> Despite its much simpler structure than quantum mechanics, it is effective anyway

3> Quantum mechanics is still an incomplete theory. Even Einstein was against it because of the "collapsibility phenomenon" of the wave function phi.

If I were to choose between Chemistry and Quantum Mechanics, I'd choose Chemistry!

Hmmm... I think we need another thread for that argument.

[hard_guy00]

blue babe,

i didn't take the acet. i saw no reason to. most of my friends and one sibling who failed the upcat went to ateneo. nuff said about the acet.

latteM and rao,

i'd prefer thermodynamics to both QM and chem. it's a centuries-old science but it's still the most realistic. maybe we should open a new thread. don't snowball AB people with all this science business.

[rao]

[QUOTE

3> Quantum mechanics is still an incomplete theory. [/QUOTE]


That's why it is still alive.

Chemistry - dead

no more limits to push.

Physics explains Chemistry

if you are a Chem guy, jump ship

[rao]

Originally posted by hard_guy00
. well, admu students go to up-nsri just to peek through the 40-inch reflecting telescope even though admu has it's own observatory.

Ther is no 40 inch reflector in the Philippines. The biggest is under 30. 20 or 26 inch yata. Housed in ISMED, donated by the Japanese.

[rao]

Originally posted by hard_guy00

latteM and rao,

i'd prefer thermodynamics to both QM and chem. it's a centuries-old science but it's still the most realistic. maybe we should open a new thread. don't snowball AB people with all this science business.

Thermo and chem will never be able to explain things like tunneling.

[rao]

Originally posted by LaTtE`M

1> It's easier to understand than quantum mechanics, and so easier to learn

.

I agree, quantum mechanics is not for everyone. The Math is gory. Did you have a hard time with it?

[hard_guy00]

rao,

quantum mechanics can't build better engines, stronger glues and prettier baby clones.

re: the ismed reflector,

thanks for the correction. by the way, how are the other telescopes in diliman (like the one near home economics and the one in engineering)?

[betsy]

hey hard guy, if UP is so great, then why are your graduates becoming communists, NPAs and the like. Is that the price of an education in UP?

[hard_guy00]

betsy,

yes. because over-priveleged pigs in our society continue to exploit the proletariat. for as long as they are in power, the intelligentia will continue to focus its enery towards dismantling the economic pyramid and destroying purveyors of western stupidity (read: catholic schools).

[rao]

Originally posted by hard_guy00
rao,

quantum mechanics can't build better engines, stronger glues and prettier baby clones.



quantum mechanics makes characterization of semicon devices easier.also, as you pack more transistors into a chip you'll have to take into account quantum effects. without semicon devices, no electronic fuel injectors, no microprocessors, no dsp chips, no digital cellular phones, no internet, no PEX. boo hooo

Worse than having no chickenjoy :-)

who needs clones? the philippines, india, and china are bursting at the seams.


re: telescopes

I dont know about the one at the college of engineering. The one at PAGASA is still alive. Yong nasa dome maliit lang, around 6 inches ang aperture (refractor). Merong bago ang PAGASA, MEADE yata, with automatic controls, you'll just have to punch in the declination and right ascension and voila! kita mo na kaagad. automatic din ang tracking. Ive seen it, siguro mga 12 inches ang aperture. Maiksi lang ang tube kaya definitely it's a Schmidt-Cassegrain. Pwede pa raw kabitan ng CCD's.

[Pan de Monay]

rao: I needed that explanation. I've been wondering all this time what quantum mechanics is useful for other than for studying the behavior of subatomic particles. May application pala siya sa IT. :D

Regarding the telescope with configurable RA/Dec., I saw a Natural Wonders ad for a consumer-level hobbyist telescope that can do that too! You enter your current latitude and longitude, then Right Ascencion and Declination, and it'll point there. It even has preset locations in the sky (i.e. stars, galaxies and NGC objects) you can point it at. (I think I'm going off topic. :D Sorry!)

[blue babe]

hard:
so you never took the acet. so how can you say with such authority which school is better? you don't even have a first hand experience of their respective entrance exams, let alone the teaching styles and the level of education being offered by either institution.

me? ive taken 2 entrance exams in each institution. and i passed ALL of them. and I can TELL you with first hand, direct information that between the two schools, mas mahirap ang ENTRANCE exams ng ateneo. by far. but then again, that's only the entrance exam.

as far as law school goes, in my freshman batch, after the first sem, almost half of the batch got kicked out. some of them transferred, with a clean slate, i.e., no subject credited, as if they never attended that first sem in ateneo law school, to ust, some to up. and from what they've been telling me, up law school is a walk in the park compared to the torture we endure in the ateneo. if i use the same line of reasoning as you, i'd say, "nuff said about the up school of law". but i won't.

nuff for me to say that for people like me, ateneo education is optimal. for others, up is the way to go. there is no "best" school anywhere. there are only those blinded by idiotic school pride that claim so. grow up. :D

[brownpau]

Oo nga. I took both entrance exams, for UP and Ateneo, and the Ateneo one was really hard! Passed both, did better in UP, but I opted for Ateneo anyway. Family tradition. :D

[rao]

Originally posted by Pan de Monay
rao: I needed that explanation. I've been wondering all this time what quantum mechanics is useful for other than for studying the behavior of subatomic particles. May application pala siya sa IT. :D



Bah, pag kay Doc A. ka nag EEE 41/EE 25, puro quantum mechanics pag uusapan nyo doon

[rao]

Originally posted by Pan de Monay
rao:
Regarding the telescope with configurable RA/Dec., I saw a Natural Wonders ad for a consumer-level hobbyist telescope that can do that too! You enter your current latitude and longitude, then Right Ascencion and Declination, and it'll point there. It even has preset locations in the sky (i.e. stars, galaxies and NGC objects) you can point it at. (I think I'm going off topic. :D Sorry!)

telescopes with auto controls are becoming commonplace these days. used to be only outfits like the W. M. Keck Foundation could afford auto controls. and how is that possible? microprocessors, and of course, quantum mechanics :-)

[LaTtE`M]

Originally posted by rao
Originally posted by Pan de Monay
rao:
Regarding the telescope with configurable RA/Dec., I saw a Natural Wonders ad for a consumer-level hobbyist telescope that can do that too! You enter your current latitude and longitude, then Right Ascencion and Declination, and it'll point there. It even has preset locations in the sky (i.e. stars, galaxies and NGC objects) you can point it at. (I think I'm going off topic. :D Sorry!)

telescopes with auto controls are becoming commonplace these days. used to be only outfits like the W. M. Keck Foundation could afford auto controls. and how is that possible? microprocessors, and of course, quantum mechanics :-)

You're really hyped about the tunnelling effect arent you man? :p: You're right... I do hate the math part of quantum! Gory is an understatement. Buti na lang hindi ko kinuha yung BS Physics with Comp. Engg. sa Ateneo... hehehehe. Dun ako pumasa eh! (for harduy00: Pumasa rin akong UPCAT)

[pafrapafra]

Originally posted by lorenzo
AB courses to me are just a repetition of High School.

I agree that those with no aptitude for Math or Science end up taking the easiest college course an AB course.

excuse me, mr lorenzo, but you undermine AB students. fyi, there are merit scholars (top 10% of ACET takers) enrolled in AB courses. i take up AB IS and i am a merit scholar. and for those people who keep on saying that people only go to the ateneo because they failed the upcat, enough already. i passed for enrollment in occupational therapy in up manila but opted to go to ateneo. i'll say the acet was harder because of the time pressure. whether which test asked harder questions is debatable.

[hard_guy00]

pafra-pafra,

you get a gold medal for being the only one who remembered to stick to the topic. no, i have no problems with AB people. some of our brightest peeps are "real" ab guys, not merely pre-law students.

matagal na rin pero i hate to leave a message unanswered.

blue babe,

if you run through the thread asking people which entrance test was the hardest, you will see that nearly every one agreed it was the acet. now, the crucial question: which is harder to pass? babe, there's a universe of a difference between those two questions. you're using the wrong arguments, madame lawyer! as i have said, most of the peeps i know who found the upcat easy (but failed it, nevertheless) went to admu (even though the acet, they say, was harder). personally, the course i wanted was offered in only two colleges: up and mapua. i had a far harder time with the mapua exam. but i scored in the top 100, thank you. my score in up? never mind. at least i passed it.

p.s.: i hear some parents of ateneo hs grads are suing the hs because their kids flunked the upcat. what's wrong with sending their kids to ateneo college? i thought it was a good school. as good as up, according to many.

[blue babe]

hard:

granted that is true, at least with the college. but a lot of people also concede the fact that it is much harder to STAY in the ateneo than in up. a lot of people i know have ended up as "floaters" without really a course for a long time. you simply can't do that in the ateneo. its either you pass, or you get kicked out.

as for the law school, maybe you missed the second half of my post. look it up. :D

[hard_guy00]

babe,

i'm not a lawyer but i've know many lawyers from both schools. neither claimed one was easier to enter or be graduated from than the other. both agreed law school was tough and the attrition rate can leave both survivors and flunkies scarred for life.

what about the claim by lasallians that the dlsucet was easier but staying in dlsu was a lot tougher than in admu. as for up, you obviously don't know enough graduates from courses like math, physics, engineering and medicine. tell me, have you ever enrolled in a math or science class wherein you start out with 40 and finish the sem with only 5 students? sad to say, the vast majority of ateneans i know believe the universe has law at the center with courses like philo, pol sci, economics and theology orbiting around it.

on thing you should know: up pioneered the qpi and dq system for maintaining academic standards. private schools followed suit soon after.

[francisd]

It is hard to compare the two schools since UP has a lot of technical courses. Ateneo only has a handful.

My best friend who graduated compsci from UP-Diliman told me some horror stories in engineering.

----------
No need to quote since your reply is directly underneath the post you're quoting

[Edited by uptowngirl on 01-07-2001 at 07:43 PM]

[blue babe]

okay. you're not a lawyer right? neither am i, yet. but i have had the privelege of sitting in some up classes. and i can tell you, that with regard to the way their classes are conducted, ateneo's classes are much harder. and our grades are at least 1/3 recitation.

i do not claim that either school is better than the other. in fact, my previous posts have always maintained that it really all depends on the student. one system of teaching may be better for one kind of student than the other. we just have to be careful in choosing which institution to attend.

if you won't accept my first hand experience based explanation, then i guess this should all just end here. no amount of explanation on my part will ever convince you that up is NOT better than the ateneo. if you really feel that way and refuse to even open your eyes to this reality, then the up education FAILED in your case. nuff said about that

[hard_guy00]

beloved blue babe,

yes, i agree up failed in a lot of aspects concerning yours truly. now, i noticed that ateneo students and graduates alike have a penchant for arguing soley on the basis of personal experience, not by any deductive means. in that respect, ateneo education is not a failure. it's just doings things wrongly.

when will those priests decide to move out from the 15th century?

[jdee_xis]

...mahahaba yung posts...before anything else, I'd like to apologize for the following:

...repetition of the essence of any other posts if there may be any (since I didn't read through the thread)and

...improper...uhummm better yet NO sentence structures
-yun lang naman: T.Y.( and pahabol...anything I overlooked in criticizing my post)



I think that they're trying to focus more on business courses, doon pa nga lang they seem to be having a hard time getting teachers...(for reasons like: other schools pay tons more in terms of salary-that's what some teachers claim, they can't finish higher levels of education while teaching, and others), also I think the administration is experementing with the system...there have been changes going on in terms of students' load etc.,

but anyway, the ADMU has only recently separated the colleges... humanities, business, and...(I'm not sure about the titles) maybe you'll see some developments regarding your query...baka masyado lang naniniguro ang administration na once nilabas nila yung mga tipong kurso na well established na sa mga eskwelahang tulad ng Unibersidad ng Pilipinas ay maaari silang tumakbo at par or perhaps better than the other colleges...that perhaps is what they expect of themselves...

katulad sa UST...yeah they have all the science courses but even the UST students themselves say that AB courses in UST are kinda...I dunno the word...let's just say, if you are studying in UST you'll only be getting the better of it if you were studying in a science course ( I don't know the extent and I don't mean to offend anyone/ even if the words are offensive..but that's what I hear)with the AB courses of other schools like ADMU, UP, LA SALLE...


Maybe you ought to write to someone from the administration, get a hold of some facts.

Anyways...the Ateneo has offered new courses a few years old, some offered only last year and some, say 3 to 4 years back.

Naisip ko din...they may also be leaning more towards the development of INterdisciplinary courses, (not that they are making a hundred percent good out of it). Maybe they have other plans. (let's just wait, hanggang sa maka graduate ka na, at magkaroon ng trabaho, mga anak at iba pa)

"JOKING ASIDE"

...bakit hindi nalang magkaroon ng branch ang UST sa Quezon City, at ang UP naman maglagay na rin ng sciences na meron lang sa UP manila diyan sa UP Dili? At ang La Salle Ilapit naman sa Ateneo?( Marami kasing programs at courses na inooffer ang Lasalle na talagang kakaiba, at kaaya-aya)

Suggestion...(ONLY IF YOUR QUERY stems from the fact that you want to be in courses such as the one's which you say the Ateneo doesn't offer)if you're entirely mad about the courses which are not offered in the Ateneo, don't look for it from them, go to the schools which are already good at them...it will seemingly take the Ateneo EONS before they come up with those colleges..can't blame them though, it is REALLY NOT A JOKE to put up such courses.


"Bawi"

...pero maganda pa rin sa Ateneo.
There's something different about it...Philo courses siguro (meron kasing growth, spiritual?, or deeper even-if such exists?)

hehehe anyways... "TO EACH HIS OWN" nalang to cap things up
and have a nice day.

[jair]

though i must admit that up is a better school for science majors, it would be unfair to ateneo to brand it as "ab lang ang kaya i-offer"...

here is a list of the non-ab courses in admu (which i think is mas marami than the ab course kaya lang mas maliit ang mga population due to high mortality rates--kick-outs)
bs math
bs applied math major in computational science
bs chem
bs chem with computer eng
bs physics
bs physics with computer eng
bs cs
bs mgt info systems
bs mgt eng
bs bio
bs environmental science (not offered in any other school)
bs mgt in applied chem
bs mgt (yes, bs course to)
bs legal mgt (m not sure pero bs yata to)
bs communications tech
fine arts
theatre arts
creative writing

(not sure if this is complete)

[jair]

i forgot to mention:
bs ece